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  #761  
Old Posted May 17, 2007, 5:55 PM
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Nice photos of 360 and Monarch above, looks like they are coming along nicely. I have a quick question for you guys when calculating possible building heights. I think I read somewhere on this forum that the average floor to floor height for a commercial highrise is about 13.6 feet. For condos I was thinking it would probably be more like 12 feet from floor to floor (assuming a 10 ft interior ceiling). Does that sound about right? Any feedback would be appreciated.
     
     
  #762  
Old Posted May 17, 2007, 6:32 PM
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That sounds about right. Typically office towers do have higher floor-to-floor heights because they have a lot more wiring, atleast that's one of the reasons I've heard.

There is an average of course for office towers vs residential and hotel towers, but I think really it depends on the building. For an example, The Shore which is a 22-story tower going up in the Waterfront District has 10 foot floor-to-floor heights starting on the 7th floor and going to the 19th floor. Those are the typical residential levels. Then the 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 20th and 21st levels have 11 foot floor-to-floor heights. Those are garage levels and the upper floors which are a bit more ritzy, so they have higher ceilings. The lobby level is 15 feet, (1st floor), the 5th floor is 9 feet, the 22nd floor, the penthouse level is 13 feet. Then the mechanical penthouse level, (elevator shed and air conditioning shed), is 20 feet high.

So even in one building not every level is 10, 11, 12 or 13 feet in height, it just depends on the use of that floor and the building itself regarding the design/style and use and level of luxury. If you've ever seen a photo of the penthouse residential levels in the Hilton here in Austin they have very high ceilings. It probably has 12 foot ceilings, and that's not counting the height of floor-to-floor which refers to the distance of the concrete slab of one floor to the next one above it, "floor-to-floor".
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  #763  
Old Posted May 17, 2007, 6:56 PM
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Thanks for the info Kevin, that helps a lot.
     
     
  #764  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 4:11 AM
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T. Stacy tower inching closer to reality...

Stacy makes first move to clear the way for Congress Avenue project

Bank branch to move; Stacy says long-delayed venture closer to reality



By Shonda Novak
AUSTIN AMERICAN-STATESMAN
May 18, 2007



Austin developer Tom Stacy says he is clearing the way for his ambitious mixed-use project at Congress Avenue and Fifth Street, which is to replace a modest four-story bank building with a dramatic 47-story skyscraper.

Step one has been to relocate the tenants from the smaller building to the 26-story office tower next door, which Stacy also owns.

The biggest tenant, Bank of America, will move its downtown branch and other operations into the office tower in December. Most of the other tenants in the smaller building also will relocate to 515 Congress.

When Stacy announced the plans in December 2004, he said his goal was to break ground in early to mid-2006, with a late 2008 opening.

But Stacy said it has taken longer than expected to relocate the bank and other tenants.

"It's taken us a couple of years just trying to get all the ducks in a row to keep things moving," he said.

The new Bank of America lease, which took two years to negotiate, was particularly complex, mainly because its existing site is a regional banking center that houses multiple operations, Stacy said.

The announcement of the project was front-page news. At the time, it was the biggest and most ambitious project proposed for downtown, with stores, offices, a 10-story hotel and uas many as 350 apartments and condominiums. Last year, Stacy unveiled a dramatic design by the renowned Pelli Clarke Pelli architectural firm.

Stacy has since simplified the project, eliminating the hotel and apartments and focusing on two levels of retail, 200 condominiums and 330,000 square feet of office space.

Stacy said he has no projected timetable for starting the project with financial partner Walton Street Capital. He said he will continue watching the market, particularly demand for office space, to determine a start date.

He said mixed-use projects like his are complex because there has to be a market for all the components at the same time.

"Even if the condo market stayed hot forever, we still have to have the office market strong enough to support a new building," Stacy said.

Although downtown's office market continues to strengthen and rents are rising, "rents are still not at a point to support high-rise construction," he said.

The condominium market also has become more competitive, with a wave of projects either planned or under way. Work is expected to start this year on the 55-story Austonian luxury condominiums on Congress at Second Street, and on the 30-story Four Seasons Residences on Town Lake, among other projects.

Stacy's plans include a 13-story, 1,200-space parking garage in the block behind his proposed project. It will include a new Bank of America drive-in branch on the ground floor, a high-end restaurant and shops on the Fifth Street side.

Kenny Wilson, president of Bank of America's South and Central Texas operations, said the bank's new facilities will have state-of-the-art amenities such as conference rooms that can serve a variety of functions.

In addition to his planned high-rise, Stacy recently added to his downtown holdings.

He has purchased most of the land beneath Littlefield Mall, an apartment, retail and parking garage structure at Sixth and Brazos. Through a ground lease, he will receive rent from the owners of the Littlefield Mall.

"It's just a good position to try to buy everything in that block," Stacy said.

And for the second time, Stacy is about to become part-owner of Austin Centre at Eighth and Brazos. He will join Walton Street Capital in the purchase, which includes a 354,000-square-foot office tower and the Omni Hotel.

The sale is expected to close next week, Stacy said. The owner, Crescent Real Estate Equities, is selling all of its Austin properties.

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AUSTIN (City): 1,002,632 +4.64% - '20-'25 | AUSTIN MSA (5 counties): 2,620,945 +14.78% - '20-'25
SAN ANTONIO (City): 1,548,422 +8.03% - '20-'25 | SAN ANTONIO MSA (8 counties): 2,813,140 +9.97% - '20-'25
AUS-SAT REGION (MSAs/13 counties): 5,434,085 +12.24% - '20-'25 | *SRC: US Census*
     
     
  #765  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 6:35 AM
LiveattheOasis LiveattheOasis is offline
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Sounds like Stacy is still dragging his feet ... though at least this is progress. We do need more office space downtown though, so I do hope this is done soon.
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  #766  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 3:30 PM
DTAustin DTAustin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tuffaso View Post
Nice photos of 360 and Monarch above, looks like they are coming along nicely. I have a quick question for you guys when calculating possible building heights. I think I read somewhere on this forum that the average floor to floor height for a commercial highrise is about 13.6 feet. For condos I was thinking it would probably be more like 12 feet from floor to floor (assuming a 10 ft interior ceiling). Does that sound about right? Any feedback would be appreciated.
This might help if you are doing calculations. The 360 floors are 7.5 inches thick.
     
     
  #767  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 3:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LiveattheOasis View Post
Sounds like Stacy is still dragging his feet ... though at least this is progress. We do need more office space downtown though, so I do hope this is done soon.
Dragging his feet? I really don't think so.

There are/were lease contracts involved at the current site. Tom could not just stroll on in and tell everyone, "Thanks, but it's time to pack up and leave...NOW!"

Also, the market demands are beginning to change. There is a growing need for more office space in Austin's CBD which may lead to a large income potential for him. He's just trying to figure out how to maximize this potential! I'm not going to doubt his intent on constructing, possibly, Austin's tallest building. Nor do I think he really wants to through away the few million dollars he's already spent on this project!
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AUSTIN (City): 1,002,632 +4.64% - '20-'25 | AUSTIN MSA (5 counties): 2,620,945 +14.78% - '20-'25
SAN ANTONIO (City): 1,548,422 +8.03% - '20-'25 | SAN ANTONIO MSA (8 counties): 2,813,140 +9.97% - '20-'25
AUS-SAT REGION (MSAs/13 counties): 5,434,085 +12.24% - '20-'25 | *SRC: US Census*
     
     
  #768  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 4:04 PM
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I've always wondered this, but why is it that building destined for commercial purposes have so much thicker concrete floor plates than residential hi-rises?

Case in point, the old Intel building had floor plates that looked to be able 2' thick, and 360's floor plates are very thin in comparison.
     
     
  #769  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 6:49 PM
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Well at least its some news, Ive been waiting for news on that project for a long time. I wonder if he eliminated the hotel and apartments, Does that mean the building will not be as tall as origionally announced or is he replacing that part with office space. Also I would have liked to see a 3 level retail element to it but I guess he figured it wasnt needed. Also will the design of the building be changed? I guess some of these answers we will find out in time.
     
     
  #770  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 7:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jdawgboy View Post
Well at least its some news, Ive been waiting for news on that project for a long time. I wonder if he eliminated the hotel and apartments, Does that mean the building will not be as tall as origionally announced or is he replacing that part with office space. Also I would have liked to see a 3 level retail element to it but I guess he figured it wasnt needed. Also will the design of the building be changed? I guess some of these answers we will find out in time.
The hotel and apartment components are gone, at least for the time being. He seems to have reallocated those parts of the building to office space - greatly expanding the total office SF in the tower (330,000 SF).

I believe Tom is contemplating the total number of condo units as well as the possibility of even more office space.

As for the height of the building, I would be surprised if it shortened. Remember, the average floor-to-floor ratio is usually larger in office buildings than in hotel/apartment/condo buildings. Thus, if he keeps the tower at 47 stories and apportions more space to offices, then we may be looking at an even taller building than the one currently being proposed.
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AUSTIN (City): 1,002,632 +4.64% - '20-'25 | AUSTIN MSA (5 counties): 2,620,945 +14.78% - '20-'25
SAN ANTONIO (City): 1,548,422 +8.03% - '20-'25 | SAN ANTONIO MSA (8 counties): 2,813,140 +9.97% - '20-'25
AUS-SAT REGION (MSAs/13 counties): 5,434,085 +12.24% - '20-'25 | *SRC: US Census*
     
     
  #771  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 7:38 PM
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If he is going to keep anything, it should be the hotel portion.
     
     
  #772  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 8:35 PM
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Totally agree Kirby,

There is a shortage of hotel and office planned in Austin... pleny o condo.

I am shocked he dropped the hotel out of the mix and am happy he increased the office portion.
     
     
  #773  
Old Posted May 18, 2007, 9:24 PM
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Originally Posted by ATXboom View Post
Totally agree Kirby,

There is a shortage of hotel and office planned in Austin... pleny o condo.

I am shocked he dropped the hotel out of the mix and am happy he increased the office portion.
Will there still be a shortage of hotel rooms in 4-5 years? That looking less and less likely almost every week. W, VanZandt, Marriot(s), Twelve(s)... etc. Plenty of condos too no doubt, but he probably has a much better market study/forecast than most of us.

Of course, I totally agree that would be a sweet spot for a hotel, but maybe it's easier to unload/warehouse condos than startup and run a luxury hotel at less than sub-optimal capacity. I don't really know myself.
     
     
  #774  
Old Posted May 19, 2007, 3:29 PM
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Anchors for the 2nd phase of The Domain have been anounced; a 200,000 sq ft-3 story Dillards (Austin's 5th), Dick's Sporting Goods (1st of at least 2 planned in Austin area), an upscale 8 screen theater and a Westin Hotel. I believe this is planned for the southern end of the development, closer to Braker Lane? Here's an article from today's paper:

http://www.statesman.com/business/content/business/stories/other/05/19/19dillards.html


Dillard's to open fifth Austin store at Domain

Movie theater, Dick's Sporting Goods also moving into center.

By Shonda Novak, Lilly Rockwell
AMERICAN-STATESMAN STAFF
Saturday, May 19, 2007

Central Texas is getting a fifth Dillard's store, as part of an expansion of the upscale Domain shopping center in North Austin.

The new part of the center, which is scheduled to open in the spring of 2009, will have a 200,000-square-foot, three-story Dillard's store, along with a Dick's Sporting Goods and also a movie theater with eight auditoriums.

Indianapolis-based Simon Property Group Inc. announced the tenants Friday.
The first part of the Domain, which opened in March, includes a Neiman Marcus, a Macy's and a variety of high-end retailers, plus office space and 390 luxury apartments that are integrated into the outdoor shopping center.

The new section is expected to encompass 300,000 square feet of shops and restaurants, 75,000 square feet of office space, 350 luxury apartments and a Westin hotel.
Dillard's Inc. has three stores in Central Texas: at Highland Mall, Barton Creek Mall and Lakeline Mall.

A fourth store will co-anchor the Hill Country Galleria shopping center in the Village of Bee Cave. That center is scheduled to open in September.
A news release from Simon says the store's design and merchandise will reflect the department store chain's "renewed focus on upscale and contemporary fashion."
Dillard's did not return calls Friday.

Jill Rowe, president of Rowe Investments, an Austin-based retail brokerage, said it's common to see a Dillard's near a Macy's.
"While they compete, the synergy complements one another also," Rowe said. "It will make the area an even more dominant trade area. "
Rowe said Dillard's has been aggressive in Central Texas, "positioning themselves as a leader in all of the dominant trade areas of Austin."

"I predict we will see additional expansion from them in the near future in the suburbs," she said. "The region can easily support the Domain store, as well as additional stores in outlying areas."
"The Domain area is positioned to be the dominant retail trade area of Austin. This is only the beginning."

Dick's, a Pittsburgh-based sporting goods chain, will enter the Austin market with its 75,000-square-foot, two-story Domain store.
The company, which had $3.1 billion in sales last year, has 294 stores but plans to grow to as many as 800.

The chain sells a full-line of sporting goods including traditional bats and gloves, shoes, elliptical exercise machines and golf equipment, including indoor driving ranges.

Dick's recently acquired Golf Galaxy Inc., which is a major competitor to Austin-based Golfsmith Inc.

The Domain's movie theater will be a Village Roadshow Gold Class Cinema.
Simon says the theater will be "unlike anything else offered in Austin," with food and alcohol served in its auditoriums that each will seat about 40 people.

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  #775  
Old Posted May 19, 2007, 9:49 PM
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I had some more fun with the panoramic images.

and yes the Frost building some how did not merge right but you get the point, I'll keep trying.



     
     
  #776  
Old Posted May 19, 2007, 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Mopacs View Post

The Domain's movie theater will be a Village Roadshow Gold Class Cinema.
Simon says the theater will be "unlike anything else offered in Austin," with food and alcohol served in its auditoriums that each will seat about 40 people.
I'm very curious about this new movie theater. I did some research and it looks like Village Roadshow is a chain based in Australia with no current locations in the USA. The concept they want to open at the Domain is something along the lines of a very highend Alamo Drafthouse where the seats are individual and extra large (think La-Z-Boy), reclining, and comfortable, and the theaters themselves are relatively small. Drinks and dinner can be purchased and eaten in the theater.
     
     
  #777  
Old Posted May 19, 2007, 11:17 PM
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^ Cool! The Monarch looks sweet there.
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  #778  
Old Posted May 20, 2007, 1:14 AM
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^ Ivanwolf I'm trying to figure out where the 2nd picture was taken from, it's not often I see the Hyatt swallow up that much of the horizon. But I can't think of how you got such a high view from the south side.
     
     
  #779  
Old Posted May 20, 2007, 5:19 AM
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^ Ivanwolf I'm trying to figure out where the 2nd picture was taken from, it's not often I see the Hyatt swallow up that much of the horizon. But I can't think of how you got such a high view from the south side.
Was it the parking deck beside the Long center?
     
     
  #780  
Old Posted May 21, 2007, 12:58 PM
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Here's another round of shots taken over the weekend (5/20):

Monarch...








360...





Windows going in...







From across the river @ Town Lake Park





From South Austin





From Zilker Park...







The Shore...



The Shore from the Frank Erwin Center (looking down Red River @ 19th/MLK):



UT's Hotel and Convention Center (looking W down 19th/MLK)



From Frank Erwin Center



Monarch...from the Erwin Center, behind the east wing of the Capitol

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