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  #1581  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 8:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Helladog View Post
Should make it the location of the next NB meet...(after SJ that is).
Sounds like a great idea...April anyone?

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The Taj Mahal, further down Main street has fantastic Indian food.
I've heard good things about it. I'm kinda spoiled for a white guy, getting authentic Indian food pretty much any day of the week at my fiancee's. Definitely not against trying it though.

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US Market? What US market? If I'm sitting in Boston or NY or New Jersey am I gonna come to Saint John or go to Atlantic City? What US market are you referring to...Maine?
Don't get too caught up on "tourism" and "markets". Casinos alone aren't large tourism generaters. The tourists that come to town will visit the casino and lose all their money there. The only extra tourism would be from within the province, PEI, and Cumberland County in Nova Scotia (in Moncton's case...Digby County in SJ's case). It'll be a benefit to the economy, but you won't see a huge spike in tourism from outside the region.
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  #1582  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 8:53 PM
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You sort of made my point for me, people are NOT going to come from Halifax to either location for a Casino, which sort of weakens your "centralized location" argument.

Like I said, I am not convinced SJ is the right location, I just dont see any good argument for Moncton.
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  #1583  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:08 PM
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RENOVATION PROJECTS ABUNDANT, NEW CONSTRUCTION OFF TO A SLOW START
February 2008 building permits total $2.9 million

March 12, 2008
For immediate release

MONCTON – A total of 33 permits valued at $2.9 million were issued in February 2008. This represents a 29.5% decline in total value when compared to the 36 building permits issued over the same period last year (valued at 4.1 million). A total of 61 permits valued at $4.2 million were issued so far this year compared to 79 permits worth $6.7 million in 2007. “The drop in construction activity so far this year is not a reflection of weak demand, but mainly due to severe winter conditions”, said Ben Champoux, Business Development Specialist with the City of Moncton. “We have 70,300 people currently employed in Greater Moncton compared to 65,100 twelve months ago, interest rates are dropping and consumer confidence remains strong; so expect construction activity to bounce back over the next few months”, added Champoux. All sectors of the construction industry were down in February when compared to last year. Commercial and industrial sector building permits were valued at $1.5 million while residential construction accounted for $946,000 in permits. The majority of building permits issued so far this year is for renovation projects, as opposed to new construction.

Highlights from February 2008 include:

• A $420,000 interior renovation project for the second floor of the new Lawton’s Drug Store on Mapleton Road;

• The renovation for the new Ambulance Dispatch on John Street, valued at $420,000;

• Improvement work on the 5th floor of the Crombie Property at 1234 Main Street, valued at $250,000;

• Fit-up to create RBC offices on the 6th floor at 633 Main Street, valued at $250,000.
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  #1584  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:16 PM
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Originally Posted by nwalbert View Post
You sort of made my point for me, people are NOT going to come from Halifax to either location for a Casino, which sort of weakens your "centralized location" argument.

Like I said, I am not convinced SJ is the right location, I just dont see any good argument for Moncton.

From KPMG : Casino Market Assessment Report.

"We conducted an analysis of potential revenue from destination casinos in Saint John and Fredericton using the same propensity, frequency and average spend assumptions to determine the optimum location for a destination casino in New Brunswick. Potential revenue, at $52.0 million, was highest in Moncton followed by $37.1 million in Fredericton and $34.7 million in Saint John. Moncton’s location and resident population bases make the City the logical choice for a New Brunswick destination casino."

If you want good arguments you could read the report. Moreover, it is the same firm (KPMG) that will deliver the next report.

http://www.moncton.org/search/english/CITYHALL/publications/finalcasinoreport.pdf
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  #1585  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:23 PM
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Originally Posted by nwalbert View Post
You sort of made my point for me, people are NOT going to come from Halifax to either location for a Casino, which sort of weakens your "centralized location" argument.

Like I said, I am not convinced SJ is the right location, I just dont see any good argument for Moncton.
It's either or for me personally (if this were NS, both would get one and probably Fredericton too). You're not going to get people from Halifax or the US to either location, and Jason-L's right that the cruise ships are a moot point, because almost all of them have casinos on board.

The one advantage Moncton currently has is a larger population base closer to the city, because of the Confederation Bridge and Cumberland County (the ferry ride might deter people from Digby County going, and there are times when it doesn't run too). It also has an advantage of better highway systems between it and the other population centres than SJ, though that's not SJ's fault and Hwy 7 not being done by now is absolutely ridiculous if you ask me.

You're basically only fighting for the NB market here, so nomatter where it's put, tourist-generation is going to come from north of the city.
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  #1586  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Smevo View Post
It's either or for me personally (if this were NS, both would get one and probably Fredericton too). You're not going to get people from Halifax or the US to either location, and Jason-L's right that the cruise ships are a moot point, because almost all of them have casinos on board.

The one advantage Moncton currently has is a larger population base closer to the city, because of the Confederation Bridge and Cumberland County (the ferry ride might deter people from Digby County going, and there are times when it doesn't run too). It also has an advantage of better highway systems between it and the other population centres than SJ, though that's not SJ's fault and Hwy 7 not being done by now is absolutely ridiculous if you ask me.

You're basically only fighting for the NB market here, so nomatter where it's put, tourist-generation is going to come from north of the city.
I agree with all your points. To add to whats been said above, the higher income and maybe the lower poverty rate (social impact) could help Moncton to get it. What's been the impact of the Casino on tourism in Sydney ?
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  #1587  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:41 PM
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NB casino proposals set to be unveiled

March 12, 2008 - 5:17 pm
By: News 91.9 Staff


FREDERICTON, NB - It's the news that has everybody talking - who is behind the proposals submitted for New Brunswick's first casino license?

The province had planned on releasing that information today but sometimes even the best laid plans fall through.

NB government spokesman Marc Belliveau says going through each proposal is taking longer than anticipated and he's not giving us any of the goods until each file has been carefully looked at.

Belliveau says representation was local, national and international.

While he wouldn't reveal what locations have been proposed for a casino, Saint John and Moncton are considered to be the front-runners.

The finance minister is expected to reveal details in the legislature on Thursday.
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  #1588  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 9:52 PM
nwalbert nwalbert is offline
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Originally Posted by Smevo View Post
It's either or for me personally (if this were NS, both would get one and probably Fredericton too). You're not going to get people from Halifax or the US to either location, and Jason-L's right that the cruise ships are a moot point, because almost all of them have casinos on board.

The one advantage Moncton currently has is a larger population base closer to the city, because of the Confederation Bridge and Cumberland County (the ferry ride might deter people from Digby County going, and there are times when it doesn't run too). It also has an advantage of better highway systems between it and the other population centres than SJ, though that's not SJ's fault and Hwy 7 not being done by now is absolutely ridiculous if you ask me.

You're basically only fighting for the NB market here, so nomatter where it's put, tourist-generation is going to come from north of the city.


I tend to agree with you. Seems like Sussex would be the ideal location.
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  #1589  
Old Posted Mar 12, 2008, 10:19 PM
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Ideal, maybe, logical, maybe. The thing is though, that's just not how New Brunswick politics works. Case and point: (And I stress that I'm not trying to promote Moncton here, just stating fact) Moncton Airport sees more passengers than all other airports in the province combined. Yet, because there's no dominant city in the province, the government pays to have and promote airports in two neighboring cities. Logically, an airport should have been built in a central location, and let original three close. Even as things are now though, an hour and a half drive (from Freddy to Moncton or SJ to Moncton) is not an unreasonable amount of time to drive to a major airport-just ask someone from Toronto.

The provincial government is terrified of someone saying they pick favorites so generally, every city gets the same things. When UdeM got a medical school through the university of Sherbrooke, Saint John got one soon after. I'm not saying SJ shouldn't have one, but it does seem a bit silly having two medical schools in a province so under populated. There's a hundred other examples of this.

In the case of a casino I bet $5 that if Moncton is chosen, Saint John will have one too within five years - and freddy soon after should they change their minds.
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  #1590  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 2:03 AM
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Originally Posted by HalifaxMtl666 View Post
I agree with all your points. To add to whats been said above, the higher income and maybe the lower poverty rate (social impact) could help Moncton to get it. What's been the impact of the Casino on tourism in Sydney ?
There's been practically no impact on tourism from the Casino. They visit it when they're in town, but it's hasn't increased the city's tourist draw any. The Casino mostly draws from the area itself, and if anybody makes any "significant" trip to get to it, they still come from the Island (mainlanders tend to go to the Halifax one since the Canso Strait sits almost exactly half way on the trip from Sydney to Halifax in terms of travel time). Tourists come for other reasons, and just decide to visit the casino while they're here.
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  #1591  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 3:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Smevo View Post
There's been practically no impact on tourism from the Casino. They visit it when they're in town, but it's hasn't increased the city's tourist draw any. The Casino mostly draws from the area itself, and if anybody makes any "significant" trip to get to it, they still come from the Island (mainlanders tend to go to the Halifax one since the Canso Strait sits almost exactly half way on the trip from Sydney to Halifax in terms of travel time). Tourists come for other reasons, and just decide to visit the casino while they're here.
Frankly, I think this is whats going to happen here too, the reason why I want it downtown. I mean I dont really believe in that sort of "tourism resort". Lets do it Downtown (If Moncton get it), it will come along with a Convention Center/Hotel and others things that could help to dramaticly change the core.

Last edited by ErickMontreal; Mar 13, 2008 at 4:06 AM.
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  #1592  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 3:36 AM
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  #1593  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by mylesmalley View Post
Ideal, maybe, logical, maybe. The thing is though, that's just not how New Brunswick politics works. Case and point: (And I stress that I'm not trying to promote Moncton here, just stating fact) Moncton Airport sees more passengers than all other airports in the province combined. Yet, because there's no dominant city in the province, the government pays to have and promote airports in two neighboring cities. Logically, an airport should have been built in a central location, and let original three close. Even as things are now though, an hour and a half drive (from Freddy to Moncton or SJ to Moncton) is not an unreasonable amount of time to drive to a major airport-just ask someone from Toronto.

The provincial government is terrified of someone saying they pick favorites so generally, every city gets the same things. When UdeM got a medical school through the university of Sherbrooke, Saint John got one soon after. I'm not saying SJ shouldn't have one, but it does seem a bit silly having two medical schools in a province so under populated. There's a hundred other examples of this.

In the case of a casino I bet $5 that if Moncton is chosen, Saint John will have one too within five years - and freddy soon after should they change their minds.
It's interesting that you made this point, because that is exactly opposite to what Mike Murphy is currently doing with the health system, I agree with you, about everyone having to have the same thing which is ridiculous, but at least they are streamlining the health system. Some don't like the idea, but it makes perfect sense, it's gonna save NB a lot of administration costs.
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  #1594  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by JasonL-Moncton View Post
It's interesting that you made this point, because that is exactly opposite to what Mike Murphy is currently doing with the health system, I agree with you, about everyone having to have the same thing which is ridiculous, but at least they are streamlining the health system. Some don't like the idea, but it makes perfect sense, it's gonna save NB a lot of administration costs.
Well it is and it isn't. Moncton, SJ and the north might not have got the same things, but notice how he gave every city (except Freddy, oddly enough) a piece of the pie. There would have been hell to pay if Moncton didn't get anything out of it, or the north shore, or Saint John.

As for the restructuring, I'm not going to make an opinion until I see the results. Change for teh sake of change isn't the right way to go about things and I get the impression a lot of the time that that's all they're doing. The new ambulance service was touted as being a money saver, being more efficient, and providing better care. However, the cost is easily double what it was with teh 38 independent providers, and there isn't much evidence of better service.
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  #1595  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 2:31 PM
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Bets placed on N.B. casino
Provincial gov't delays release of potential developers to further study proposals

By Jesse Robichaud
Times & Transcript Staff
Published Thursday March 13th, 2008
Appeared on page A1

FREDERICTON - All bets are still off on the potential location and developer of the casino that will open in New Brunswick in 2010.

The province's casino sweepstakes began officially on Tuesday at 2 pm when the deadline set by the province to receive casino project proposals from developers expired.

Shrouded in secrecy, the proposals were received in sealed boxes and were transported to an undisclosed site yesterday where they were opened.

The Liberal government was scheduled to disclose the names of the developers who are bidding on the casino project yesterday, but plans changed once the boxes were opened and the enormity of the sensitive task became apparent.

Indeed, as officials sifted through the loads of information required by the province's stringent request for proposals (RFP) process, including a $50,000 deposit from each proponent, the logistics of the overall process have forced Department of Finance officials to postpone the announcement until today or tomorrow.

Moncton and Saint John are looked upon as the frontrunners in the high stakes contest between business interests in both cities as they jockey for an advantage over their still anonymous competition.

Despite the tight-lipped approach of the provincial government toward the selection process, which is being kept at arm's length from the cabinet table, spokesman Marc Belliveau concedes there is fierce competition within the province.

"We aren't oblivious to what's going and we know there are some regions battling over other areas," he said.

"The government is very pleased with the interest shown in the RFP. The people who have made proposals are local, national, and international."

While Metro Monctonians will have to wait until May before they learn whether a casino will be built in their backyard, local residents seem to be split on where a casino should be built within Metro.

While some, including Downtown Moncton Inc, believe a casino could be the jolt the city's core needs to spur development, others believe a project on the city's outskirts would be a greater asset to help the city attract visitors and more downtown investment.

On the flip side of the coin, the potential social effects of a downtown casino has been pointed to as a potential disturbance to the downtown's current vitality by some critics.

A City of Moncton commissioned feasibility study conducted in 2002 by the KPMG accounting firm projected that a downtown casino would likely cost $33 million and generate $55 million per year in revenues, creating 400 jobs.

While Moncton has dominated the discussion over the best fit for a casino, there have been some whispers over the advantages of projects in Dieppe, and even as far away as Shediac.

After all, Finance Minister Boudreau has said the province's decision to legalize the construction of a casino in the province was based on a desire to boost the province's tourism numbers.

However, the 2002 KPMG study estimated that the lion's share of the casino's clientele would come from locals rather than tourists, with $17 million of the annual $55 million pay dirt coming from residents living within 30 minutes of the casino. In fact, 950,000 of the casino's visitors would come from residents living within 2.5 hours of the casino, and would contribute $52 million of the casino's annual $55 million revenues.

According to the same projections, only 43,000 visitors spending $3.2 million would be actual tourists.

Since the RFP was released, two groups have emerged publicly as contenders for a casino project in Moncton.

Toronto-based Verdiroc has expressed interest in building a casino on the former Beaver Lumber property in downtown Moncton. The company holds an option on the eight acre property.

The firm has also stated its intention to develop a downtown convention centre, restaurant, and a performance venue for downtown.

Another group, known as Chateau Royale, is looking at several locations in Metro Moncton, but none are located downtown.

The group is backed by New England interests, and has been working with city council on its proposal for more than 18 months.

Talk of a proposal to build a racino in Saint John in order to stimulate the harness racing industry in that city seems to have fizzled according to sources close to the industry.

Leading up to the casino's 2010 opening, the province's gambling policy will cut the total number of video lottery terminals from 2,660 to 2,000, and limit the number of locations where VLTs can be accessed from 625 to 300 as a means of addressing problem gambling.

VLTs will be removed from restaurants by 2009, but government officials say the $135 million in revenues that are currently pumped into government coffers won't decrease due to the cuts.

However, with up to a maximum of 800 slot machines being added to the province's gambling mix wherever the casino is built, the number of VLTs and slots in the province could exceed the current number of VLTs.

And despite the Liberal government's promise to double the $750,000 currently spent on gambling addiction treatment services, there is still some opposition to the construction of a casino due to the social problems similar projects have caused elsewhere.

The city that gets the nod in the casino sweepstakes will also see the number of VLTs diminished, as the government's policy states that a "maximum of 20 per cent of the VLTs in the video lottery program will be permitted within the casino market area."

It is anticipated that the range will be set at between 80 and 100 kilometres of the community in which the casino complex is located, which would represent a large proportion of southeastern New Brunswick if a Metro casino project is chosen.

The previous Conservative government of Bernard Lord flirted with the idea of a casino, but was defeated in the 2006 election before it released its own long-awaited gambling policy which would have stated a clear position.

When the new casino opens in 2010, New Brunswick will become the ninth Canadian province to authorize a casino.

While the government is banking on competition within the market to decide what casino mix will be most profitable -- based on a ratio of a possible 60 points allocated for the casino's business case, and 40 points allocated for the potential economic impact on the region -- there are some parameters.

For example, developers can pick a number between 400 and 800 slot machines. By comparison, Casino Nova Scotia in Halifax contains 750 machines, while its sister casino in Sydney features 338.

Boudreau has been clear in stating that additional services and attractions around the casino, such as a race track, theatre, hotels, or arena, will play a big role in the province's final decision, which will be made by international accounting firm KPMG.

The choice will then be confirmed by the Liberal cabinet, which won't be made aware of the location where the winning choice is made.
_______________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Moncton permits down
Severe weather conditions slow down building activity

By Brent Mazerolle
Times & Transcript Staff
Published Thursday March 13th, 2008
Appeared on page A12

And you thought Metro Moncton's endless winter only had you depressed. Now it seems to have had the same effect on construction in Moncton, at least when you look at a snapshot of building permits for snowy February.

A total of 33 permits valued at $2.9 million were issued in February, a 30 per cent decline in total value when compared to the 36 building permits issued over the same period last year (valued at $4.1 million). Last February, though cold, saw very little snow on the ground.

Ben Champoux, a business development specialist with the City of Moncton, said yesterday, "the drop in construction activity so far this year is not a reflection of weak demand, but mainly due to severe winter conditions."

Champoux pointed to a number of economic factors to suggest the February decline is likely just a hiccup.

"We have 70,300 people currently employed in Greater Moncton compared to 65,100 twelve months ago," he said. "Interest rates are dropping and consumer confidence remains strong, so expect construction activity to bounce back over the next few months."

Indeed, last year's February permit numbers had been the best since 2003, and even though the 2008 figures are lower, they are still significantly better than the $1.7 million worth of permits issued in the mild February of 2006.

All sectors of the construction industry were down in February when compared to last year. Commercial and industrial sector building permits were valued at $1.5 million while residential construction accounted for $946,000 in permits. The majority of building permits issued so far this year is for renovation projects, as opposed to new construction.

Among the biggest were one that could in fact arguably be considered new construction, a $420,000 interior renovation project for the second floor of the new Lawton's Drug Store on Mapleton Road;

A renovation for the new ambulance dispatch centre on John Street was also valued at $420,000. Improvement work on the fifth floor of the Crombie Property at 1234 Main Street and work to create RBC offices on the sixth floor of 633 Main Street were valued at $250,000 each.

So far this year, a total of 61 permits valued at $4.2 million have been issued, compared to 79 permits worth $6.7 million at this time last year.
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  #1596  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 5:09 PM
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Finance
Four proponents submit bids for destination casino project (08/03/13)

NB 304

March 13, 2007

FREDERICTON (CNB) - The Lotteries Commission of New Brunswick today announced that four proponents have submitted proposals to construct, equip and operate a destination casino complex in the province.

Finance Minister Victor Boudreau said he was pleased that there are a good number of companies which have submitted bids.

"In a province of our size, this is an excellent representation of interested bidders," Boudreau said. "The next step is the evaluation of the proposals. We are pleased that the RFP process is proceeding according to plan."

The proponents are as follows (in alphabetical order):

Proponent:
CEI Investment (New Brunswick) Corp.
Team Members:
Carabetta Enterprises, Inc.
Century Resorts International Ltd.

Proponent:
Dieppe Resort and Casino Limited
Team members:
Buttcon Energy Inc.
Dundee Realty Corporation
ADI Group Inc.

Proponent:
Maritime Casino ULC
Team members:
Paragon Gaming Inc.
New Millenium Equities, Inc.
Ashford DG Holdings, Inc.
Cyr Holdings, Inc.
Marriott Hotel International

Proponent:
Sonco Gaming New Brunswick Limited Partnership
Team Members:
Sonco Gaming New Brunswick Limited
Navegante Group Inc.
Clairvest Group Inc.
2050631 Ontario Inc.

The next stage is for the proposals to undergo a rigorous evaluation. Teams will evaluate the proposals against pre-set criteria. The evaluations will also go in front of a due diligence panel. The entire process is being monitored by KPMG, an international process consultant who is also acting as the fairness monitor for the initiative.

On Nov. 8, 2007, the Province announced its new Responsible Gaming Policy. The policy was based on several pillars which included cutting the number of video lottery terminals in the province from 2,650 to 2,000; increasing its responsible gaming programs and research; strengthening its charitable gaming policy and issuing an RFP for a destination casino. The casino complex is expected to be operational no later than Dec. 31, 2010.

New Brunswick would be the eight province to have a destination casino complex in Canada. Proponents were asked to include ancillary services in the proposal which could include but not be limited to: a standard-bred horse racing facility, hotel, performance theatre, meeting or trade convention facility, special events venues, restaurants, lounges or specialty restaurants, or recreation facilities. A copy of the Responsible Gaming Policy can be found at: http://www.gnb.ca/0162/gaming/gaming_policy-e.asp.
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  #1597  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 6:05 PM
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Sigh...

Pics or it didn't happen.
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  #1598  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 6:21 PM
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I don't even care about pics, I just want details about where each proposal is specifically located.
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  #1599  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 6:24 PM
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I don't even care about pics, I just want details about where each proposal is specifically located.
Well, I think the first three are proposed in Moncton.

1) Magnetic Hill
2) Dieppe
3) Downtown
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  #1600  
Old Posted Mar 13, 2008, 6:39 PM
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Well, I think the first three are proposed in Moncton.

1) Magnetic Hill
2) Dieppe
3) Downtown
Yeah I figured, there hasn't seemed to be much public interest in pursuing the casino idea in Saint John I guess we're too busy with our other developments right now which are either unrelated (industrial) or already planned (Coast Guard site, North of Union, etc.), whereas Moncton is looking for the project to be a major piece of a new development.
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