SLC: Official 222 S Main Construction thread

[CPVLIVE]

Originally Posted by delts

...And I suppose the Brookings Institute will continue to include everything from Denver to Colorado Springs, and even Pueblo, which may even actually be connected by that time. Yet at the same time, they would leave off half of the Wasatch Front, both north and south. What a laughable and uninformed farce!! Not necessarily regarding the Front Range, but definately regarding the Wasatch Front. Hey, who knows, maybe by 2040 they will have at least a small semblance of actual knowledge where the Wasatch Front is concerned. What a joke!

Do you disagree with their assessment of what constitutes the Wasatch Front? - Here it is.

"The Wasatch Front is the third‐largest megapolitan area in
the Intermountain West, with 2.3 million residents in 2007.
The megapolitan area extends along the I‐15 corridor from
Logan in the north to Payson in the south, spanning four
metropolitan areas and two micropolitan areas, which together
contain twelve counties. Its population is concentrated
in Salt Lake, Utah, Davis, and Weber counties, although
most of the recent growth has occurred in Salt Lake
and Utah counties."

[delts145]

Originally Posted by CPVLIVE

According to the Brookings Institute:

Denver - "Looking forward, Colorado’s Front Range is projected to
grow by nearly 70 percent to reach a population of 6.3 million
residents by 2040."

Salt Lake - "Looking forward, the Wasatch Front may add another 1.5
million people to reach a population of nearly 3.7 million by
2040."

As you can see I edited my thoughts while continuing to write. If the Front Range is in reality connected from Fort Collins to Pueblo, then sure 6.3 million is possible.

As far as the Wasatch Front prediction I don't agree, The Wasatch Front will continue at it's current pace of the past eight to ten years, and even accelerate. The Wasatch has outstripped most census predictions in the past by quite a distance.

Originally Posted by Northernlad

I really have a hard time understanding why some local forumers are so infatuated with the Wasatch adding thousands of more people when we have so many pressing issues that need to be addressed and fixed before we add thousands and upwards of a million people. Can any of you imagine what our air quality will be like with another say 50,000 or 500,000 people crammed along the valley from Ogden to Provo? probably not. Where is our water going to come from? How much worse will our very evident homeless problem downtown become? Will we be able to count on our fingers how many days we have clear views of the mountains because of murky stagnant air obstructing our views?
Not to mention everything we consider quality of life attributes which will decrease with so many people.

Perhaps it would be more appropriate for a very small number of certain people to ask why they themselves are so over-the-top infatuated with certain areas, yet on the record have nothing good to say about their own 'supposed' home. That for me is extremely hard to understand.

The Wasatch Front will continue to be in the top three growth regions of the country. And yes , we will continue to be rated at the top of business and endless long lists of prestigious publications. And yes again, we will continue to be at the forefront of economic growth, medical and technical growth, highway, TOD's, and mass-transit build-up. etc.

And Wow, I guess unless someone has been playing Rip VanWinkle, they would realize that automobile's and all other forms of transit and manufacturing are changing their mode of fuel usage and byproduct output at an astounding rate. "Golly Geez Dorthy, do ya think that the loco yoco's, might actually reverse many of the outmoded methods of the past?"

IMO, it would be both hilarious and very telling of anyone, that they would extol the current virtues of our mythical forever and ever big-brother CSA, or any CSA of 4,5,6 million or more, yet our own CSA of 4 million will be a future 'Armageddon.' As if the local citizens have no capability to meet and overcome the challenges which face all growing metros. How interesting that the most prestigious publications of our time keep putting The Wasatch Front at the top handful of the many 'Positive Can Do Lists.'

I travel to Western Colorado and Denver a lot more than five times a year. That general area is among my five favorite in the U.S., so unlike some, there is no axe to grind on my part. This 'forever and ever and alway's will be' is laughable. Fifteen or more years ago, I would have agreed that Downtown Denver feels much larger, but definately not any more. I'm used to far bigger cities than Denver, and in my opinion both the Wasatch and Metro Las Vegas will catch up with and pass Metro Denver in population over the next thirty years. But, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

[wrendog]

I just want our MSA to big enough to support MLB and NFL. Once we land those two sports, we no longer need to grow, in my book.

[CPVLIVE]

Originally Posted by delts145

I'm used to far bigger cities than Denver, and in my opinion both the Wasatch and Metro Las Vegas will catch up with and pass Metro Denver in population over the next thirty years. But, I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

Yes indeed we will, however if the past is any indication of the future here's what I see. Denver has more than doubled in population in the past 32 years. If the trend continues and it more than doubles in the next 32 - by say 2040 - than it's population will be somewhere near 6 million or so. For Salt Lake to be larger than 6 million people by 2040 the State of California will have to fall into the sea. You or I will never live long enough to see Salt Lake surpass Denver in Population so I wouldn't hold my breath. As far as Denver not feeling larger than Salt lake I want some of what your smoking.

[wrendog]

Gotta agree with CPlive. Denver feels MUCH more big city than Salt Lake. It's not even close.

[delts145]

Not as compared with the two metros of 15 years ago, especially if you're driving from north to south on the 15 vs. the 25. I also am looking at the 2012 date as far as downtown goes, which is very easy for me to visualize. Beyond 2012, I believe the growth of downtown will accelerate at an even much faster pace than the past ten years. Yes Downtown Denver still seems bigger, but like I said, not nearly as big in comparison to 15 years ago. Five years from now the gap will still not be closed yet, but it will be much smaller.

edit: I should clarify that I don't think Denver will accelerate or even maintain it's past growth rate over the next 20 or 30 years. I think it will grow in a healthy way, but it will be at a slower pace. I think that Phoenix, The Wasatch and Vegas will continue to experience a very accelerated growth level.

CPVlive, as far as never in our lifetime. Who's the one doing the smoking, LOL? That's a sentence proven wrong far more frequently over the past decade than not.

[DMTower]

Downtown Denver does feel bigger, but as far as the larger metro is concerned it doesn't feel to me like Salt Lake is that far behind. Denver transformed their downtown a little while back, much like SLC is doing right now, and it stimulated a boom in downtown development. I think the same is happening with downtown SLC and I wouldn't be surprised if we narrowed the gap with downtown Denver's "urban feel" pretty quickly, population aside.

[RFPCME]

I have no idea how this discussion moved away from 222. So. Main and on to a comparison between metro Denver and metro SLC. I think it's time to add some logic and reason to that discussion.

That said...never liked Denver, never will. I avoid going there, much the same way I avoid a trip to Cleveland or the Nevada Test Site (sorry Future Mayor).

To me, Denver is like a city whose auto-immune system has stopped functioning and whatever pathogens were present have metastasized throughout the entire area, sort of like what would happen to Sandy if so many of us weren't working hard to build a 100 ft wall around the Sandy city limits to confine the contagion.

I'm sure at some point in it's history Denver was a charming area...possibly when reptiles ruled the earth. And its reptilian past is still present in the many professional sports franchises located there.

That also said...if becoming like Denver means the SLC metro area can get MLB and NFL franchises, then I'm all for it.

So much for logic and reason.

[SLC Projects]

I've never been to Denver so I wouldn't know. Sorry I just wanted to be apart discussion. :}

Back to 222 South Main it looks like crew will add yet another layer of new beams in the coming days. It's about 9-stories tall now.

[delts145]

For the record again, I think Denver is a great city, and would consider it a top-five pick to live full time.

[NYC Rick]

Originally Posted by delts145

For the record again, I think Denver is a great city, and would consider it a top-five pick to live full time.

Denver is a really nice city...but

I do not understand how anyone could think that Downtown and metro Denver do not seem that different than Salt Lake City Metro.

SLC will grow into that but right now they seem very different to me.

[shakman]

Geez... I just made a little comment about some numbers and now this has happened. None the less, it is quite educating.

Does anyone know if the floor slab pours have commenced on the lower floors?

From my experience with working on steel structures, once all the welding has been completed and approved for a floor, the slab is afterwards poured. Next is the fireproofing of the steel for that floor and then the curtainwall is installed. During the slab pours, curtainwall embeds are included. It is these embeds that hold the curtainwall into place.

[delts145]

As you probably know shakman, Salt Lake City is gifted or cursed, (depending on which forumer is speaking LOL) with inordinately large downtown streets and blocks. It takes a much denser and even taller footprint to achieve the look of intimacy found in many downtowns that have much narrower streets and sidewalks etc. Downtown, SLC is really only now beginning to deal with this in a big way, with current multi-billion dollar developments such as CCC and TRAX that penetrate and develop the interiors of blocks, add to the medians of the streets and are creating a flurry of TOD related projects.

[T-Mac]

Originally Posted by shakman

Geez... I just made a little comment about some numbers and now this has happened. None the less, it is quite educating.

Does anyone know if the floor slab pours have commenced on the lower floors?

From my experience with working on steel structures, once all the welding has been completed and approved for a floor, the slab is afterwards poured. Next is the fireproofing of the steel for that floor and then the curtainwall is installed. During the slab pours, curtainwall embeds are included. It is these embeds that hold the curtainwall into place.

You will notice in this picture that the slab pours have begun and that they are up to the 3rd floor. That was as of Saturday morning.

[shakman]

Originally Posted by delts145

As you probably know shakman, Salt Lake City is gifted or cursed, (depending on which forumer is speaking LOL) with inordinately large downtown streets and blocks. It takes a much denser and even taller footprint to achieve the look of intimacy found in many downtowns that have much narrower streets and sidewalks etc. Downtown, SLC is really only now beginning to deal with this in a big way, with current multi-billion dollar developments such as CCC and TRAX that penetrate and develop the interiors of blocks, add to the medians of the streets and are creating a flurry of TOD related projects.

I do remember reading about the large blocks of SLC. I have always been amazed about SLC and its environment. IMO, SLC will continue to improve regardless to whatever city it is compared to. That is improve upon its already good image.

T-Mac - Thanks for the pic and subsequent response. I would think fireproofing would start in the near future.

[CPVLIVE]

Originally Posted by delts145

edit: I should clarify that I don't think Denver will accelerate or even maintain it's past growth rate over the next 20 or 30 years. I think it will grow in a healthy way, but it will be at a slower pace. I think that Phoenix, The Wasatch and Vegas will continue to experience a very accelerated growth level.

Thank you Nostradomus - I'm sure the city of Denver is worried to hear that delts145 has predicted that it will not maintain it past gowth rate ( although he's not sure why). Any other predictions we need to know about?

[T-Mac]

Hey guys, who really cares if Denver grows a little or a lot. I could care less. What I do care about is that the elevation of 222 S Main just got higher today with more steel going vertical. I have another appointment downtown tomorrow and I will have my camera with me.

[i-215]

Originally Posted by T-Mac

You will notice in this picture that the slab pours have begun and that they are up to the 3rd floor. That was as of Saturday morning.

They make 'em go up to the ninth floor to use the bathroom?

[delts145]

Originally Posted by CPVLIVE

Thank you Nostradomus - I'm sure the city of Denver is worried to hear that delts145 has predicted that it will not maintain it past gowth rate ( although he's not sure why). Any other predictions we need to know about?

C'mon CPVLIVE, I've made it very clear numerous times in the past and currently, that I like Denver. There certainly wasn't any intention to portray it as anything other than the very fine city that it is.

[RFPCME]

Originally Posted by delts145

For the record again, I think Denver is a great city, and would consider it a top-five pick to live full time.

Delts: Obviously, we are never going to agree on Denver. Frankly, my slightly jaded opinion of Denver might be due to the fact that I had my heart broken there once. Can't seem to separate the logic from the emotion.

Nonetheless, your comment about "Top 5" has been rattling around in my head for some time. Here's my idea of the Top 5 places to live in the US, selection criteria purely my own taste (or lack there of):

(1) Savannah (Best kept secret in the US)
(2) Huntsville AL (Second best secret in the US)
(3) Asheville NC
(4) Bend OR
(5) Tie: St. Augustine FL/Charleston SC

Of course, if you have a top 5, you must have a bottom 5

(1) Sandy
(2) East St. Louis IL
(3) The Bronx, NYC
(4) East Orange NJ
(5) Tie: Gary IN/Sandy