ATLANTA TRANSIT (Marta, Beltline, Peachtree Streetcar, LovJoy Commuter, etc...)

[Atlriser]

Having just returned from New Orleans/Sugar Bowl where they have a streetcar running down the center of Canal Street: How bout this idea? They want Peachtree to become a symbol for Atlanta then plan for it accordingly. Make it a true pedestrian corridor by placing the streetcar down the middle lined by trees and wide wide sidewalks. Leave 1 outside lane in each direction for local vehicle traffic and a bike lane each way. Make it pedestrian focused and then it might just become a shopping and dining mecca and a true 24 hour environment....think Barcelona's shopping districts or any European city. Eliminate the car as much as possible and let people walk and take the street car for local trips. We'd probably see the density grow rapidly with more condo towers and see the street level fill with new shops and restaurants.

Let the streetcar help the Mile become a reality.

[wxjay]

Originally Posted by Atlriser

Having just returned from New Orleans/Sugar Bowl: How bout this idea? They want Peachtree to become a symbol for Atlanta then plan for it accordingly. Make it a true pedestrian corridor by placing the streetcar down the middle lined by trees and wide wide sidewalks. Leave 1 outside lane in each direction for local vehicle traffic and a bike lane each way. Make it pedestrian focused and then it might just become a shopping and dining mecca and a true 24 hour environment....think Barcelona's shopping districts or any European city. Eliminate the car as much as possible and let people walk and take the street car for local trips. We'd probably see the density grow rapidly with more condo towers and see the street level fill with new shops and restaurants.

Let the streetcar help the Mile become a reality.

What? Get rid of.. *gulp* LANES? REDUCE vehicle traffic??? What Atlantan blasphemy...

[atl2phx]

Originally Posted by Atlriser

Having just returned from New Orleans/Sugar Bowl where they have a streetcar running down the center of Canal Street: How bout this idea? They want Peachtree to become a symbol for Atlanta then plan for it accordingly. Make it a true pedestrian corridor by placing the streetcar down the middle lined by trees and wide wide sidewalks. Leave 1 outside lane in each direction for local vehicle traffic and a bike lane each way. Make it pedestrian focused and then it might just become a shopping and dining mecca and a true 24 hour environment....think Barcelona's shopping districts or any European city. Eliminate the car as much as possible and let people walk and take the street car for local trips. We'd probably see the density grow rapidly with more condo towers and see the street level fill with new shops and restaurants.

Let the streetcar help the Mile become a reality.

i agree. canal street is a good example. denver also has a decent rendition of a pedestrian corridor along 16th street.

[trainiac]

Originally Posted by Atlriser

Having just returned from New Orleans/Sugar Bowl where they have a streetcar running down the center of Canal Street: How bout this idea? They want Peachtree to become a symbol for Atlanta then plan for it accordingly. Make it a true pedestrian corridor by placing the streetcar down the middle lined by trees and wide wide sidewalks. Leave 1 outside lane in each direction for local vehicle traffic and a bike lane each way. Make it pedestrian focused and then it might just become a shopping and dining mecca and a true 24 hour environment....think Barcelona's shopping districts or any European city. Eliminate the car as much as possible and let people walk and take the street car for local trips. We'd probably see the density grow rapidly with more condo towers and see the street level fill with new shops and restaurants.

Let the streetcar help the Mile become a reality.

I love dipping into old travel guides. One of my favorites is a guide to Europe circa 1949.... you can surely imagine some of the warnings. One I still have is a beautiful guide to the major cities of the US from 1955 and at that time they say "it is one of the widest thoroughfares in the world, 171 feet, and brilliantly lit." If only Peachtree had that luxury of space. Although, I remember staying on the opposite side of Canal from the quarter on one trip and it was a major pain walking all the way across to get to anything to do.

[Fiorenza]

Battles Shaping Up For DOT Seats As '08 Session Nears

[RobMidtowner]

The opposition to this section seems like NIMBYism to me....any thoughts?


Residents despair at choice of Beltline route

By PAUL DONSKY
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 01/15/08

To outsiders, it doesn't sound like much of a dilemma: Should a Beltline trail planned at Tanyard Creek Park in Buckhead be built on the west side or east side of the namesake stream?

But the question is crucial for some neighborhood residents and park advocates, who say the eastern route would cut through too much of the park's central meadow, a cherished swath of green space used for pick-up football games and Frisbee tossing that's also the site of a bloody Civil War battle.

Some residents wanted the path to stay out of the park altogether.

But after several years of bitter debate, a compromise was reached to support the west side route, leaving the meadow untouched.

But Beltline officials now say that option is too costly and would require the removal of many trees, possibly endangering the stream bank. They are recommending the east side route.

A final decision is expected to be made Tuesday when Beltline officials meet with city department heads.

Community leaders, who learned of the Beltline staff's position last week, are outraged.

"The Beltline has been promoted as a best-in-class, a world-class attraction," said Steven Hart, a member of the Collier Hills Civic Association who serves on several Beltline community advisory groups.

"The Beltline could be, and should be, much more than the simplest and cheapest way of conveying bicyclists from one end of the park to the other."

The path would connect several parks in the area and serve as a segment of Atlanta's Beltline, the city's $2.8 billion effort to redevelop old railroad corridors into a loop of transit, trails and parks.

Hart said he can now stand in the meadow, turn in a complete circle and only see green space and trees. A concrete bike and walking trail, with benches and trash cans, will forever change the park's character, he said.

Beltline officials said the east side path travels along the edge of the meadow, preserving most of the green space. The 12-foot path also will have a 3-foot landscaped buffer.

Terri Montague, president of BeltLine Inc., said the engineering and environmental challenges posed by the west-bank route proved too great.

"The community came forward with great energy, but we would be remiss to ignore these other considerations as we go forward," she said.

[Andrea]

Originally Posted by RobMidtowner

The opposition to this section seems like NIMBYism to me....any thoughts?

Yes. For one thing, neighborhood residents don't feel like they've been adequately included in the process. And while most people are in favor of parks and increased connectivity, not everyone agrees that the Beltline is the panacea for all neighborhoods. Collier Hills and Tanyard Creek Park aren't in the same circumstances as, say, where the Beltline crosses Murphy Avenue. Collier Hils is a one of the most mature, well settled and meticulously maintained neighborhoods in Atlanta. The people who live there have made very substantial investments in their community and have fought hard to create a high quality of life. They've already dealt with many urbanizing pressures.

The historic aspect of this area is not to be discounted either. Someone remarked that the Civil War was fought over every square inch of Atlanta, and while that's arguably so some of most critical and costly battles were fought right there at Peachtree Creek.

But the neighborhood still yielded, and agreed to a compromise with the Beltline people to support a route on the west side of the park. Now the Beltline claims that's too costly and wants to change the deal.

All things considered, don't you think the residents in that area have a pretty good point?

[Atlriser]

Well said Andrea. The whole idea of the Beltline is for the communities to get involved in the process and create upon the success city wide of some of the neighborhoods like Collier Hills. Why is it such a big deal if the residents of the area want the trail on one side of the park and they have valid reasons for the city to not work with them and quite the opposition by reaching an agreement everyone can accept.

Not all areas of the beltline are clear cut. In Grant Park and Choosewood it's very clear where the beltline will fall in my neighborhoods. In others it's not so clear cut and if parks already exist then the city should work to increase the amount of continuous usable green space instead of cutting up existing parks just for the sake of a straight trail. I don't think that idea is absurb honestly.

[RobMidtowner]

Originally Posted by Andrea

Yes. For one thing, neighborhood residents don't feel like they've been adequately included in the process. And while most people are in favor of parks and increased connectivity, not everyone agrees that the Beltline is the panacea for all neighborhoods. Collier Hills and Tanyard Creek Park aren't in the same circumstances as, say, where the Beltline crosses Murphy Avenue. Collier Hils is a one of the most mature, well settled and meticulously maintained neighborhoods in Atlanta. The people who live there have made very substantial investments in their community and have fought hard to create a high quality of life. They've already dealt with many urbanizing pressures.

The historic aspect of this area is not to be discounted either. Someone remarked that the Civil War was fought over every square inch of Atlanta, and while that's arguably so some of most critical and costly battles were fought right there at Peachtree Creek.

But the neighborhood still yielded, and agreed to a compromise with the Beltline people to support a route on the west side of the park. Now the Beltline claims that's too costly and wants to change the deal.

All things considered, don't you think the residents in that area have a pretty good point?

I'll admit that I'm not completely versed in all the specific details of this section of the Beltline, but from what I gather the residents are upset about a concrete path with benches and trash cans going alongside the park and creek (which would have less environmental impact than tearing through the trees and brush on the western side of the creek). I guess I just don't see how a minor concrete path with benches and trash cans will be damaging or take away from the existing park. Most parks in the city have paths through them so what's the big deal? I mean it's not like we're talking about rerouting the train tracks through the park or anything. By separating the trail and park with the creek, it appears they don't want this park connected to the trail at all. And in fact, the article says "Some residents wanted the path to stay out of the park altogether." Hence the NIMBYism comment.

[Andrea]

Well, my guess is that the Beltline's going to do whatever it wants anyway, regardless of what the neighborhood says. After all, it's only Buckhead.

[Atlriser]

But the question is why not leave the park and place the trail across the creek with a few wooden bridges connecting into it. If the park is used for football games and such like they claim why destroy the residents use of it by building a concrete path in the middle of it? I'm not versed but I do know how the city will ram things down the throat of a neighborhood with poor intentions often.

[Atlriser]

City made decision and Tanyard is getting trails through middle eliminating the meadow in the park! Done move on....lol I guess

[Andrea]

Originally Posted by Atlriser

City made decision and Tanyard is getting trails through middle eliminating the meadow in the park! Done move on....lol I guess

"Approvals? We don't need no steenking community approvals!"

[Andrea]

What everyone knows. Atlanta has always been and continues to be grossly neglected as compared to the rest of the state.

Report: Atlanta districts shorted on road funding

Since fiscal 2000, Georgia has been required by state law to divide most transportation funding equally among its various congressional districts.

But that hasn't happened, according to a Jan. 17 report presented by Gena Abraham, new commissioner of the Georgia Department of Transportation, to the GDOT board.

The report found wide disparities between the number of transportation dollars allocated to some metro Atlanta congressional districts versus others elsewhere in the state, particularly in south Georgia.

Critics have contended for years that GDOT spends too much on work outside the metro area and too little on badly needed projects inside it, where congestion is the second-worst in the nation.

In the first year of the practice, known as congressional balancing, every district was supposed to receive at least $112 million, according to Abraham's report. But one metro district got just $84 million.

Over the next two and a half years, that same district was to have received a minimum of $186 million -- but got only $125 million, while two south Georgia districts racked up $301 million and $364 million.

Even as recently as the 18-month period that ended in December 2006, another metro Atlanta district got only $202 million (the minimum was supposed to be $284 million), while a south Georgia district received $538 million.

The disparities continue today. Every metro district is projected to receive the minimum allocation of $853 million for the five-year period that began in 2007, and some are expected to get hundreds of millions of dollars more.

But others, whose footprints are primarily outside the Atlanta region, are budgeted even higher. One is slated to get $1.4 billion; another, $1.7 billion.

"Most states set up objective criteria about where the roads need to go," [GDOT board chairman Mike Evans] said. "It seems to be kind of an odd concept around here."

[smArTaLlone]

By PAUL DONSKY
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 01/30/08

Greg Gingras lives in a Midtown condo and loves public transit — which makes him just the kind of person backers of a plan to return streetcars to Peachtree Street need on their side.

But Gingras, one of several hundred people who attended a series of community forums on the Peachtree Streetcar project this month, says he's not yet sold on the proposal.

He wonders whether the city would be better served by improving the MARTA rail system, which he uses every day. And while streetcar planners say they want to turn Peachtree into a glittering urban thoroughfare like those in New York and Chicago, Gingras, 45, notes those cities don't have streetcars.

"If [the Peachtree streetcar] was there today, I'd probably love it," said Gingras, a sales manager. "But there's a cost to putting it in. Is that the best use of the money?"

Ten miles of track on two main lines: Peachtree in Midtown and downtown, and a loop linking tourist hot spots like the Georgia Aquarium and the Martin Luther King Jr. historic district.

To cover the $190 million cost of construction, a special tax district would be created around a few blocks of the tracks, raising property taxes by 2 to 3 mills on businesses and multifamily homes — $240 to $360 a year for the typical owner of a $300,000 condo.

Single-family homes in the area would be excluded. In addition, the city would kick in $47.5 million.

Some residents and business owners urged the city to start building the tracks as soon as possible, while others feared the project would be a disaster with too few riders to justify the expense.

Many residents liked the concept but complained the tax plan didn't include single-family homes — even those close to the streetcar line.

At least one idea will likely be included in the final proposal, said Ray Christman, chairman of the Peachtree Corridor Partnership. Residents who live in the tax district would receive some sort of "free ride" card.

The proposal, being pushed by Atlanta Mayor Shirley Franklin, soon may head to the Atlanta City Council for consideration. The political waters may be rough. Atlanta City Council member Mary Norwood, who attended several of the meetings, suggested that residents in the proposed tax district be allowed to vote on the plan.

Another potential hurdle: a potentially large deficit facing the city, which could make it difficult for the city to pay its share of the tab.

Residents who packed four community meetings raised a number of issues about the streetcar project.


Here are some of the most frequently asked questions:

Q: Why doesn't the proposed special tax district include single-family homes that are only a few blocks from Peachtree?

A: Streetcar planners say they wanted to limit the tax district to a few blocks on either side of the tracks, figuring that would cover the residents most likely to use the service. Most homes in nearby single-family neighborhoods fall outside that boundary, and planners did not want to divide those neighborhoods.

Q: The streetcar will be used by people from across the city, so why should only those living right on the corridor have to pay for it?

A: People living close to the rail line should shoulder more of the cost than other residents, planners say, because they stand to gain the most — by being able to use the service more often and by seeing property values rise once the streetcar is in place.

Q: With streetcars traveling on two of Peachtree's four lanes, won't traffic get much worse?

A: Not necessarily. Streetcar supporters say some people now driving will instead take the streetcar. And drivers traveling through the area may need to start using one-way streets that parallel Peachtree.

Q: Why do we need the streetcar system, when the route roughly parallels the MARTA subway line?

A: The two systems serve different purposes, streetcar backers say. MARTA's rail system, featuring large, cumbersome stations, is built to carry riders at high speeds over long distances, similar to a commuter rail line. The streetcar will be much easier to hop on and off and is designed for people traveling short distances that may be too far to walk but not far enough to warrant a drive.


1945 photo at the intersection of Pryor and Forsyth streets.

[Andrea]

Originally Posted by smArTaLlone

1945 photo at the intersection of Pryor and Forsyth streets.

Love that photo. My Mom and Dad met at a streetcar stop in downtown Atlanta not long after the war.

Transitus, ergo sum.

[Fiorenza]

Was it "love at first sight"?

[Andrea]

That's what my Dad always claimed, Fiorenza. My Mom's recollection of the matter is a little more ambivalent.

[trainiac]

The Depot opened last night! The old Atlanta & West Point freight depot on Memorial at the Beltline. They did an amazing renovation!! Kudos to everybody involved with saving this building. They installed a beautiful bar along most of the west side of the building and the kitchen, bathrooms and offices are in an added extension on the back. They have a surprisingly large parking lot. Triumph lofts across the beltline are still coming along -- seems to be taking a long time!

There are quite a few eateries at least "sort of facing" the Beltline now: Park Tavern, One Midtown Kitchen, Two Urban Licks (patio faces it), Rathbun Steak (patio faces it), Rathbuns, and now The Depot (deck faces it). Am I forgetting any?

[Andrea]

How about Fratelli, on Bennett Street? I haven't been there in forever, but it used to be jumping.

You're right about the Depot. I looked in the window a couple of weeks ago and it was looking sharp.