Gore Park

[go_leafs_go02]

I'm curious. What exactly is so boring about downtown Burlington or Oakville. I haven't been to Oakville reallly, but Burlington I've been along the lakeshore and walked around it's downtown. And man, I like it. It's upscale, it's smaller, it's classy. No, burlington isn't a business district, but nor is it a homeless district either.

[raisethehammer]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

You've been to Portland so look at Pioneer Courthouse Square as an example, it's next to a mall as well, Pioneer Place. Yet you see nothing like the slums there compared to Gore Park.

haha..wrong example bro! Lol. Portland is FULL of weirdos and crazies. Heck, people have bumper stickers that say "keep portland weird".
try hanging out for 30 minutes in Pioneer square without people offering you drugs, asking for drugs or simply babbling incoherently to you due to their massive mental or drug issues.
Of course, you also have the fabulous american pastime of people owning guns and shooting one another. A buddy of mine was robbed at gunpoint at pioneer square after leaving work in that mall at starbucks.

I think this is all 'perspective' of where you're from. Many of those here who don't like the mix of people have come from smaller towns.
I remember the first time I went to TO, I was struck by all the screaming homeless guys and gangs of punks fighting on the street and some guy taking a piss on the road etc..... it's all perspective. I'd much take that than some crappy whitebread town like oakville.

[BCTed]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

I think this is all 'perspective' of where you're from. Many of those here who don't like the mix of people have come from smaller towns.
I remember the first time I went to TO, I was struck by all the screaming homeless guys and gangs of punks fighting on the street and some guy taking a piss on the road etc..... it's all perspective. I'd much take that than some crappy whitebread town like oakville.

You seem to be the only person on the board who seems to like (or at least not mind) the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton. Which part of Toronto is it that struck you so? I can't imagine that any part of Toronto gets the same reaction.

I believe that the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton, particularly in and near Gore Park, is pretty unique and is enough to turn off both big city and small town folk.

[FairHamilton]

I'm not frightened by them, it's just that I like to associate with people more like myself. They are not like me, so why should I go to an area where they 'hang-out'? I'm better to stay close to home with my neighbours that I'm more like.

Oh yeah, and the stairs on the east side of John Street to the GO platform reeked of urine this morning. Obviously left by more people I would prefer not to associate with.

[raisethehammer]

I'm not telling you to hang out with them....but let's all remember that we live in a society here. this whole discussion portrays images of a mother covering her kids eyes while walking past a homeless man. heaven forbid the kid grow up with a sense of appreciation for what they have and with a proper understanding that the whole planet doesn't look like the inside of a Kelseys.
I take it many of you have never travelled outside of Western nations. If you don't like the mix of people in Gore Park I don't think you'd enjoy hanging out by the gulf of mexico flea market in Veracruz or being in shanty towns in the Dominican or the heart of the inner city in Bogota. Cuba was another eye opener.
I loved all these places and would go back in a heartbeat. It's good for young people to grow up with a better perspective of the world and not their fake, Hollywood version on the tv everynight.
It's why I hate our suburbs in N.America. It's nothing more than a cleaner, less offensive means of segregation. The day my neighbourhood goes all uppity like Aberdeen I'm outta there.

[the dude]

Originally Posted by BCTed

You seem to be the only person on the board who seems to like (or at least not mind) the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton. Which part of Toronto is it that struck you so? I can't imagine that any part of Toronto gets the same reaction.

I believe that the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton, particularly in and near Gore Park, is pretty unique and is enough to turn off both big city and small town folk.

nope, he's not the only one. i'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that anyone who's lived in another city or travelled ANYWHERE doesn't take issue with the denizens of our lovely dilapidated downtown. that's life in the city, man. sure, it's a little disproportional but i'm tired of the constant refrain that somehow hamilton is worse than other cities. perhaps the homeless or those 'sketchy' types look worse sitting on the corner of king and james compared to hanging out on queen west. get out there and experience the world outside the GTA.

[SteelTown]

Problem with Gore Park is what others have said....it needs to be diluted with "normal" people.

10 years ago James St North was basically a crack alley. Now it's diluted with artist and new residences. You don't really see many crackheads compared to the past.

[oldcoote]

Originally Posted by BCTed

You seem to be the only person on the board who seems to like (or at least not mind) the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton. Which part of Toronto is it that struck you so? I can't imagine that any part of Toronto gets the same reaction.

I believe that the "mix of people" in downtown Hamilton, particularly in and near Gore Park, is pretty unique and is enough to turn off both big city and small town folk.

C'mon Ted.

Have you been to Toronto, or do you just avoid Church and Queen, or Sherbourne St, or St James Park.

Downtown Toronto was exactly like downtown Hamilton is. It's been gentrified enormously in the past 20 years, but there are still a lot of 'sketchy' area's.

A lot of this thread is sounding xenophobic to me.

[MsMe]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

it needs to be diluted with "normal" people

Are there normal people that live in Hamilton?

[SteelTown]

Or maybe I should say "Joe six pack"

[FairHamilton]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

I'm not telling you to hang out with them....

Yes, I don't have to hang out with them but if I'm to conduct commerce and business in the core I have to be in their close proximty for an extended period of time. We aren't talking about the single panhandler on the corner here, we are talking about large groups of people sitting around hangin out smoking, and using downtown Hamilton as their personal garbage receptical.

You know the ones the ones I mean, the ones that make me with my $75 worth of Turkey from Readon's have to walk on the roadway to get around them smoking on the street corner. Let's think about that for a second, I am a person frequenting my favourite places downtown, spending money (on things beside smokes, and junk/fast food), but you're saying I'm the one to tolerate those loiters because they add character to the downtown. Come on.

If I'm not comfortable with that, it means I'll take my business elsewhere in Hamilton's downtown core. Oh yeah, it's not a big enough core with enough shops for me to shop elsewhere, so I guess I won't be shopping downtown anymore.

With the state of Hamilton's downtown, I guess many people have done just that prior to my arrival in Hamilton this past year.

[HackD]

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02

I'm curious. What exactly is so boring about downtown Burlington or Oakville. I haven't been to Oakville reallly, but Burlington I've been along the lakeshore and walked around it's downtown. And man, I like it. It's upscale, it's smaller, it's classy. No, burlington isn't a business district, but nor is it a homeless district either.

I guess I'll come out of lurk mode, and break my Cherry with a first post on the topic.

I'm formerly a life-long resident of Oakville (38+ years) up until 18 months ago when i made the move to Hamilton (Red Hill neighborhood) because the housing costs were actually reasonable and affordable for a single working-class income guy like me. Oakville has always been a quiet, relatively sleepy town - it's role as an affluent bedroom community of Toronto over the past 40 years has meant that the town hasn't really developed an 'entertainment' district or night life - Both Oakville and Bronte 'down town' still retain that 'small town' feel to them, in my opinion at least. People go elsewhere, to be entertained.

Just because Oakville is relatively affluent, doesn't mean 'sketchyness' doesn't exist - it just tends to happen behind closed doors. House parties in Oakville, are something of a tradition among youths that would otherwise be hanging about in a 'Gore Park'.

Prior to my move into Hamilton, my experience with Hamilton was minimal - basically observed from the QEW or 'passing through' Hamilton proper. The same could be said about my exposure to Toronto, for that matter. Even so, it was always a running joke among my friends that street people who couldn't make it in Toronto, immigrated to Hamilton - perhaps there is an element of truth to that considering the cost of living in Toronto for even the homeless/sketchy types.

As far as the Gore Park downtown area goes, sorry, but it's sketchy as Hell in my experience. I did a 20 minute walk-about on a Sunday afternoon, to read the monument inscriptions and to soak up the atmosphere. In that 20 minute period of time, i was pan-handled 5 times, propositioned once, and had to step over several prone bodies sleeping it off on the walkways. The surrounding area was somewhat less sketchy - the shifty types were at least somewhat ambulatory and not actively pan-handling or blocking up access on the sidewalks.

Gore Park has a long way to go, Baby - at least to this small-town minded person.

[highwater]

Originally Posted by FairHamilton

Oh yeah, and the stairs on the east side of John Street to the GO platform reeked of urine this morning. Obviously left by more people I would prefer not to associate with.

Come visit us in Westdale where our streets reek of vomit, urine, and feces left by young, educated hipsters.

[raisethehammer]

[QUOTE=FairHamilton;3861165]Yes, I don't have to hang out with them but if I'm to conduct commerce and business in the core I have to be in their close proximty for an extended period of time.


Heaven forbid!

[Jon Dalton]

I typed something longer but then the board crapped out and I lost it. So just count me among those who concede that there is a definite sketch factor in Gore Park and most of the core.

[FairHamilton]

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Or maybe I should say "Joe six pack"

Isn't 'Joe the Plumber' the everyman this week? lol

[FairHamilton]

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

Heaven forbid!

You just don't get it, do you! There are reasons why people you feel add character impede the development of downtown. But, I know you are always right, so that's that.

At least having downtown remain downtrodden gives you a reason to squawk.

Me, I'm going for my lunchtime walk (late today) from Spadina to Niagara along King Street back along Richmond/Adelaide. Zero sketchiness on that walk.

[FairHamilton]

Oh yeah, where are my manners. Welcome HackD

[crhayes]

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02

I'm curious. What exactly is so boring about downtown Burlington or Oakville. I haven't been to Oakville reallly, but Burlington I've been along the lakeshore and walked around it's downtown. And man, I like it. It's upscale, it's smaller, it's classy. No, burlington isn't a business district, but nor is it a homeless district either.

I agree, I love Burlingtons downtown. Its right on their waterfront, which is b-e-a-utiful, and it is classy and upscale. I visit there frequently just to walk around and take it in.

[crhayes]

There are a few people on this forum who are blinded by advocacy for Hamilton (I'm sure you know who). Of course the City is going to have bums and homeless people, but we are saying get them the @&$% out of Gore Park. Gore Park is never going to be the 'Social Center' of the city as long as the low lives of Hamilton are congregating there. Get them to return to Barton Street or Concession street and then we can return Gore to it's 'glory'.

I worked construction at a shoppers on the corner of College and Young downtown Toronto for serveral months, and ate lunch outside. Yes, in absolute numbers there are more sketchy people in Toronto than Hamilton. But you can't look at it that way considering the population is 5 times greater. Relatively Toronto has much less sketchy people than Hamilton. For ever sketchy person on the street in Toronto, at least you have about 20 normal people walking around shopping and contributing to society. It isn't like that in Gore Park. Gore Park is dominated by sketchy people who appear to do nothing more than ask for money and buy cigarettes.