The Official Saint John, NB Project Thread

[PostModernPrometheus]

Deal makes perfect sense for port: CEO


Waterfront Room to expand available at former sugar refinery site, says Soppitt
B3SANDRA DAVIS
Telegraph-Journal

SAINT JOHN - Saint John will never have another opportunity like the one being presented for Long Wharf, says Capt. Al Soppitt, president and CEO of the Saint John Port Authority.

"I'm not interested in reducing port capacity - this is not what we're doing," says Soppitt.

Soppitt and proponents that include Enterprise Saint John, the Saint John Waterfront Development Partnership, the Saint John Board of Trade and numerous other groups and entrepreneurs, are eager to embrace a proposal that will see the city sell the former Lantic Sugar refinery site to Irving Oil.

The transaction would set the wheels in motion for Irving Oil to hand over the former Lantic Sugar site to the port in return for a 99-year lease on Long Wharf, where the company would build its multimillion-dollar world headquarters. Irving Oil would own the land on which its headquarters would sit on the Long Wharf site and lease the surrounding area from the port authority, which would retain control of its secondary cruise ship berth.

Soppitt says it makes perfect sense for the port because it would consolidate the authority's ownership of land along the eastern side of the city's harbour and shift its cargo facilities closer to port operations.

The International Longshoremen's Association, Local 273, is the only group opposed to the deal, even though no jobs will be lost.
As it stands now, Long Wharf has been primarily used as a secondary cruise ship terminal. Only 56 cargo ships have tied up at the wharf in the past 10 years and lately, it's been a lay-down area for about 30,000 tonnes of limestone a year that is trucked to Coleson Cove.

The port authority wants to construct a new lay-down area at Lower Cove, which would consolidate its operations away from the uptown area. There is no reason why limestone, which Soppitt describes as a "pretty benign" material, could not be stored at Lower Cove, says the captain.

"Long Wharf is a good terminal, but it cannot expand in any shape," says Soppitt. "We've got an historic site (Fort La Tour) on one side, we have rail, the highway, a gas pipeline at the north side, the Hilton and condos on the other side. There's urban development going on all around you."

*sic*


link to full article:

http://telegraphjournal.canadaeast.com/city/article/378996

[Downtown Bolivar]

This article is proof that the Irvings will go full tilt to bury the opposition on this one. Good for them.

[PersonPlaceorThing]

Originally Posted by Downtown Bolivar

This article is proof that the Irvings will go full tilt to bury the opposition on this one. Good for them.

I can't picture this being an Irving vs. the rest of us thing. The Irving Empire is reportedly coming apart with the owner of the TJ (JK Irving) set to have his heirs take over a completely different set of companies that Irving Oil.

The rumour mill is hot with the fact that Irving Oil is not liked by JD Irving or other extended family owned divisions (OSCO and Commercial Properties).

It doesn't make since that "Irving" would use the newspaper to promote a project that is an Irving Oil project, when the newspaper owner doesn't like Irving Oil.

I think this is an example more of an editorial board that gets a bone and won't let go. They did this during our most recent election by championing a candidate who came in a distant 3rd - even as evidence mounted that she was not the candidate the people wanted or even a candidate with well thought out policies. This candidate was also not the candidate most preferred by the large corporate interests in town.

The same editorial board decided there was a North of Union "problem" and still has not let this go.

They like writing series that go on for weeks and write with furious conviction.

Ownership of the paper is low hanging fruit for heaping on criticism, but the editors do appear autonomous. It's just that the editors have particular obsessions that they like to play with.

[kwajo]

Anyone else going to the special session of Common Council this evening? I can't wait to hear the incessant heckling from the ILA members, it'll be a good time

Also, here's another somewhat interesting editorial from the TJ this morning:

This dog needs new design guidelines - and fast
Published Monday August 11th, 2008

Too much of Saint John looks like a dog's breakfast. Oddities of architecture and other eyesores are so common, they depress property values in the nice spots and hurt the city's overall tax revenues. Look at what people euphemistically call 'the Dog Mall' in the centre of town and you'll get the drift.

Blame it on poor planning.

The city's planning department has relied on an outdated municipal plan for years, conceived when highways and strips malls were deemed more important than livable, people-friendly urban places.

What's needed is a new approach to planning, one that would be embraced by citizens and start erasing some of the blight.

There are plenty of good examples around the world, and fortunately, architect Bob Boyce is looking at some of them.

Eighteen months ago, common council passed a motion sponsored by Stephen Chase, the current deputy mayor, to come up with new design guidelines for the city.

A committee was struck, with Boyce in the lead. The urban design review committee will present recommendations within the next few months.

Boyce isn't the type to chew out city officials. He politely describes the city's traditional planning model as quantitative rather than qualitative.

By this, he means it worries about building codes and the like but not the overall impact a building has on an area.

It's the same model that most North American cities have used for decades. This "planning as things pop up" mentality drives business and residents from downtowns, severs neighbourhoods and contributes to sprawl. Is it any wonder Saint John has such a huge service area with so few people to pay for it all?

One important way to discourage the uglification and depopulation of cities is to enforce good urban design guidelines. This can mean constructing buildings that follow the size and scale of other nearby edifices and using friendlier materials on ground levels, especially when it comes to public spaces and walkways. The idea is to build on the best of a neighbourhood.

"Good urban design is fundamentally about people," he wrote in an e-mail. "About ensuring that our communities provide a quality day to day experience - visually and physically, about making places and spaces that work well and look good."

To be successful, he says the process needs to start by asking people what sort of vision they have for their neighbourhood, what character they want to maintain or create. You need buy-in from the community before embarking on big projects. It's important that people care deeply about their surroundings. This ensures they protect it and want to keep living and working there.

Saint John has no design guidelines right now, other than in heritage preservation areas. Developers come up with what they want, submit the plans, and as long as they fit certain requirements - building code, setbacks, that sort of thing - they go to public hearing. It often isn't until a project is completed that people say, "Boy, that looks bad."

The design guidelines would be just a start. The city needs a new, updated municipal plan that caters to what people want. The city's new planning commissioner, Ken Forrest, has talked about the importance of such a plan, but he's in danger of getting bogged down with the building boom. His department is so overrun it's begun farming out applications to a private consulting firm. This poses a grave problem - instead of getting it right the first time, more buildings could pop up here and there like weeds in an otherwise well-tended field.

If Forrest wishes to create a better city, one that maximizes property tax revenues, he must dedicate himself to creating a new municipal plan - and fast.

The current model is a flunky. Think of the many development requests coming before the planning advisory committee and common council. Too often they're bitterly contested by people who live near the proposed developments. This is not a smart way to plan an older city undergoing a building boom with limited parcels of land to develop. If buildings are put up without thought to the overall character of the place, the city will continue to lose good people.

[kwajo]

It looks like they have started the foundation work on the new hotel on the St. Paul's site too, and what appears to be - dare I say it - a construction crane being prepared to go up! If the court house construction requires one, and Rocca's Water St. development gets underway soon, we might have 3 urban construction cranes at the same time! This is exciting stuff for a city that hasn't seen any cranes in its downtown core in over a decade.

If I get the chance I'll try and grab a couple photos of the hotel site tomorrow.

[SJTOKO]

[PostModernPrometheus]

Originally Posted by kwajo

we might have 3 urban construction cranes at the same time! This is exciting stuff for a city that hasn't seen any cranes in its downtown core in over a decade.

good point...i think that the last time a major construction crane was in the uptown would have been the early/mid 90's when the mercantile centre was built....

[PostModernPrometheus]

Originally Posted by Downtown Bolivar

This article is proof that the Irvings will go full tilt to bury the opposition on this one. Good for them.

lol...good point, though i do agree with what personplaceorthing says re: the general attitude & stance of the paper . . .

that being said, any business that not merely wants to exist, but strives to thrive, has to be aggressive

[davehook_729]

Originally Posted by PostModernPrometheus

good point...i think that the last time a major construction crane was in the uptown would have been the early/mid 90's when the mercantile centre was built....

<br>
I can only see 5 tower cranes from my office window in downtown Ottawa, so 3 for Saint John would be pretty impressive. Not the nicest looking things, but definitely a sign of prosperity! Go SJ!

[PostModernPrometheus]

Originally Posted by kwajo

Anyone else going to the special session of Common Council this evening? I can't wait to hear the incessant heckling from the ILA members, it'll be a good time

Also, here's another somewhat interesting editorial from the TJ this morning:

i'm out of the province these past few weeks, otherwise i'd be there for the sheer entertainment value....

[michael_d40]

Originally Posted by kwajo

It looks like they have started the foundation work on the new hotel on the St. Paul's site too, and what appears to be - dare I say it - a construction crane being prepared to go up! If the court house construction requires one, and Rocca's Water St. development gets underway soon, we might have 3 urban construction cranes at the same time! This is exciting stuff for a city that hasn't seen any cranes in its downtown core in over a decade.

If I get the chance I'll try and grab a couple photos of the hotel site tomorrow.

Yeah, I noticed the crane when i was on westmorland road., Its a decent size.
Ive only been in SJ for 4 years, and its the first one ive seen here.
Its exciting lol

[thefishingnut]

Originally Posted by davehook_729

<br>
I can only see 5 tower cranes from my office window in downtown Ottawa, so 3 for Saint John would be pretty impressive. Not the nicest looking things, but definitely a sign of prosperity! Go SJ!

I've been around SJ about 10 years, and it seems the downtown skyline has been shrinking since I've been here - General Hospital, Red Rose, YMCA, Lantic Sugar come to mind. (I'm not arguing that the removal of some/all of these wasn't necessary) Definitely a good sign that some additions to the skyline are coming.

[random11]

Originally Posted by kwajo

It looks like they have started the foundation work on the new hotel on the St. Paul's site too, and what appears to be - dare I say it - a construction crane being prepared to go up! If the court house construction requires one, and Rocca's Water St. development gets underway soon, we might have 3 urban construction cranes at the same time! This is exciting stuff for a city that hasn't seen any cranes in its downtown core in over a decade.

If I get the chance I'll try and grab a couple photos of the hotel site tomorrow.

Yes - The crane is up at this site and it is large. We are like kid's in a candy shop LOL -- "Oooohhh cranes.." - haha But it is sure great to see.

[michael_d40]

Originally Posted by random11

Yes - The crane is up at this site and it is large. We are like kid's in a candy shop LOL -- "Oooohhh cranes.." - haha But it is sure great to see.

haha i know eh, Im hoping helladog will get us some pictures that he will post on here

[Dmajackson]

Originally Posted by kwajo

we might have 3 urban construction cranes at the same time!

Well you're doing better than Downtown Halifax. We haven't had a crane donwtown since Purdy's Wharf i believe. Of course this will change when the approved projects get underway.

Good Job Saint John!

[Haliguy]

Originally Posted by Bedford_DJ

Well you're doing better than Downtown Halifax. We haven't had a crane donwtown since Purdy's Wharf i believe. Of course this will change when the approved projects get underway.

Good Job Saint John!

Yes.. good job Saint John.

Bedford DJ I'm not sure if right about that. There has been a few construction cranes in the downtown core in the last few years.

[Wishblade]

Originally Posted by Bedford_DJ

Well you're doing better than Downtown Halifax. We haven't had a crane donwtown since Purdy's Wharf i believe. Of course this will change when the approved projects get underway.

Good Job Saint John!

actually the last was in 2007, with 8 or 9 going up hopefully in the near future.

[Dmajackson]

Originally Posted by Wishblade

actually the last was in 2007, with 8 or 9 going up hopefully in the near future.

The last one was for Armoury Square right? I was thinking more of below the Citadel as downtown...maybe i'm thinking of the wrong project though.

[Wishblade]

Originally Posted by Bedford_DJ

The last one was for Armoury Square right? I was thinking more of below the Citadel as downtown...maybe i'm thinking of the wrong project though.

Salters Gate was the last one. Anyway, sry for threadjacking.

[random11]

SAINT JOHN - The provincial government's investment will reach almost $44 million by the time the New Brunswick English-language medical education program is fully in place in 2013.

Those who were part of forging the historic deal are confident it will be money well spent.

Kathryn Hamer, whose term as UNB's vice-president Saint John ended July 1, was involved in the negotiations for the medical school, classes for which will be housed on the UNB Saint John campus. She calls the school a great credit to everyone on the UNB Saint John campus who was involved. She says she saw the program as a "real opportunity" for the campus, and a logical one given its proximity to the Saint John Regional Hospital.

"I would certainly see it as giving us a little shine on the map," says Hamer. "The number of campuses across Canada where satellite medical programs are being developed is still relatively small. We're among the first. It's a real credit to (Dalhousie University) that they were prepared to entertain this kind of possibility."

The province has budgeted $622,000 for the project for this fiscal year. These funds will assist with start-up costs for the school, including the search for a new dean. Another $1.9 million is forthcoming in the next fiscal year.

Then the real spending begins in the areas of infrastructure, technology and education.

An early estimate for the refurbishment of the Saint John site is $3 million, says Andrew Holland, a communications official with the Department of Post-Secondary Education, Training and Labour. This will prepare the building for the students it will have by 2011.

Costs, he says, are still being identified and confirmed.

"As we speak, the government of New Brunswick is still having discussions with the University of New Brunswick to find out what it will take to make the facilities adequate for Dalhousie," says Holland. These discussions will determine the exact amount of funding needed to update the facility.

The province will spend $4 million over the next two years to update the infrastructure of the host hospitals in Saint John, Fredericton, Moncton and Miramichi to prepare for the New Brunswick medical school students who will do clerkship terms in the third and fourth years.

Costs to set up IT services will be about $6.6 million over three years, from 2009-2011. And running costs for the first cohort of students in 2010 will be $5.3 million; for two cohorts in 2011, $6.5 million; for three in 2012, $7.8 million; and when all four years of medical students are in place by 2013, the cost to the provincial government will be $8.1 million annually.

These numbers are all in a tripartite agreement signed by the province, UNB and Dalhousie so that the medical school program will be guaranteed to launch in 2010.

"That's a confirmed date, no questions asked," says Holland.

Post-Secondary Education Minister Dr. Ed Doherty - an ophthalmologist by trade - says the project means a tremendous amount to him.

"Words can't express my excitement and my delight that this has been made possible with our government," says Doherty. "It was a tough fight. Medical education is expensive, but at the same time we must provide a facility in New Brunswick where we can train our own doctors.

"It was a long, arduous journey for me, but I'm still elated about the decision that government has made to fund medical education at an anglophone school in New Brunswick."

UNB's new VP Saint John, Robert MacKinnon, says the medical school not only builds on his concept of UNBSJ as a destination campus, but can help Saint John become a destination city.

"It's got some real positives on that front," says MacKinnon. "Studies have shown that a certain number of physicians stay in the communities through which they become connected by their studies."

He says it will help increase interest in some of UNBSJ's existing programs, such as its bachelor of health science.

There's also the potential for the school to develop a more defined pre-medical program, which MacKinnon suggests could be born from the school's biopsychology major.

MacKinnon also suggests that the incorporation of a medical school on the campus could bring on health-related research there.

He also calls it a good example of collaboration and partnerships UNB Saint John can build with the community and abroad.

"I see it as a step forward - for not only our campus, but for the city."