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  #3261  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 1:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
This is the point of the whole ground zero "crisis"...



For most people, the rebuilding of the WTC is about rebuilding the office towers. But when you read headlines like "ground zero delays", and "WTC rebuilding plan scrapped", people get the impression that nothing is being done and the entire plan has been scrapped.
What it really comes down to is, the politicians made grandiose plans for memorials that are outrageously overblown and extravagant, even as they had no intention of ever making the tough political choices it would take to fund the damned things. Some things never change... and no, I don't "Got Hope" that they ever will.

At least the real attractions of the new World Trade Center - the towers - will rise no matter the politics and bureaucratic infighting.
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  #3262  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 2:06 AM
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Here's an editorial from my local paper:

Quote:
The debacle at Ground Zero
DEROY MURDOCK

In olden days, Americans need­ed just 13 and a half months to build the Empire State Building, four and a half years to build Hoover Dam, and six years, four months to install the Trans­continental Rail­road. And yet six
years, nine months, three weeks and three days have elapsed since 9/11, and Ground Zero remains an 80-foot-deep inter­national embarrassment for the Unit­ed States.

The government functionaries who fathered this fiasco should yield im­mediately and assign private devel­oper Larry Silverstein to arrange what already should have occurred: the Twin Towers’ return to Ameri­ca’s skyline.

The wholesale lethargy at Ground Zero became painfully clear in the July 1 report on the 16 acres where al-Qaida murdered 2,750 innocents:

■ Overall construction costs and schedules cannot be determined be­cause of 15 pending “essential deci­sions.” Until then, “we are not going to set new dates until we know ex­actly where this project stands,” said the report’s author, executive director Chris Ward of the Port Au­thority of New York and New Jer­sey, the public agency that controls the site.

■ Signature elements such as the Freedom Tower and 9/11 memorial will be incomplete 10 years after the attacks.

■ Reported cost overruns are at least $1.23 billion, and rising rapidly.
Having floundered under the hap­less “leadership” of former New York Gov. George E. Pataki and his clearly distracted successor, Eliot Spitzer, Ground Zero still lacks an effective administrative structure, Ward said. “This has led to indeci­sion that has resulted in significant schedule delays and cost escala­tion.”

He added: “If a project of this size and complexity were being managed by a single owner, with overall con­trol of the design and construction processes, it would be a much sim­pler story altogether.”

Right across Vesey Street from this shambles, veteran real-estate magnate Larry Silverstein produced 7 World Trade Center, an elegant, 52­story high-rise that glistens by day and glows by night.

Opened just four years and eight months after 9/11 and now 75 per­cent full, it is this lugubrious spot’s only sign of hope. Silverstein’s sky­scraper never hints that it stands where twisted debris smoldered for months.

The difference?
Silverstein manages this project with limited government interfer­ence. Conversely, 19 bureaucracies, from Manhattan to Albany to Tren­ton to Washington, wrestle with him at Ground Zero.

“For years, every public official yelled and screamed that no private developer should or could build on ‘sacred ground’ — that the Port Au­thority could do it more quickly and cheaply. Well, look how that turned out,” a Manhattan real-estate execu­tive close to the Ground Zero saga told me. “With 55 years’ experience, Silverstein knows how to build, and how to find tenants. If Larry had been allowed to do what builders do, the site would be completed by now.”

Silverstein signed a 99-year lease on the WTC just seven weeks before Islamofascists demolished it. Never­theless, politicians and pen pushers boss him around. So, they should make him this deal:

■ You bought it. You build it. You earn the rent from your tenants. We collect property taxes from you and commercial and sales taxes from them.

■ If you beat a mutually agreeable deadline, we pay you a bonus that in­creases the sooner you finish. Miss it, and you pay a penalty that grows the longer you delay.

■ Finally, restore the Twin Tow­ers. Public enthusiasm for this effort will propel its completion. And it’s the right thing to do.

Such blueprints already exist.
Twin Towers II, proposed by struc­tural designer Kenneth Gardner and the late Herbert Belton, an original WTC architect, mirrors the sorely missed high rises. Its buildings com­prise a 300-room hotel, 800 condo­miniums, 2 million square feet of retail and 8 million square feet of of­fices. These 1,450-foot, safety-en­hanced structures fit around the Freedom Towers’ foundation and feature 121 floors, 11 more than in their 1,360-foot predecessors. (Visit www.wtc2011.com.) “This is what people have asked for from the beginning,” Gardner notes. “Construction could be under way in six months, if we summon the will.”

The gaping chasm that is Ground Zero screams national paralysis.
Nothing more convincingly would signal to friends and foes alike the defiance of our Founding Fathers than to see the Twin Towers back where they belong — taller, stronger, and prouder than ever.

Deroy Murdock (deroy. murdock @ gmail.com) is a syndicated colum­nist and a media fellow with the Hoover Institution at Stanford Uni­versity.
After shaking my head for a moment at the silliness of yet another 'rebuild the twins' proposal, I realized that this plan is a bit different. It says that the twins should be built in addition to the current plans, not in place of them. It fixes something that always bothered me about the current plans for the wtc: despite all the new construction, it would barely replace the square footage that was lost, with no room for further growth. This is an option for that growth.
     
     
  #3263  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 4:37 AM
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^How can it fit around Freedom Tower's foundation if it's the proposal Donald Trump supported? It's a completely new complex altogether.
     
     
  #3264  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 5:23 AM
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Wow ! Twin Towers 2 !! I really like the Idea...
     
     
  #3265  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 5:29 AM
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Shoot.
I should have read the website first. From the editorial I got the impression that the new twins would be squeezed into the site plan where the memorial is currently planned, in effect becoming the memorial. Towers as a memorial instead of waterfalls as a memorial.

Just wishful thinking
     
     
  #3266  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 12:23 PM
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That plan is not new, and that isn't the first piece that guy's written on the subject. But what we WON'T do is turn this thread into a "rebuild the Twin Towers" discussion.
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  #3267  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 3:59 PM
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^And that would be greatly appreciated.
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  #3268  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 4:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philvia View Post
is the middle left the memorial floor?
and as you can see on middle right, the floor they're getting ready to pour is higher than the concourse floor....... can anyone repost that graphic that has all the subgrade stuff labeled? i can't remember the floor names or anything! lol
today they've added a lot more of those concrete columns.. looks to be about 10 now instead of 1 yesterday
     
     
  #3269  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 6:31 PM
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Progress is definetely moving foward, despite all of the negativity we so often hear.
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  #3270  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 8:00 PM
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Any idea of where in the Financial Center the underground connector will stem from? My guess is near the Winter Garden, as that is where the former overpass connected to.

I'm still hoping they hang on to that white one that connects into 1 WFC. I don't see any signs of them removing it, but who knows.
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  #3271  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 9:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyo View Post
Nice to read some positive comments on WTC1 from Cuozzo.

He's right about the PATH terminal. While I love the design and hope it gets built - it's a glorified subway stop for the Path from NJ. If it had some other use, such as a JFK link or NJ Transit commuter rail then it would deserve the structure.

It's sad to see the downtown transit hub a stone's throw away, which actually does serve as a major connection point for multiple subway lines, have its less-glamorous building get the axe.
Yes It's about high time this cat said something positive about it. Furthermore, I am sick and tired of these idiots in the media, reporting on nothing but cost overruns, delays and rumours of scaling back, and on and on.

JUST GET THE THING BUILT! AND WITH NO STOPPAGES IN BETWEEN!
     
     
  #3272  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 10:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Dac150 View Post
I'm still hoping they hang on to that white one that connects into 1 WFC. I don't see any signs of them removing it, but who knows.
I've heard this one mentioned a few times, is it the same one that lead to 6WTC? Or did they build an entirely new one?
     
     
  #3273  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 10:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by philvia
today they've added a lot more of those concrete columns.. looks to be about 10 now instead of 1 yesterday
They have also added the first cantilevered beam at the west end of the PATH corrider. Its very big...
     
     
  #3274  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 10:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dac150 View Post
Any idea of where in the Financial Center the underground connector will stem from?
My guess is near the Winter Garden, as that is where the former overpass connected to.
They've been working on that side for a while also. Older pics:






They haven't revealed the final design, but from what I remember the concept was something like the last
temporary PATH entrance, not a direct connection inside the WFC.
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  #3275  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 11:16 PM
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Has anyone else noticed that Cam 2 from Earthcam has been out for a while now, or is it just me?
     
     
  #3276  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 11:38 PM
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I mentioned that Cam 2 was gone in a July 3 post. Cam 1 was pointing to the sky for a few days, at least that one is now back to the pit.
     
     
  #3277  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2008, 11:48 PM
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By the way, looking at Cam 2 reveals that finally, a huge hunk of the old PATH terminal is gone, clear to the ground! Yes, there is progress!
     
     
  #3278  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2008, 3:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYguy View Post
Whoa! Is that glare from a camera flash or 7WTC? If that's Seven, I hope New York has an increased number of cloudy days in 2011+!
     
     
  #3279  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2008, 4:24 AM
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probably a combination of both
     
     
  #3280  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2008, 4:43 AM
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The glass facade on 7WTC is very reflective and shiny, so it must be the sun's glare bouncing off. I've taken pics from inside the Winter Garden of the site and never got the camera's flash reflecting off the windows there.
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