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  #561  
Old Posted Nov 16, 2008, 10:09 PM
BCTed BCTed is offline
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Originally Posted by markbarbera View Post
Perhaps too aggressively. Many an upstart chain has come crashing down because of an overly rapid expansion.
Yup, there is already one on Upper Centennial, there is going to be one on Queenston near Nash, and it seems that there will also be one at the Centre Mall. That seems like a lot of Boston Pizza.

BP is also expanding all over the place outside of Hamilton.
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  #562  
Old Posted Nov 16, 2008, 10:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markbarbera View Post
Perhaps too aggressively. Many an upstart chain has come crashing down because of an overly rapid expansion.
I need to figure out how to pull off a stunt like that.
Sell garbage food at an insane price and somehow people go!! Geez. Talk about easy money.
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  #563  
Old Posted Nov 16, 2008, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by BCTed View Post
Yup, there is already one on Upper Centennial, there is going to be one on Queenston near Nash, and it seems that there will also be one at the Centre Mall. That seems like a lot of Boston Pizza.

BP is also expanding all over the place outside of Hamilton.
According to the dude in Dragon's Den who owns them, he's down into Texas now too.

I looked at the website and there is a TON of small retail spaces not accounted for yet. Are they really going to fill them all??
Although not my cup of tea, I could see a Starbucks or Second Cup doing well here considering there's none anywhere nearby. Again, the Boston Pizza model at work - overpriced crap. But hey, it works.
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  #564  
Old Posted Nov 16, 2008, 10:52 PM
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According to the dude in Dragon's Den who owns them, he's down into Texas now too.
Actually, the individual locations will be franchises, he is a owner of the corporation. What a deal, rapid expansion with minimal risk, and taking a cut for just providing a name, and a system.
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  #565  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 2:33 AM
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Wouldn't it have been amazing if they had done something like this at Centre Mall.

http://www.philly.com/inquirer/business/homepage/20081116_A_new__town__grows_in_Voorhees.html
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  #566  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 2:44 AM
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stop teasing us. we're in Hamilton. we get crap.
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  #567  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 2:45 AM
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Like in Dundas is a building like that. it has the stores on main floor and condos/apts up.
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  #568  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 2:47 AM
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surrounding area

There is so much run down area around Centre Mall to put up condos. With Centre mall and all the essentials and 15 min bus service. It is almost like an express bus from Parkdale and return. Gut half the businesses and along the street and upscale the upper floors. Too bad we don't relocate the express Go service from Barton and Nash to Centre to Burlington (Toronto). Use Centre Mall as the GO start hub. That would bring in the occupants.
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  #569  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 3:00 AM
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I was in Oakville the other day, this is the type of thing they are building there:






More downtown Oakville: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=160960

(also check out part II, Oakville's older neighbourhoods might surprise: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=160959)
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  #570  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 3:13 AM
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that would have been great for Centre Mall. Even though it looks fake and sterile, it's miles better than big box crap surrounding by thousands of parking spaces.
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  #571  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 3:16 AM
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Those are really nice Flar
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  #572  
Old Posted Nov 17, 2008, 1:21 PM
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I think that kind of stuff works best when mixed in with older mixed use buildings. The older buildings kinda kill the sterile look of the newer ones a bit and make things blend into a nice streetwall. In Oakville's case, it's all too neat and tidy. No large trees, no canopy's, no ornate cornice's. It's all very conservative.

Even still, light years ahead of any big box development, and definitely a step in the right direction as far as urban development is concerned.
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  #573  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 12:09 PM
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Centre Mall: Hamilton landmark gives up the ghost

November 19, 2008
Paul Wilson

Executives at the Morgan’s department store chain said it was “a once in a lifetime chance.”

They just had to be part of Canada’s largest retail complex, the Greater Hamilton Shopping Centre — better known as Centre Mall.

At a press conference in 1955, Morgan’s said it would build a store here. It would be their largest branch, a stylish place with chandeliers, fieldstone accents, 3-D murals.

The historic Morgan’s name didn’t last long after that. But the two-storey 140,000-square-foot building the chain erected still stands.

Not for much longer, though. It is a Zellers now and is soon coming down.
If you’re old enough to have fond memories of those Morgan days, or even the Bay days that followed, hold onto them. Don’t go back. There’s no lustre left.

Henry Morgan set up shop in Montreal in 1845. It was not until a century later that the family ventured into branch stores. It opened four in Montreal, then expanded to three cities outside Quebec — Toronto, Ottawa and Hamilton.

Morgan’s said the store here would employ 500 and be done up smartly, with touches such as pink and green terracotta trim, in what the company called “the Morgan manner.”

The store opened May 14, 1957, the Union Jack flying from the rooftop.
Just three years later the Hudson’s Bay Company bought Morgan’s, and the name came down right away on the stores in Ontario. In Quebec, they left the Morgan’s badge in place for another dozen years, before the switch to la Baie. Under that name, the huge Morgan’s flagship store still looms large on Montreal’s main drag.

The Centre Mall Bay store eventually became Robinson’s. Then, when that chain was put to sleep in 1992, the store went down-market, to the Zellers brand.

The story of what happened to the shopping miracle that was Centre Mall is well-known by now.

The mall was once surrounded for miles by families where the breadwinner was bringing home a good factory cheque every week. But those companies died or moved away and the mall declined.

It changed hands five years ago, and the new owners eventually decided the way to the future was to blow up Centre Mall and turn it into a sea of big boxes.

They’re rising now, amid the mud that was the parking lot. They rudely back onto Barton, which does little for the streetscape.

At the east end of the mall, dump trucks and big shovels clear the final debris of what was the largest Sears store in the land. It moved over to Eastgate Mall a few months ago, in a space that became available when the Bay decided it didn’t need to be in Hamilton’s lower city anymore.

The concourse of Centre Mall is a dim and eerie place now. Just a handful of businesses left, the ones waiting for space in the stand-alone structures under construction.

The man at the Rogers booth hopes the move comes soon. Sales this month are way down. At the banks, not a customer in sight. Seniors, the ones who visit a teller most, can’t be happy about the changes.

The big gold letters are still up at Peoples Jewellers. “Visit us at our new store in Jackson Square,” the sign reads. Ironic, because the birth of this mall was all about using free parking to divert shopping dollars from downtown.

The only place where the lights still shine bright is at Zellers. They’ve brought in truckloads of clearance merchandise, from aisles and aisles of cheap shoes to Easter ware galore — bunnies, baskets, eggs, grass. Meanwhile, on the sound system, it’s Joy to the World.

Everything goes, every shelf, every case, every perfect figure. You can take home an attractive mannequin with a steady gaze for $350. Or a two-stall, twin-turreted kid’s castle change room for $300.

There have been nostalgic buyers for the booths and chairs in the restaurant upstairs. That salmon-coloured Naugahyde must go nearly back to the Morgan days.

It’s too late for a final plate of fries. The restaurant closed Saturday. Though still subject to change, the store is set to shut down Dec. 3 and open the next day in a new one-floor-with-groceries Zellers directly behind it.

And that really will be old Centre Mall’s last gasp.
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  #574  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 12:26 PM
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really is sad.
Especially what they're replacing it with.
You can be sure that nobody on council and very few people in the public will hold these guys to the fire over their comments about 'pedestrian friendly streetwall on Barton' etc...
They flat out lied and as usual, council doesn't care enough about that part of town (or is too clueless) to do anything about it.
This project will be a colossal mess. thousands of cars mixing with pedestrians. everyone involved should be ashamed.
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  #575  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 1:17 PM
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Barton reborn.

We need to be semi-positive here. So why anti Centre Mall or the design. Their money, their design. If you don't like it, start a Co-Op and build your own. At least they are not in the Meadowlands. Be thankful for small mercies.
uof cars, Yes with dollars to spend in Hamilton and gas up at local stations. A huge mess is bettert than a ghost town.
ANY new development along Barton Street is an improvement. The new (sorta like the Oakville pictures) buildings on Barton near Wentworth are nice.
But the majority of Barton. Ouch
I drive (yes drive) down Barton on a very regular basis and I welcome the new Centre Mall. As I drive West after Ottawa Street it is very depressing. There are run down, boarded up old solid buildings, but in the late evening and early morning the local seedy creatures crawl out from under their rocks or off the sidewalks along Ferguson Street. Lottridge.
So it has to start somewhere and Barton is a long street with many separate areas that are emerging. Near James North, Corner of Ferguson (Plaza and Mark Preece house).
If you look in a reverse order there are several example of Malls rising up in residential neighbourhoods like the old days but the stores are bigger. The Home Depot and friends in upper Stoney Creek in the old Satelite City. Rec Centre, Library, trails, rink. The same for Milton off Steele near James Snow. So you can sent the kids to the store for a 2X4 and a box of nails. hahaha...
And a large double double and not using a drive thru.
So if the Centre Mall was to grow, then the Apt bldgs and condos, there is a regular bus to downtown. As this could be the anchor then ccyour vision of shoppes along Ottawa and Kenilworth for the new locals.
The only real item missing is a smal to mid-size Home hardware to fill in where Canadian Tire lacks.
Can you just imagine the boom to this area if a Go-transit stop or Via stop was added or incorporated and an area to park like the one set-up at Nash and Barton. Commuters from the mountain (who used to fight down the 403 hill to Aldershot) could pick what they need prior to going home. As the area improve thay may migrate North . Steal some of the business from Limeridge.
I was out to Binbrook and near our Airpot and saw all the NEW houses. This is why all the out in the middle of nowhere business is being built near the 20/56/53 intersection.
So like field of dreams if you build it they will come. Go lower Hamilton...
We have the waterfront, once they do something with it.
I wonder if Greyhound could run a service to Toronto from Centre Mall and East Gate.
I live in East Hamilton and welcome any development as I want to keep my money in my hood. Support my crib. Yo guy.
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  #576  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 2:10 PM
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The city should have required a street wall along Barton St. How hard is it to turn a building 180 degrees around on paper? The South side of Barton has buildings up to the sidewalk and facing the street; there are probly a few empty spaces, I can't remember how many. They could have done something interesting, a throw back to the way buildings were built in 1900 - 1920. A nod to the era when most of the other buildings in the area were built.
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  #577  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 2:21 PM
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Are they going to reuse the arch at Centre Mall? If so I'm guessing at the Food Court building.

If not they should donate it to the City and let them install it somewhere else. Perhaps at Ottawa Street next to the Farmers' Market.
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  #578  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 6:17 PM
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so I drove by and on the site today.
WOW. horrible.
I'm going to go back and count how many back access doors face Barton St. It's got to be several dozens. Nothing but blank walls and little steel doors facing the sidewalk.
Unreal.

On a positive note (not on this site obviously) drive up Kenilworth and keep going past burlington st - check out the unbelievable, wicked building National Steel Car is building on the right hand side, just north of Burlington.
An absolute beauty.
I'd love to see a diner downtown in this style. One of the coolest buildings to be put up in Hamilton in years.
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  #579  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 8:07 PM
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If it's anything like the new pseudo-street-fronting big box they're building near my work, the windows facing the street will be painted black and the walls will be covered with pipes and electrical meters.

Good times are coming....
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  #580  
Old Posted Nov 19, 2008, 8:34 PM
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There is no denying an opportunity was lost to do a mixed use development here. An argument could be made that this neighbourhood couldn't support an intensified mixed use development at this point in time. After all, it would be extremely hard to sell condos or fill commercial office space facing the industrial smokestacks of Dofasco. Having said that, the opportunity for future redevelopment has not been completely eliminated. I take it a tear would not be shed if any of the buildings along Barton were to be demolished for some future redevelopment (not withstanding a movement 20 years from now to preserve the site on the grounds that it is a unique representation of early 21st century big box heritage architecture).

Frankly, Barton Street between Ottawa and Kenilworth was just as, if not, less pedestrian friendly prior to this redevelopment. So, from that point of view, while this stretch is not an improvement over its previous incarnation, it is certainly not worse than when it was nothing more than a wide swath of crumbling parking spaces for a run-down shopping mall.
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