CHICAGO | Boom rundown - everything over 12 floors. v5

[Eventually...Chicago]

I went to a ULI event this morning about the state of the hotel market in chicago. It was all very positive. The hotel sector should be strong for many years to come in the city. The panelists were:

Peter G. Dumon, President, The Harp Group, Inc.
Scott Greenberg, President & Co-Owner, ECD Company
John W. Rutledge, President & CEO, Oxford Capital, LLC

All three generally agreed on a few things of interest to this forum:
- The mandarin oriental will probably not break ground for several years, but will probably get build and be a great property. They anticipate it opening in 2012-2013.
- I can't remember which one said this (i'm pretty sure Mr. Rutledge) but this is a near exact quote regarding the shangri-la "i'm not really into rumor mongering but my understanding is that they have financing to go a little be farther than they are now, but nothing for the rest"
- Again i think Mr. Rutledge said this but, they are the ones converting the lower 25 floors of the IBM building into a ultra-luxury hotel. He said although trump did take some of the views, the building still has great view corridors.
- The hotel cass will be renovated soon by someone.
- The Olympic bid and the exchange rate have done wonders for international tourism in chicago, particularly european, but also asian tourists.
- With regards to memorial day bookings in hotels... Millennium Park ranks 3rd only to Midtown Manhattan and the Las Vegas strip in terms of rates and occupancy levels.
- The whole panel agreed that trump tower is a masterpiece when compared to the rest of trumps buildings and they credit SOM, Adrian Smith, and the city for making the building not suck. (i think they used the word 'terrible')
- They think mayor daley is doing a great job and are very positive on the prospect for office, residential and hospitality projects for the downtown area for several years to come.
- The credit crunch has only really removed a few dabblers and highly leveraged players.
- Apparently the hotel sector tracks GDP growth very well throughout history. Particularly because unlike residential leases or office leases, hotels have leases that last one night. Because of this, they can adjust their rates to reflect the current economic environment. Hotel rates are at all time highs, as well as occupancies. They believe that this downturn is not too bad and in the broader outlook, probably desirable, considering the debt service some developers had and the property inflation in some sectors.
- They all adamantly agreed that hotel condos are a bad idea except in 2 or 3 traditional vacation spots (vail, miami beach,..) that get incredibly expensive at a certain time of the year.

That is all i can remember now, if i recall anything else or if i 'misremembered' something (thanks roger clemens for that one) i'll post again.

[cbotnyse]

^ wow several years for mandarin oriental?

great info, thanks.

[Eventually...Chicago]

A few more points that i forgot to report...

- They believed the chicago, high-end hotel market, and hotel market in general, to be vastly under built.
- They raved on about McCormick Place and the incredible job McPier does in attracting conventions. They talked alot more about this. If anyone has a specific questions, ask me and i'll let you know if they discussed this.
- They all thought orlando sucks. And in this instance, i do think they used the word "suck"

Also with regards to the mandarin oriental, they did stress that it was their opinion. But these guys are in that industry so i'll take them at their word until i have a reason to do otherwise.

[simcityaustin]

Eventually, thanks for the great info. Some very interesting stuff there.

[TowerGuy37]

least the panels on Burnham Pointe are painted concrete!!!!!!!!!!!!! That in itself gives this project points even if they were unattractive!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Mr Downtown]

I don't think they are. From close up they look like metal. Notice the dents near the slab fasteners in the second photo.

[Nowhereman1280]

Originally Posted by Eventually...Chicago

- The Olympic bid and the exchange rate have done wonders for international tourism in chicago, particularly european, but also asian tourists.
- With regards to memorial day bookings in hotels... Millennium Park ranks 3rd only to Midtown Manhattan and the Las Vegas strip in terms of rates and occupancy levels.

I have noticed the surge in European tourism here. I was just talking to a friend the other day about how it seems that everyone in the area (Chicago and Michigan) seems to be talking in European languages all of the sudden. It was never like that a year ago, but over the last few months the number of people speaking German and French and the likes seems to have soared around here.

Also very interesting about the MP area being 3rd most booked, hope it continues to grow!

[Mojava]

Originally Posted by Eventually...Chicago

I went to a ULI event this morning about the state of the hotel market in chicago. It was all very positive. The hotel sector should be strong for many years to come in the city. The panelists were:

Peter G. Dumon, President, The Harp Group, Inc.
Scott Greenberg, President & Co-Owner, ECD Company
John W. Rutledge, President & CEO, Oxford Capital, LLC


- The hotel cass will be renovated soon by someone.

Is this a mis-quote or are these guys not up on their current events. The hotel cass has already completed renovations and is now the hotel cass, a holiday inn express.

It certainly discounts some of the other things they said.

http://www.casshotel.com/

[emathias]

Originally Posted by Mojava

Is this a mis-quote or are these guys not up on their current events. The hotel cass has already completed renovations and is now the hotel cass, a holiday inn express.

It certainly discounts some of the other things they said.

http://www.casshotel.com/

Yeah, I was just about to chime in with that.

It's possible they or the poster meant the Hotel Wacker, which just started a remodel from basically a transient hotel to a boutique hotel (which will be back-to-back with the Skybridge Suites).

[Alliance]

Originally Posted by Eventually...Chicago

The whole panel agreed that trump tower is a masterpiece when compared to the rest of trumps buildings and they credit SOM, Adrian Smith, and the city for making the building not suck. (i think they used the word 'terrible')

Oh relativity...Einstein would be proud.

But on the whole, very good news! Thanks for the report.

[Eventually...Chicago]

Originally Posted by Mojava

Is this a mis-quote or are these guys not up on their current events. The hotel cass has already completed renovations and is now the hotel cass, a holiday inn express.

It certainly discounts some of the other things they said.

http://www.casshotel.com/

I could be wrong on that then.

Get a grip, not to stick up for people i don't know but they have about 10 billion reasons why what they say is probably true.

[emathias]

I apologize if I missed previous discussion and this is old news - maybe this is listed somewhere and I've missed it, but I didn't see it in the rundown and don't remember seeing it talked about in this forum before, but there's a Lasalle-Illinois-Hubbard highrise proposal with PDF linked to from the River North Residents' association development page.

That proposal looks pretty decent for the site. It could be bigger and denser, but overall I don't think it totally sucks. (such a ringing endorsement, right?) They build around the existing landmarked building that currently houses "English," a new pub.

There are also a few links on that page to more detailed info on various River North projects, including one a few months old (so maybe it's been revised) that shows that Clark hotel project to indeed take up the whole block. I'm hoping it's just an old plan and the current plan is to preserve the smaller existing building on that block.

[the urban politician]

Terrapin loses stake in Greektown location
FORECLOSURE AUCTION | Latest setback for troubled investor

February 29, 2008
BY DAVID ROEDER [email protected]
Terrapin Properties LLC, a financially troubled investor in condominiums, lost its stake Thursday in a Greektown development site where the grocery chain Roundy's Supermarkets could make a major investment.

Seymour Taxman, president of Skokie-based Taxman Corp., bought Terrapin's interest in the deal for about $600,000 in a foreclosure auction. Taxman and a Terrapin affiliate had been 50-50 partners in the site at the northwest corner of Halsted and Monroe.

The auction is the latest setback for Terrapin, an active builder on the Near West and Near South sides that could be headed for dissolution. Its partners have been sued as personally liable for a delinquent debt of about $13 million for a condo project in Kenosha, Wis.

Taxman said that with Terrapin out of the picture, he intends to move forward on the deal quickly. He needs first to draft plans that will win neighborhood support for a zoning change.

He said his project will have two parts: a retail building along Halsted with a mostly glass facade, designed by Antunovich Associates to be a focal point, and a taller commercial building on Madison west of Halsted. The commercial piece, possibly for a hotel or offices, would go up west of a former bank building at 801 W. Madison that is up for landmark consideration by the city.

Read the rest below:
http://www.suntimes.com/business/818951,CST-FIN-terrapin29.article

[Taft]

Not sure if this is news, but it was news to me...

I was on the River North Residents' website today (http://www.rivernorthresidents.com/development.htm) and noticed this tidbit about Wolf point:

Crain's Chicago Business recently reported that "...a joint venture including the Kennedy family and a Texas developer aims to transform a long-vacant riverside property just west of the Merchandise Mart into a massive hotel, residential and office project anchored by an 89-story skyscraper..."

...

RNRA has been advised that this announcement was premature and that there are no imminent plans for development of the site. We will continue to monitor the situation and post updates when available.

Not sure if there is any merit behind the statement or if this jives with the facts as those on SSP know them...

Taft

[honte]

Originally Posted by emathias

I apologize if I missed previous discussion and this is old news - maybe this is listed somewhere and I've missed it, but I didn't see it in the rundown and don't remember seeing it talked about in this forum before, but there's a Lasalle-Illinois-Hubbard highrise proposal with PDF linked to from the River North Residents' association development page.

Thanks for this. This is the kind of project that really makes you want the market crash to come faster. Crappy painted concrete (again), fake Arts and Crafts parking garage at the base, little respect for the LaSalle canyon. What a shame... I hope it doesn't happen.

[VivaLFuego]

Originally Posted by honte

Thanks for this. This is the kind of project that really makes you want the market crash to come faster. Crappy painted concrete (again), fake Arts and Crafts parking garage at the base, little respect for the LaSalle canyon. What a shame... I hope it doesn't happen.

In terms of overall form, shape, density etc. it seems like a decent proposal, but you're right about the architectural merits, especially the utterly indefensible parking blob base. I can deal with painted concrete, and the height along LaSalle (which actually, in the 6-7 story range, is reasonably within the scale north of Hubbard Street.

[honte]

^ Yes, it's true that the scale issue is complex. Without any clear sense of direction for River North from the city (eg resistance to landmarking mercantile buildings near the river, no visionary master plan) it's hard for a designer to know what to respond to. Seems like this proposal is taking the "relate to the lofts and pretend there is no tower" response.

[jjk1103]

...this may have been discussed a few pages back, but what is the problem with MoMo ? .......it seems to have topped out ........then stalled ?

[Eventually...Chicago]

^^^Yeah, i've been wondering about that too. You figured that thing should be swingin' by now. I'll have to look at it this weekend...

[jjk1103]

Originally Posted by Eventually...Chicago

^^^Yeah, i've been wondering about that too. You figured that thing should be swingin' by now. I'll have to look at it this weekend...

....they seem to have just stopped putting any glass in the center section on the East side......there has got to be some sort of problem