Broadway Subway - Millennium Line Extension to Arbutus | U/C

[WarrenC12]

Any chance they will re-open some of these areas 1 block at a time?

What's going on with the property at the SE corner of Quebec and Broadway. I forgot the temporary road sliced through the corner. Will that be re-aligned? Who is the property owner?

[Lexus]

Originally Posted by logicbomb

Really hate the road dieting they are doing along Broadway. It's good in theory but you know people will illegally stop in no-stopping areas to load and unload leading to more congestion.

once market recovers, there will be construction happening next 50 years, hence never ending lane closures...
I'd rather have better pedestrian infrastructure....

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Lexus

once market recovers, there will be construction happening next 50 years, hence never ending lane closures...
I'd rather have better pedestrian infrastructure....

That's an argument to keep a parking lane though isn't it? Personally I'm against parking on Broadway, and I think construction should be forced to utilize side streets wherever possible and keep main road interruptions to a minimum.

[Migrant_Coconut]

I believe the plan (so far) is only four lanes at the station blocks; Burrard, Birch, Willow, Alberta et al will still be six lanes.

That said, if somebody would really rather spend even more time in Central Broadway traffic than just use the brand-new giant subway, I don't think anybody can help them.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

That said, if somebody would really rather spend even more time in Central Broadway traffic than just use the brand-new giant subway, I don't think anybody can help them.

The subway is not a replacement for E-W Broadway traffic. Only a portion, and only for specific use cases.

Neither is a bicycle before we hear that nonsense.

[madog222]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

What’s going on with the property at the SE corner of Quebec and Broadway. I forgot the temporary road sliced through the corner. Will that be re-aligned? Who is the property owner?

I believe it’s just being leased by the project for construction use; it was still operating as a used car lot during the first few years of the station construction.

The owner has been planning to renovate the existing building for a restaurant space. A decade ago they applied to build a six storey, 25 unit rental building.

As the curb there needs to be rebuilt I think it’s safe to assume it will be rebuilt to the new standards.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

The subway is not a replacement for E-W Broadway traffic. Only a portion, and only for specific use cases.

Neither is a bicycle before we hear that nonsense.

It's literally a replacement for the majority of road users that are on the 99, that is a replacement for E-W traffic.

And yes a bicycle is also a suitable way to get across town, I'm not sure why you think otherwise. You should try it sometime.

There's still plenty of road left for the privileged minority that for some reason gets a majority of road space.

[AlessioSBT]

The problem is not only the parking or the lanes. The problem is the usual idea to create these "great streets" without doing absolutely anything about it.

The few changes we see now are basically just a consequence of the skytrain construction. And they are in fact mostly limited to the skytrain station blocks. If it wasn't for that there would probably be no change in broadway at all, regardless the Broadway Plan.
All these plans are based on the private sector doing everything in the future. And the city expects everything to happens by itself.
But this means a bunch of private businesses at the beginning have to take all the risk in trying to open something and make the street an actual place where people want to go. If no one is willing to take the risk (like right now with a bad economy) nothing will happen (just look at mount pleasant).

This is the opposite of what Europe does. Where if there's a project like this the whole Broadway would be re-made from scratch and once it's done it would be a place where people would want to go and only after that, as a consequence, businesses would want to open there.

And this without counting the usual car-centring north American way of living. Yes they reduce a few lanes, so lucky, it's not like I'm still gonna eat on the patio with a truck speeding up 5 inches from my plate.
The only comparable (to Europe) thing that I saw here is the recent work on Robson and Bute. Where they reduced the lanes to the minimum and put a sidewalk that cover everything and "melts" with the road.
Now take that block, apply it from Main to Granville (completely closing at least 3 or 4 minor intersections) and maybe it would be a great street.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

And this without counting the usual car-centring north American way of living. Yes they reduce a few lanes, so lucky, it's not like I'm still gonna eat on the patio with a truck speeding up 5 inches from my plate.

Considering how absolutely car-centring users on this board are, I don't think you'll get much agreement that not having any cars and trucks on Broadway is the best path forward, but I wholly agree with your statement. This is a generational investment opportunity that the CoV and Province are botching to cater to a minority of road users on this corridor (that residents on this corridor will hardly be able to use, since most towers proposed have less than a single parking space per unit, some with zero). It's maddening.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Friendly reminder that 7th and 10th exist, and will likely be getting upgrades; I can personally confirm that 7th is very scooter-friendly. Let the buses have Broadway.

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

This is the opposite of what Europe does. Where if there's a project like this the whole Broadway would be re-made from scratch and once it's done it would be a place where people would want to go and only after that, as a consequence, businesses would want to open there.

Cool. Evidently, we do not have Europe's budget (especially with the current council).

[mcj]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Friendly reminder that 7th and 10th exist, and will likely be getting upgrades; I can personally confirm that 7th is very scooter-friendly. Let the buses have Broadway.

Cool. Evidently, we do not have Europe's budget (especially with the current council).

What does 7th and 10th have to do with making Broadway a great street that people want to spend time on? and therefore make businesses want to invest in?

And the city is absolutely be capable of rebuilding Broadway (if they weren't how the heck would road investment ever even happen?), and thanks to the way the city budget works they absolutely could just do that if they wanted to, all it would do is slightly increase property taxes. But yes, ABC Vancouver is unwilling to do this, hopefully we see a more progressive council in October.

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Friendly reminder that 7th and 10th exist, and will likely be getting upgrades; I can personally confirm that 7th is very scooter-friendly. Let the buses have Broadway.

Cool. Do we have Europe's budget?

This is how it works in small cities of 50k people. 50k. If they can do it we can do it.

It's not even that expensive and it's not a matter of money.
On Broadway you could literally start with $0 simply doing this:

- 4 lanes fixed everywhere (no constant lane changes every 2 meters)
- 4 minor intersections completely closed and leave the businesses there the freedom to expand chairs, table and even live music during the day (I'm not gonna even try to say night).

They literally did this as experiment in all those random areas around the city already, with the difference that here it would actually makes sense. Because those 4 area would act as magnet for the first businesses, then from there the "economy" of the street would start to grow by itself.

And then only in the future, if everything works, they can slowly renovate those area.

Again, like they literally already did, in higher numbers even, in another areas here in Vancouver, therefore it cannot be a matter of money.
This was main until a few years ago:


Same thing, but instead of doing it in a bunch of random areas around the city you actually plan a "real plan" and you do it on 1 major street with 4 intersections at the same time. This would have been a real upgrade for broadway. This + the new skytrain stations and here you go, an entire new great street.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by mcj

What does 7th and 10th have to do with making Broadway a great street that people want to spend time on? and therefore make businesses want to invest in?

That's what the wider sidewalks should be for: trees, benches, patios and other walkability improvements to make Broadway a destination in itself instead of just a throughway.

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

It's not even that expensive and it's not a matter of money.
On Broadway you could literally start with $0 simply doing this:

And we can try out said trial closures once the subway's actually open. Not much point in making big sweeping plans when half of Central Broadway is still a construction zone.

[AlessioSBT]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

And we can try out said trial closures once the subway's actually open. Not much point in making big sweeping plans when half of Central Broadway is still a construction zone.

Absolutely but I don't think it will happen, even after the skytrain.

For this to work you need to do close them all at the same time. Broadway is a big place, there would be no "synergy" of any kind if we randomly close 1 street at the time. And I don't know how many people at the city hall are willing to face so many car-centric people at the same time.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by AlessioSBT

And I don't know how many people at the city hall are willing to face so many car-centric people at the same time.

Even ABC is thinking about kicking buses off Granville for good at the moment, so there's a more-than-even chance that Broadway loses its parking lanes for at least one summer.

If it's any consolation, Vancouver's already ahead of the rest of the metro here: Burnaby's banned e-scooters on arterials and is scared of bus lanes for Hastings, while White Rock outright removed their lockdown patios because they wanted more parking.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by mcj

It's literally a replacement for the majority of road users that are on the 99, that is a replacement for E-W traffic.

And yes a bicycle is also a suitable way to get across town, I'm not sure why you think otherwise. You should try it sometime.

There's still plenty of road left for the privileged minority that for some reason gets a majority of road space.

I ride my bike around town, I use all kinds of transportation. You're obviously drunk on the "Cars are the worst thing ever" koolaid so there's little point trying to argue with you.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

That's what the wider sidewalks should be for: trees, benches, patios and other walkability improvements to make Broadway a destination in itself instead of just a throughway.

As Alessio pointed out, eating on a patio with 4 lanes of vehicles beside you is unpleasant. That's simply the point, Broadway is being designed, as it always has, as a throughway for cars. There's a generational chance to massively improve the street and the city, such as the transformation of Broadway's namesake in NYC, but we are neglecting it. We will reap what we sow, Broadway will remain a car sewer for the rest of our lives.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I ride my bike around town, I use all kinds of transportation. You're obviously drunk on the "Cars are the worst thing ever" koolaid so there's little point trying to argue with you.

Besides ad hominem, you're really not making any arguments at all. It's nice that you use all kinds of transportation, that has nothing to do with making Broadway a great street that people want to spend time on.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by mcj

Besides ad hominem, you're really not making any arguments at all. It's nice that you use all kinds of transportation, that has nothing to do with making Broadway a great street that people want to spend time on.

Sidewalks and bicycles aren't what make people want to spend time on the street. As others have mentioned, Broadway doesn't have the residential density in that area to support anything you're talking about.

Main Street has no bike lanes and narrow sidewalks and is an extremely popular place for people to hang out.

You started with the insults so get off your high horse.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Feathered Friend

https://www.instagram.com/p/DcosO-7kikS/?igsi=MWE0ZTBxaGRwY2l6eg==

I'm about to go on polymarket and bet that lump will have a park bench on it.