The future of Hamilton's public transit

[drpgq]

Originally Posted by drpgq

Does the HSR publish monthly ridership stats anywhere? I've read plenty of articles in US papers trumpeting public transit increases with the increasing cost of gas over the past two years. Seems like a gimme article for the Spec to write, although I might have missed it.

Ok, I hate quoting myself, but I asked for a Spec article detailing increases in public transit ridership and I got one today. Apparently however the HSR doesn't have the info yet. Great. Wouldn't they have some info like the number of monthly passes bought that they could compare rapidly?


Transit ridership climbing TheSpec.com - News - Transit ridership climbing
HSR, Hamilton police look for ways to maximize fuel efficiency

Dana Brown
The Hamilton Spectator

(Jul 12, 2008)

Two months ago, Laura Farr sold her car and said goodbye to nearly $600 in fuel and insurance costs weighing her down each month.

The Hamiltonian just couldn't deal with rising gas prices and decided transit was the best way to go.

"When they jumped up, it just became too much," she said.

Now, Farr, 25, uses GO Transit to shuttle herself between various sites in the Greater Toronto Area.

And she's not the only one. GO Transit has recently experienced an influx of riders, in part because of climbing fuel prices.

"Rising gas prices (are) definitely a factor," said Ed Shea, a spokesperson for GO Transit.

The trend started in February, when average weekday ridership shot up nearly 9 per cent. It's continued through May, which had a nearly 8 per cent increase in riders overall, compared with the same month last year.

The jump in transit ridership isn't limited to GO. Hamilton Street Railway also says it's noticed an increase in riders this year, although no firm numbers are available yet.

Skyrocketing fuel prices have hit the HSR hard. At the end of May, it had overspent about $190,000 on fuel. That number could climb to almost $900,000 by year's end.

In order to maximize fuel efficiency, the HSR and the city are training drivers in techniques to help get the biggest bang for the gas buck.

The HSR also has 12 hybrid buses, out of a fleet of 209, and is enforcing its anti-idling policy. The city is looking at alternative vehicles, such as heavy duty diesel hybrid trucks.

"We've been really preparing for higher fuel costs since 2002, when we first started hybrids," said Chris Hill, manager of the central fleet.

That has helped save on gas consumption, but rising diesel costs remain an issue for the city.

Hamilton also has contracts that allow it to buy gas and diesel at a discounted rate. City vehicles are filling up for about 15 cents less a litre, with a 25 cent discount on diesel. The rates are set monthly.

The contracts expire at the end of August and the city is getting ready to request bids for new ones.

Hamilton police, which uses the discounted fuel, are also projecting a shortfall of $50,000 to $100,000 in its gas budget this year.

Spokesperson Catherine Martin noted that summer has seen increased bike and foot patrols, as well as motorcycle use for traffic enforcement.

[email protected]

905-526-4629

[omro]

Originally Posted by markbarbera

Omro, are you an accountant?
Very well illustrated fare examples in your post.

Thank you. No not an accountant, but I should have been. I'm an IT Manager, am used to budgeting. I like financial planning - sad but true.

Originally Posted by markbarbera

One thing you may not have seen, and a little-known added-value bonus for all fellow GO Transit commuters. If you buy a monthly GO pass at the Hamilton GO Centre, you can get an HSR add-on for the pass (fancy sticker pasted to the front of the pass) for $15, entitling you to unlimited HSR travel for the month as well. A real deal, considering that to do the same in TO would cost you the full price of both GO and TTC passes. And you can include the HSR add-on in your income tax transit pass credit too.

I'll be sure to remember that if I have to commute to another town or city when I move to Hamilton. I really am hoping that I won't have to. That is a very good deal.

[omro]

Originally Posted by drpgq

Ok, I hate quoting myself, but I asked for a Spec article detailing increases in public transit ridership and I got one today. Apparently however the HSR doesn't have the info yet. Great. Wouldn't they have some info like the number of monthly passes bought that they could compare rapidly?

When the presto cards come into full effect, like our oystercards in London, they will probably do what they did here and compile incredibly detailed useage stats. These smartcards are tracking devices too. If I want I can get my full travel history for the past year.

With your system of tickets and transfers it's not really that possible to track who gets on where. However, with the smartcard that you have to touch on every time, they'll be able to get a much better picture. Unfortunately those stats will take some time to compile also.

[Berklon]

I take the GO everyday and I definitely take advantage of the HSR add-on price. $15 a month for HSR is a fantastic deal - especially considering without it I'd have to pay $79/month for an HSR pass + the $290/month GO train pass. $369/month is a lot of money, so paying $315 (while a considerable chunk of change) is much better.

The tax credits really help, at 15% - it winds up essentially refunding me 2 months worth of GO train passes. Every little bit helps.

As for increased ridership on the GO due to fuel prices, I see that first-hand.

Most GO commuters have a ritual where you sit on the same car when taking the train - so it's easy to see the increase in seats taken. In the morning out of Hunter street the upper level of the car I sit on has had roughly between 5-7 of the same people sitting on it by the time the train leaves the station. In the last few months that number has doubled when the train leaves.

Over the last few years the train is essentially "standing-only" when it allows passengers on in Oakville. The last few months it's been standing-only when people from Appleby board the train (2 stops before Oakville). Summers always see a reduction of commuters due to vacation time being taken, but the train is still full after Appleby passengers board. A few more months of rising fuel prices will probably see a full train when Burlington passengers board.

[drpgq]

Originally Posted by omro

When the presto cards come into full effect, like our oystercards in London, they will probably do what they did here and compile incredibly detailed useage stats. These smartcards are tracking devices too. If I want I can get my full travel history for the past year.

With your system of tickets and transfers it's not really that possible to track who gets on where. However, with the smartcard that you have to touch on every time, they'll be able to get a much better picture. Unfortunately those stats will take some time to compile also.

Full travel history? Wow that's impressive. I still hope the HSR would have access to some number, like the monthly fare box revenue, passes or tickets sold or something that could give us one scalar number, like a 5% increase in monthly passes sold or something.

[omro]

Originally Posted by drpgq

Full travel history? Wow that's impressive. I still hope the HSR would have access to some number, like the monthly fare box revenue, passes or tickets sold or something that could give us one scalar number, like a 5% increase in monthly passes sold or something.

I'm pretty sure the smartcards will allow them to track that sort of information. Whether they choose to, is another matter.

[matt602]

Yet the HSR still isn't putting the 40ft hybrid buses onto the correct routes. I still commonly see them on inappropriate routes like 4 Bayfront and a slew of weird mountain routes (Upper Sherman and Upper Gage often). They belong on 2 Barton. All of them.

Get smart, HSR. I figured they'd know a thing or two about hybrid technology if they were willing to buy 12 of them.

[JoeyColeman]

Originally Posted by matt602

Yet the HSR still isn't putting the 40ft hybrid buses onto the correct routes. I still commonly see them on inappropriate routes like 4 Bayfront and a slew of weird mountain routes (Upper Sherman and Upper Gage often). They belong on 2 Barton. All of them.

Get smart, HSR. I figured they'd know a thing or two about hybrid technology if they were willing to buy 12 of them.

Not to mention that the articulated buses are safely protected from passengers after 6pm. Those are hybrids as well. They should be moved onto high demand routes in the evenings. The hybrids should be the first buses out, last buses in.

Of course, this would require intelligence among HSR management ... sigh

[flar]

Originally Posted by matt602

Yet the HSR still isn't putting the 40ft hybrid buses onto the correct routes. I still commonly see them on inappropriate routes like 4 Bayfront and a slew of weird mountain routes (Upper Sherman and Upper Gage often). They belong on 2 Barton. All of them.

Get smart, HSR. I figured they'd know a thing or two about hybrid technology if they were willing to buy 12 of them.

They absolutely should be on 2 Barton but they won't put them there because "those people" don't deserve to use nice new things as much as the good people on the mountain. IMO, they should be planning light rail on Barton.

[omro]

Originally Posted by flar

IMO, they should be planning light rail on Barton.

Hear, hear. Totally agree, it would change the landscape of that road and it's surroundings. That whole area on either side is ripe for redevelopment.

Surely they would eventually consider putting an LRT down that road anyway, if the other LRT lines are successful, to service the Centre Mall and beyond?

[matt602]

Articulated hybrid buses need to be ordered for 2 Barton (and light rail later). Thankfully the HSR puts them on 1 King on the weekends instead of keeping them in the garage all weekend. They get some good use that way.

[SteelTown]

Once B-Line goes LRT the articulated buses will likely switch to Barton. Then you have a demand in a few years to have LRT for Barton. The whole cycle continues.

[raisethehammer]

we're ordering something like 12 or 16 more artics too. I think for B-Line and A-Line. Once LRT starts, these artics will be put into regular service, probably on Barton and other high volume routes.

[SteelTown]

With the new articulated buses for the B-Line they'll be a total of 19 articulated buses - 7 currently and 12 in the works (6 for A-Line). The ultimate goal for Public Works is to replace all of the buses on the King (13 buses) and Beeline Express (12 buses) and the University routes (3 buses) with new the articulated buses.

They'll be short on 9 buses but some of the King buses will likely go to new routes.

[miketoronto]

I find that interesting that people are switching over to GO Transit due to fuel prices.
I think it is great that people are taking transit, however I don't think taking transit saves that much money compared to driving, after you tag on the very high prices for GO Transit monthly passes from Hamilton to points in the GTA, and then tag on local transit fares, etc.

If you are paying over $300 bucks a month for transit, its probably cheaper to drive in the long run.

[JT Jacobs]

I think that GO transit is overpriced, but don't you think that driving is still much more costly when you factor in lease/car payments, insurance, registration, fuel, parking, and basic maintenance? It looks quite a bit more pricey than $300 a month.

[FairHamilton]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

I find that interesting that people are switching over to GO Transit due to fuel prices.
I think it is great that people are taking transit, however I don't think taking transit saves that much money compared to driving, after you tag on the very high prices for GO Transit monthly passes from Hamilton to points in the GTA, and then tag on local transit fares, etc.

If you are paying over $300 bucks a month for transit, its probably cheaper to drive in the long run.

Cheapest parking on the west side of the core is at Queen & Portland (until they start developing the Home Depot and condos on the parking lot that is) is $9/day. In the core parking runs $24 - $26/day.

The monthly GO Transit and HSR pass is $305.00, so there's no way driving is cheaper than the GO when you pay those parking rates.

[miketoronto]

But not everyone works in the CBD. There are a ton of people taking GO from Hamilton to places like Square One, and other suburban locations where parking is free.

Most people are not giving up their cars. So it just seems weird they would pay over 300 bucks to use transit with a car sitting in the driveway. Can't save that much money.

Again I am glad people are doing it. But it still amazes me people would spend that much
I guess it is just the Greater Toronto's areas weird transit culture. I even find it interesting people are park and riding from suburban park and rides to other suburban destinations.

I was in Hamilton last night. Rode the free Waterfront shuttle. Very nice ride.

What do you guys think of my COMMUTER XPRESS IDEA for Hamilton. Click on the link to see the map. Buses would only stop where the bus stop logos are. This would be a commuter service, not a local service. So that is why you will see a lot of park and ride lots.
http://maps.google.ca/maps/ms?hl=en&...,0.354309&z=12

[go_leafs_go02]

working on a coalition to get a bus pass to Mohawk College students, and if that was the case, I'm sure you'd see the LRT focus on Mohawk for a stop or two.

http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=24185534313

[Berklon]

Originally Posted by miketoronto

But not everyone works in the CBD. There are a ton of people taking GO from Hamilton to places like Square One, and other suburban locations where parking is free.

The vast majority of people who take Eastbound GO (from any of the stations) take it to Union Station. The ones who work in Mississauga or Oakville could still be driving there, but you have to remember that a GO pass that goes to Clarkson or Oakville station is cheaper than one that goes to Union - so they're still saving money. It's even cheaper if they take the train out of Aldershot or Burlington instead of Hamilton.

With current gas prices, GO is definitely cheaper in most cases than it is to drive.