People who have never set foot in your city that act like they know more then you do?

[PHL10]

This isn’t what the OP was really getting at, but I have a funny quibble about meeting people when traveling. More times than not when they ask where I’m from and I say “Philadelphia”, they correct me and say, “oh, you’re from Philly”. Just happened again last week with some people from Virginia.

[benp]

Originally Posted by Wigs

Never heard of this in Buffalo. In fact people wish there were more direct flights to LA instead of the 6-8+/week (depending on time of year) that currently exist thanks to Jet Blue.

Then again Western NYers might be slightly better traveled than Utica peeps, semi-regularly going to both Toronto and NY. Toronto and Canada overall are spoken of fondly as well. Most Buffalonians have a deep fondness for Chicago, maybe thinking that Buffalo might be more like it if it had millions of more people.

I think that after decades continually being at the short end, Buffalonians are less likely to put down other places. As much as we love and believe in our city, over the years it had been genuinely surprising whenever anyone had nice things to say about it, though it occurs much much more frequently now.

The only exception had been NYC through at least the early 1990s, when it was at its low point, but a good part of that was by actual lived experience at the time. I hardly see any remnants of that today.

Long Islanders, however, typically students attending Buffalo area universities, have a reputation here for spending 4 years whining and complaining about everything in Buffalo without ever leaving their dorms. It may be youthful ignorance, but it seems like many carry it back with them after they've left.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by ChrisLA

It really wasn’t that much different from when I worked for another company that had a vendor in Ossining NY. The workers in that office talked really bad about NYC and didn’t seem to be interested in hanging out in the city.

Well that's interesting because Ossining isn't exactly a fancy place. It is best known as the location of Sing Sing prison and it has one of the lowest median incomes in Westchester County. The median income of NYC is higher than in Ossining.

Originally Posted by ChrisLA

I’ve driven to Ossining from Brooklyn Heights before and maybe it was a good day but it didn’t take that long to get there, maybe 30 minutes.

Was that during the middle of COVID? In the middle of the night with no traffic that drive would probably be an hour, and probably closer to a 2 hour drive at most other times of the day.

[Northern Light]

It strikes me that this is less a story about geographic prejudice/overeach, than a general tendency among a significant portion of the population in many areas to generally exhibit prejudice and to generally over-reach in respect of their knowledge, about a range of subjects imagining no one in their audience would actually know better.

I think you see this with polarized politics; and 'war on the car' nonsense from certain people who dislike bike lanes.

To be clear, while I'm pro cycling, I think its perfectly fine for you to hold a view that its not a good idea for your street.

My issue is with radical overreach, turning a road space allocation conversation into a war on anything.

But I digress, you could find a hundred other issues (or a thousand) where a people resort to inflammatory opinions based on scant knowledge of the subject in question. Any excuse to be angry and all.

***

There is no city, region, province, state or country that is naturally or practically exempt from a fair critique. Be that one based on personal preference ("I hate snow", "I hate humid" etc etc or one based on more factual claims '" the public schools here underperform on national tests, or the recycling requirements are too complicated).

Equally almost every place has something to recommend it, if not many things; though admittedly some places are more challenged than others.

But the tendency of those who have never been to a place, or have only passed through, visited for a single day, to speak with confidence about something they no little about is obnoxious and lacks thoughtful nuance too.

Just as is the case on any political issue, or cultural issue, or w/e. The singular thing about being ignorant, is that you are typically blissfully unaware of your challenge.

[mhays]

Well said PhilliesPhan.

That's funny about London. It's an incredible city -- amazingly vibrant and safe. You can't villify it to people who've actually been there.

[JManc]

Originally Posted by benp

I think that after decades continually being at the short end, Buffalonians are less likely to put down other places. As much as we love and believe in our city, over the years it had been genuinely surprising whenever anyone had nice things to say about it, though it occurs much much more frequently now.

The only exception had been NYC through at least the early 1990s, when it was at its low point, but a good part of that was by actual lived experience at the time. I hardly see any remnants of that today.

Long Islanders, however, typically students attending Buffalo area universities, have a reputation here for spending 4 years whining and complaining about everything in Buffalo without ever leaving their dorms. It may be youthful ignorance, but it seems like many carry it back with them after they've left.

I grew up thinking Buffalo was just a big Utica, a shit hole because upstate New York was pretty bad and it may have been at some point I never saw that version and I loved what I saw of Buffalo really wanted to go to UB but U. of Houston was cheaper. I'd still live in Buffalo if I had to move back east.










Go Bills!

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

Years ago, I endured an extremely awkward engagement dinner party hosted by in-laws' friends who lived on a small lake up in rural Wisconsin.

After dinner, the fuckhead hosting the damn party let out a very FOX-newsian "Chicago is such a hopeless and helpless shithole" while blathering on about nothing of importance.

Being who I am, I most certainly did not let it "politely" slide, and I reminded fuckhead that me and my soon-to-be wife, the alleged guests of honor at his house, fucking LIVED in Chicago. He started blubbering with his foot firmly inserted in his stupid mouth while his wife tried to defuse with a "I'm sure Tom didn't really mean what he said", which I quickly met with a stern "well, If he didn't mean it, then why the hell did he say it? Especially at a party meant to celebrate me and my fiance and our engagement? Why would you invite people into your home just to insult theirs?"

No good answers were offered because none existed.

He eventually attempted an insincere and tortured back-pedalling explanation, but the mood was completely killed by the awkwardness of it all. My mother-in-law was of course horrified (these were her friends afterall), both by his wildly innapropriate insult and by my assertive smackdown of it. Party was over and everyone was in their cars going their separate ways forever 15 minutes later.

What a fuckhead.

Good for you.

I have had similar, though perhaps not as much from a family perspective, encounters, after moving to Western Canada (BC interior, then Vancouver) from Quebec.

Usually something along the lines of "those goddamned frenchies trying to break up our country/equalization payments/taking my tax dollars..." followed by awkward realization that yes, I am a native son of Quebec, followed by an even more awkward attempt at backpedalling in the face of my rigorous defence of my home province.

[pj3000]

A Vancouver colleague of mine (who's never set foot anywhere in eastern North America other than NYC) snidely refers to Toronto as "Buffalo", in an attempt to demean Toronto.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by pj3000

A Vancouver colleague of mine (who's never set foot anywhere in eastern North America other than NYC) snidely refers to Toronto as "Buffalo", in an attempt to demean Toronto.

Well... that is a pretty good dig if you were trying to get under the skin of someone from Toronto lol.

[ChrisLA]

Originally Posted by iheartthed

Well that's interesting because Ossining isn't exactly a fancy place. It is best known as the location of Sing Sing prison and it has one of the lowest median incomes in Westchester County. The median income of NYC is higher than in Ossining


Was that during the middle of COVID? In the middle of the night with no traffic that drive would probably be an hour, and probably closer to a 2 hour drive at most other times of the day.

I believe most of the staff didn’t live in Ossining, but in other communities in Westchester County. I remember one person said they lived about an hour north of the office. Another staff drove me past their house when we went to lunch. I’m not sure if this was in Ossining, it was a ranch style house in a rather wooded area. The building they worked in was a closed down school that was converted into a call center. I almost forgot one employee I talked with a lot said they lived in Briarcliff Manor, she really talked bad about NYC.

As for the drive, well I’m probably much older than you, but this was around 1992, way before Covid. It was also on a weekday, and I drove up from Brooklyn mid morning. There was very little traffic going there, actually it wasn’t even that bad coming back until we entered Yonkers, but it was nothing worse than what I’m used to in LA.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by ChrisLA

I believe most of the staff didn’t live in Ossining, but in other communities in Westchester County. I remember one person said they lived about an hour north of the office. Another staff drove me past their house when we went to lunch. I’m not sure if this was in Ossining, it was a ranch style house in a rather wooded area. The building they worked in was a closed down school that was converted into a call center. I almost forgot one employee I talked with a lot said they lived in Briarcliff Manor, she really talked bad about NYC.

As for the drive, well I’m probably much older than you, but this was around 1992, way before Covid. It was also on a weekday, and I drove up from Brooklyn mid morning. There was very little traffic going there, actually it wasn’t even that bad coming back until we entered Yonkers, but it was nothing worse than what I’m used to in LA.

Ah, this was 1992, I thought this was something more recent. So, that fear sentiment was a bit more rational in 1992 than in like 2012 or 2026. The year 1992 is when NYC's murder rate and murder count reached its historical peak. Today NYC notches about 10% of the number of murders that it did in the early 1990s. The city's murder rate today is comparable to what it was in the late 19th century.

As for the drive time... I live pretty close to Brooklyn Heights. Just driving to the South Bronx from here can easily take an hour. I just can't imagine how much would have to line up in my favor to get to Ossining in 30 minutes lol.

[Crawford]

Ossining is on the Metro North, and not that far by transit. But yeah, it's not very desirable. Best known for Sing Sing.

[3rd&Brown]

I'm from Philly (and work in NYC). We get shat on all the time, though it happens less and less as the years go by.

Reactions are just another way to sort people and reserve your energy for people worth investing in. Chances are if somebody is trying to argue with you about <insert amazing US city here> they're honestly not worth knowing. The least cool people I've ever met are average Americans living in ho-hum suburbs with these sort of skewed views. WTH are you ever going to learn from a person like that? How is a relationship with that kind of person going to enrich your brain in any way?

I will say. Truly cool people love Philly, regardless of where they're from and where they live. I was at the Bowery Hotel for drinks on Tuesday night and had the most amazing conversation with a literal model and her friend and it kicked off with a conversation about Philly.

[Crawford]

I have a longtime client well into his 80's who grew up in Williamsburg, and he's convicted it's a dangerous hellhole. Swears to never set foot in that dystopian hellscape. Rich as F and still ranting about miscreant Puerto Rican kids back in the 1950's.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by benp

I think that after decades continually being at the short end, Buffalonians are less likely to put down other places. As much as we love and believe in our city, over the years it had been genuinely surprising whenever anyone had nice things to say about it, though it occurs much much more frequently now.

The only exception had been NYC through at least the early 1990s, when it was at its low point, but a good part of that was by actual lived experience at the time. I hardly see any remnants of that today.

Long Islanders, however, typically students attending Buffalo area universities, have a reputation here for spending 4 years whining and complaining about everything in Buffalo without ever leaving their dorms. It may be youthful ignorance, but it seems like many carry it back with them after they've left.

For decades it seems Buffalo really didn't have much to be "Talkin' Proud" about.
I agree if your city has been the national punchline then you're less likely to punch down on other cities (aside from NFL rivalries).

It's funny how a lot of downstate/Long Island students think that way. What is so great about Long Island aside from upscale towns on the beach/Hamptons? Most of it is nothing to write home about from what I've seen.

I had a friend from downstate/NYC that would spend her days in the city and evenings either in Southampton (where her mother moved) or at her dad's place in the upscale NJ suburbs.
She came to Buffalo to get completely away from NYC and everything she had known. A fresh start as as adult. Buffalo became her sanctuary, more in common with Canada than Downstate. She eventually found her husband, bought a small house in Williamsville but then ended up transferring to Chicago for a few years before moving back to the NY area (now in Jersey City). She speaks of her time in Buffalo fondly.

Originally Posted by JManc

I grew up thinking Buffalo was just a big Utica, a shit hole because upstate New York was pretty bad and it may have been at some point I never saw that version and I loved what I saw of Buffalo really wanted to go to UB but U. of Houston was cheaper. I'd still live in Buffalo if I had to move back east.

Go Bills!

That would be pretty cool if you bought a retirement place in Buffalo as we wouldn't be far away from each other

The summers are glorious! (occasional wildfire smoke migration notwithstanding)

[JManc]

^ Aren't you in St. Catherines?

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by Wigs

It's funny how a lot of downstate/Long Island students think that way. What is so great about Long Island aside from upscale towns on the beach/Hamptons? Most of it is nothing to write home about from what I've seen.

Non-urbanized LI looks like New England, but with much better beaches. The northern half is all rolling hills. There are cliffs on the sea. Sizable vineyards. Western NY, while it has its charms, and some very cute towns, is not the most attractive landscape in NYS. Almost anywhere else Upstate has nicer scenery.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by JManc

^ Aren't you in St. Catherines?

It's St. Catharines. I lived there for 4 years but am now in the South end of Niagara region close to Lake Erie. I've lived all over Niagara region.

Either way most in Niagara region are no more than 30-45 minutes from downtown Buffalo, excluding the wait times at the border that can be anywhere from 2 to 30+ minutes (peak summer is usually the longest wait times). As my best friend-a Buffalonian says: Canada customs usually has many booths open but returning home to USA the CBP never seem to have enough open

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Non-urbanized LI looks like New England, but with much better beaches. The northern half is all rolling hills. There are cliffs on the sea. Sizable vineyards. Western NY, while it has its charms, and some very cute towns, is not the most attractive landscape in NYS. Almost anywhere else Upstate has nicer scenery.

You should spend time walking/hiking in Letchworth State Park during the fall colours. Western NY at its best.


You could spend a night in Rochester and (depending on how old they are) take your kids to the Strong National Museum of Play

Get out of the NYC bubble

edit: And my point was many students from Long Island in Buffalo (or Rochester) have this superiority complex about themselves like people in Buffalo (or Rochester) are some slack jawed yokels or something. It's bizarre. Get over yourselves, Long guylanders.

[3rd&Brown]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Non-urbanized LI looks like New England, but with much better beaches. The northern half is all rolling hills. There are cliffs on the sea. Sizable vineyards. Western NY, while it has its charms, and some very cute towns, is not the most attractive landscape in NYS. Almost anywhere else Upstate has nicer scenery.

The problem with Long Island is that it's filled with, well...people from Long Island. Probably the most insufferable people in the country, aside from Staten Island, if we're being honest. Worth avoiding for the vocal fry alone.

The nicest people I've met in my adult life are from the Buffalo area. And not in a hokey nice to your face stab you in the back kind of way. Like, authentically nice.