Salt Lake:Official development news thread - Page 382

SLC Projects · #**7621** Posted **Nov 21, 2008, 9:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMTower

There is still almost a year before 222 south Main opens, I'm betting they will be just fine.

I'm sure that's true, but what I think we are all worried about is how long will it take between when 222 South opens and ground breaking of another Office Tower. We don't want there to be another 10 year gap before another office skyscraper gets built.

cololi · #**7622** Posted **Nov 21, 2008, 9:33 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by SLC Projects

I'll tell you what it is. The issue is the City and Developer waited to damn long to get any new office towers built. There has been a big demand for office space from like 2003-2007 and yet nothing was done about it. I mean even with the hot economy we had for a few years NOTHING was done about it. The best we did was built a few low-rise office buildings at the gateway. Where the hell has Wasatch Partners been? Are they ever going to develop that 30+ story office building or are they still 🞵🞵🞵🞵 hurt over that fight they got into with Rocky Anderson last year? Or What ever happen with the WTCU plan? There's just way to much talk on how we need buildings built, but nothing really gets done until this past year with CCC and 222 south main and by then it's a day late and a dollar short. The sad thing is Hamilton Partners started building 222 South Main right when the economy started to go downhill.

Demand always results in market saturation. This is what happens in every sector, whether it is housing, retail development or anything else. And this is what is happening with 222 and the new office space in City Creek. The market is saturated with these new projects and they are competing for a small number of occupants that are out there right now. CCRI and Hamilton are betting that the markets turn around within the next 12-18 months so that they can increase their leasing options. In this market, it should not be a suprise that they stall one of these projects. historic building renovations are insanely expensive and that is why most people demolish instead of renovate. I would have put the Boston Bldg. on hold as well so that they can increase their leasing rates in 222 as demand grows and also so they are no longer carrying the full construction costs of both projects. Developer expenses are always front end heavy and it is when they are the most vulnerable to market forces.

222 would not have even started if it weren't for RDA money to help build the parking, so take it easy on the City.

Job growth in Utah has not been all that great in the sectors that require class A office space. The potential occupants of Class A space have been struggling for some time. Most of them have found ways to cut back on costs and if they were growing in this market or looking to move, were looking for the lowest cost class A space. As far as the loss of space in the Key bank tower, it mostly went to the Wells Fargo Building, which had about 40% (if I remember correctly) of the leasable space available.

Comrade · #**7623** Posted **Nov 21, 2008, 11:36 PM**

As cololi said, the demand for office towers has not been there and a big reason for this is that Salt Lake hasn't really been a corporate city. Its economy is based around the high-tech industry, sales and service-oriented businesses.

There isn't a large banking industry, like you see in Charlotte. Telecommunications isn't based here, like with Denver and Qwest, or Philadelphia and Comcast.

Maybe energy will be the next big thing for Salt Lake and it brings in some towers. But the economy today is just not ideal for that type of building. It's suburban, sometimes rural and when a tower is proposed, it's generally for regional offices, local smaller businesses, hotels and sometimes, like with the LDS' plans, residential.

urbane · #**7624** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 4:50 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jedikermit

I'm STILL angry about this. Not that big business should trump small business, or anything like that, but that there could have been additional height on the main hotel, plus the 14 story tower on the corner, and it didn't ever happen, and won't ever happen because of that friggin' Flower Patch. I still glare at it every time I drive by.

They used up the ENTIRE block for one hotel. There are massive amounts of underused space on the block. The southeast corner of the block is completely void of any building. You could easily build a skyscraper there. Earl and Co. were total s#@theads about this whole thing. The Flower Patch building has vastly improved and it faces the street and sits right next to the sidewalk. More than you can say for alot of the Grand America. I think Earl owns enough downtown property as it is. The State street side of the block has no street recognition at all, all of the windows are fake and there are no useable entrances on State.

jedikermit · #**7625** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 5:04 AM**

Oh, Holding and/or Grand America were total $#!theads about the whole thing--absolutely. And I don't begrudge the Flower Patch their rights to hold out. But when that fight cost them the redevelopment money they would have been able to turn around and reinvest into the Executive Tower or the Suites, I still feel shortchanged. It's not necessarily anyone's fault, just "what could have been."

I'm still mad at Adnan Khashoggi and the Triad Center debacle too. I hold development grudges for a hella-long time.

delts145 · #**7626** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 11:39 AM**

I wonder if we should update our focus with the Holding family? It seems to me that his son and perhaps son-in-law is running the show now. He had a pretty serious stroke and is quite advanced in age. What do you guys think?

While the Grand America is a very fine hotel, I agree the Holdings should make a few additions on at least two to three sides of the block. I hate the way it interacts with 6oo south and also State. Also, the northeast and southeast corners of Main could easily be improved with some stylish street-savy additions. That bethal granite material is still very much in supply back in New England.

I wouldn't for a second want to tear down the Flower Patch, but I would be willing to bet that the brick hiding underneath all of that paint is allot more attractive than the current paint job. As it is now, it's just another average looking shop with huge potential.

jedikermit · #**7627** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 1:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by delts145

I wonder if we should update our focus with the Holding family? It seems to me that his son and perhaps son-in-law is running the show now. He had a pretty serious stroke and is quite advanced in age. What do you guys think?

I think we were talking about negotiations that were happening more than a decade ago, when I assume Holding was more at the reins than he is now. These days, sure, I'm not going to complain about Earl Holding's current activities, because there's not much of him left. I wish him well in his declining years. But all the griping about the Grand America that we've been doing is about what was happening in the 1990's, and has been about Earl's (or the company's) greed, Flower Patch's stubbornness, and possibly the city's shortsightedness.

delts145 · #**7628** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 2:40 PM**

I understood we were talking about the past. Of course, what's done is done. The question now is, what would we do to encourage the current Holding family power and current Becker administration etc. do, in order to improve the street presence of the Grand Hotel block.

* Just a quick note: The Grand is the only 'downtown' hotel property in the Mountain West Forum to receive the just issued, "2009 AAA Five Diamond Award." Remember, this is downtown only, and does not include metro Park City/Deer Valley, Scottsdale, or the Vegas Strip.

bammbammz · #**7629** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 4:57 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by delts145

I wonder if we should update our focus with the Holding family? It seems to me that his son and perhaps son-in-law is running the show now. He had a pretty serious stroke and is quite advanced in age. What do you guys think?

While the Grand America is a very fine hotel, I agree the Holdings should make a few additions on at least two to three sides of the block. I hate the way it interacts with 6oo south and also State. Also, the northeast and southeast corners of Main could easily be improved with some stylish street-savy additions. That bethal granite material is still very much in supply back in New England.

I wouldn't for a second want to tear down the Flower Patch, but I would be willing to bet that the brick hiding underneath all of that paint is allot more attractive than the current paint job. As it is now, it's just another average looking shop with huge potential.

I agree Delts. But, while we are whooing the Holding Family let's do the same for another famous Utah Family who has a wealthy father, who's seen better day's, and now possibly those days numbered. Larry H. Miller!!!! I've never liked the 10-story building in the middle of Sandy. I think we all agree he should've built a 40-story tower downtown.I've seen his son on the news lately. Maybe we can get him to build big an tall downtown???

ski_steve · #**7630** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 7:33 PM**

U. begins renovation of nursing school
$23M makeover to increase capacity, update technology

Renovation got under way Friday, though 175 nursing faculty and staff have been moving out of their offices to a temporary downtown location since August. They'll be displaced more than 18 months while the 40-year-old, five-story building gets a $23 million makeover.

The 5,600-square-foot, state-of-the-art center will include computerized patient mannequins to help interpret real-life scenarios involving surgical, pediatric, maternal and critical care.

"This partnership will be critical for patients whose health care will depend on the training done within these walls," said A. Lorris Betz, vice president for health sciences at the U. Other renovations include a new auditorium and classrooms, as well as additional office space.

U. President Michael K. Young said the upgrades will fit in nicely with other buildings within the health sciences complex, "forming a collaboration to create the kind of learning that is fundamental to providing quality health care."

"This is a prime example of how the University of Utah is Utah's university," he said, adding that the U. is the only institution in the state that is charged to produce nursing educators.

http://deseretnews.com/article/0,5143,705264978,00.html

Future Mayor · #**7631** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 8:16 PM**

One other thing I forgot to mention from my little discussion with Downtown Rising is the estimated population in downtown. As most of us have heard before, the CBD is estimated to have about 10,000 residents by 2010. It is also projected that with a mere 1% of the total increase in the state population over the next 15-20 years the CBD alonE is estimated to have around 50,000 residents. Remember that is just "Downtown" Salt Lake City. Compared to the roughly 6,000 - 8,000 that reside there now, that number is staggering.

Oh and one last thing.

GO UTES!

T-Mac · #**7632** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 9:38 PM**

Alright guys. I got together with some of my old high school friends and we spent most of the night downtown. We had dinner at the Himalayan Kitchen which was my first visit there. Actually it was quite good. My first time for Indian/Nepal type food. Great curry and we had a lamb dish that was very spicy and great. We then went up to Keys on Main. Shocking, I know for a LDS Bountiful man such as myself, but that is what people wanted to do. I do have to say that that area of Main was really quite busy at that late hour. It was kind of cool to see the TRAX train going by with the lights of the Wells Fargo Tower lighting up that area of Main. The piano bar was quite interesting as it was the first time I have ever been. Our little group must have stuck out like crazy and I think we cleaned them out of diet coke. We did take off a little early at about 10:30 and went up to the U to finish off the evening with some pool at the Union. Keys on Main was not my cup of tea, but I gave it a shot. It would be good to see more nightlife downtown with more for the conservative LDS people. What that may be, I have no idea, but I have to think of something. Hopefully City Creek Center will have a more active nightlife with the restaurants and with a downtown broadway style theater and other activities, we can have a great downtown. Lots of work to do, but I think it will all come together. Enough rambling. I just wanted to share my evening with you all and some of my thoughts on our downtown.

urbanboy · #**7633** Posted **Nov 22, 2008, 11:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by T-Mac

Alright guys. I got together with some of my old high school friends and we spent most of the night downtown. We had dinner at the Himalayan Kitchen which was my first visit there. Actually it was quite good. My first time for Indian/Nepal type food. Great curry and we had a lamb dish that was very spicy and great. We then went up to Keys on Main. Shocking, I know for a LDS Bountiful man such as myself, but that is what people wanted to do. I do have to say that that area of Main was really quite busy at that late hour. It was kind of cool to see the TRAX train going by with the lights of the Wells Fargo Tower lighting up that area of Main. The piano bar was quite interesting as it was the first time I have ever been. Our little group must have stuck out like crazy and I think we cleaned them out of diet coke. We did take off a little early at about 10:30 and went up to the U to finish off the evening with some pool at the Union. Keys on Main was not my cup of tea, but I gave it a shot. It would be good to see more nightlife downtown with more for the conservative LDS people. What that may be, I have no idea, but I have to think of something. Hopefully City Creek Center will have a more active nightlife with the restaurants and with a downtown broadway style theater and other activities, we can have a great downtown. Lots of work to do, but I think it will all come together. Enough rambling. I just wanted to share my evening with you all and some of my thoughts on our downtown.

Hey T-Mac, you might want to try going to the comedy club at the Off-Broadway Theater.

T-Mac · #**7634** Posted **Nov 23, 2008, 1:00 AM**

Urbanboy, I did see that down there as well and it looked quite interesting. I will be back down there again. We all need to patronize downtown as often as possible and get others to do so as well to help encourage other businesses downtown.

MetroFanatic · #**7635** Posted **Nov 23, 2008, 5:09 AM**

I wrote an argument paper last semester on whether or not 911 was an inside job; we had to make equal arguments on both sides of the issue.

After long hours of research, I found both sides to have some valid points, but the conspiracy side DOES have some pretty ridiculous ideas, such as a remote controlled cargo plane with a pod on the underbelly.

ski_steve · #**7636** Posted **Nov 24, 2008, 1:29 AM**

Photos from today.

The Old Hansen Planetarium

One and Nine Condos

Old Fellows Move

Daynes Building Renovation

SLC Projects · #**7637** Posted **Nov 24, 2008, 7:06 AM**

Does anyone know when the "The Old Hansen Planetarium" building is going to reopen?

delts145 · #**7638** Posted **Nov 24, 2008, 12:37 PM**

Jordan trailway a step closer to completion

http://www.sltrib.com/slc/ci_11033559

Segment by segment, a 3 and one-half mile stretch of the Jordan River Trailway near 1000 North in Rose Park is becoming a paved thoroughfare, which will eventually join the recently completed Legacy Parkway trail in Davis County.

Jordan River Parkway Trail, International Peace Gardens

by SloanS

.

SLC Projects · #**7639** Posted **Nov 24, 2008, 8:38 PM**

Looks like crews are getting ready for the concrete pour for the foundation of tower 5. I bet we will see a crane pop up next to it within a week or two.

http://199.104.95.220/popup.html?KeepThis=true&TB_iframe=true&height=377&width=490

urbanboy · #**7640** Posted **Nov 24, 2008, 9:42 PM**

The rest-home which once stood near the intersection of West Temple and 200 North, it almost completely demolished. The property is now owned by the LDS church. There are rumors that the property will either become a parking lot for the nearby stake center, or missionary housing/apartments. Hopefully it is that latter, but I have a feeling it will be parking before anything else.