Canadian Skyline Thread III

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Place Bonaventure in downtown Montreal spans a massive total floor area of 3,100,000 square feet (288,000 m2). When it opened in 1967 (arguably the year that was Montreal's Zenith), it was the second largest commercial building in the world, after Chicago's legendary Merchandise Mart.

For some reason, Montreal favours massive but relatively squat skyscrapers. Sort of like Tokyo, the world capital of squat but gigantic buildings.

I forgot that brutalist behemoth existed. I recall seeing it a long time ago on SSP

Another one is Complexe Desjardins
Total floor space between all of the towers is over 4.5 million square feet
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complexe_Desjardins

edit: also I just realized the person that took the photo of Tour de la Bourse titled it Tour Boursenov and now I can't stop chuckling. It does give me vibes of that Soviet era former Marriott in Warsaw. hahah
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LIM_Center

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

What is the total square footage of office space in DT Montreal?

• Downtown Montreal (incl Old Montreal) ~55.75 million square feet (Colliers)
• Downtown Calgary (incl Beltline) ~ 50.25 million square feet (Avison Young)
• Downtown Vancouver (incl Gastown/Railtown/Yaletown) ~33.2 million square feet (Colliers)
• Downtown Edmonton ~18.2 million square feet (Colliers)
  _____________________________
• Downtown Toronto (Financial core + DT quadrants) ~104.5 million square feet (Colliers)

Downtown Toronto roughly has the office space of Downtown Montreal and Downtown Calgary combined!

[Calgarian]

Originally Posted by Wigs

• Downtown Montreal (incl Old Montreal) ~55.75 million square feet (Colliers)
• Downtown Calgary (incl Beltline) ~ 50.25 million square feet (Avison Young)
• Downtown Vancouver (incl Gastown/Railtown/Yaletown) ~33.2 million square feet (Colliers)
• Downtown Edmonton ~18.2 million square feet (Colliers)
  _____________________________
• Downtown Toronto (Financial core + DT quadrants) ~104.5 million square feet (Colliers)

Downtown Toronto roughly has the office space of Downtown Montreal and Downtown Calgary combined!

Thanks for this. Crazy how big Toronto is, and crazy that Calgary has the equivalent of Edmonton and Vancouver combined.

The residential population of each downtown would tell another story altogether.

[Wigs]

Unfortunately Calgary still has over 10 million square feet of office space vacant.
~27% vacancy rate Downtown, ~16.6% vacancy rate Beltline
More office to residential or mixed-use conversions should happen.

Compared to the other downtowns:
Edmonton ~19.1%
Montreal ~16.1%
Vancouver ~11.9%
Toronto ~10.1%

[Calgarian]

With the price of Oil going up, talk of new pipelines and some international companies coming back, I expect that number should keep falling. Lots of new conversions in the pipeline as well, which is helping drive the vibrancy in the downtown core outside of 9-5.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Place Bonaventure in downtown Montreal spans a massive total floor area of 3,100,000 square feet (288,000 m2). When it opened in 1967 (arguably the year that was Montreal's Zenith), it was the second largest commercial building in the world, after Chicago's legendary Merchandise Mart. It is one of the only structures in Canada with its own postal code prefix (H5A).

Doesn't Montreal have a height limit of around 230 m? I think that is a factor plus maybe the age of some of these towers.

It is a lot like Halifax, on a different scale. The Maritime Centre is something like 500,000 square feet and 21 floors or so but almost a square shape and Scotia Square over 1 million in a few different towers. Then there are older buildings like the Bank of NS HQ from around 1930 which probably would have been given a skyscraper format in the US but instead got a kind of neoclassical/art deco lowrise style. The scale of these buildings doesn't come across well in photos and they can be hard to even capture in a photo.

[csbvan]

So much of Vancouver's new office development the last half decade seems concentrated on the Broadway Corridor and False Creek Flats - focused on tech and biotech/healthcare. The downtown boomlet pre-pandemic has wound down, and hotels have become the flavour of the moment.

[Nouvellecosse]

Originally Posted by someone123

Doesn't Montreal have a height limit of around 230 m? I think that is a factor plus maybe the age of some of these towers.

Pretty sure it's a factor with 1000 de la Gauchetière but I'm not sure about the other major office towers. The others like PVM are well below 230m, but people sometimes misunderstand the height limit. It's been awhile since it looked at the actual planning documents, but I recall that the maximum limit only really applies to certain parts of downtown with ~230m being the highest you can go on any site. But the actual limit is the height of Mount Royal so the limit is relative. Which means the limit is lower on sites with a higher elevation since they're already closer to the height of Mount Royal to begin with.

[MolsonExport]

Indeed, and rather like Vancouver (and London, UK), there are several view cones that effectively limit how high you can go in the central core.

[Martin Mtl]

Photo: https://x.com/Montreal

[MolsonExport]

The great Pilgrimage Church of Canada (along with the Basilica of Ste. Anne de Beaupré). I used to live about 4 blocks away from St. Joseph's Oratory. Some penitent people mount the entire set of outdoor steps on their knees. The middle aisle of the steps is wooden, just for that purpose.

Have they made any progress on opening the top of the dome as an observation point? https://oratory360.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/OSJMR-info-Architectural-competition.pdf

[O-tacular]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

The great Pilgrimage Church of Canada (along with the Basilica of Ste. Anne de Beaupré). I used to live about 4 blocks away from St. Joseph's Oratory. Some penitent people mount the entire set of outdoor steps on their knees. The middle aisle of the steps is wooden, just for that purpose.

Have they made any progress on opening the top of the dome as an observation point? https://oratory360.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/OSJMR-info-Architectural-competition.pdf

Forgot about that. I kinda hope they leave it alone. That structure doesn’t look very elegant and would ruin the dome imo. The clear span looking up several hundred feet is quite awe inspiring.

PS: I’ve seen the penitents ascending the steps on their knees.

[Calgarian]

I wonder if Montreal will ever drop the height limit. Would be cool to see a 300m tower in Montreal!

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I wonder if Montreal will ever drop the height limit. Would be cool to see a 300m tower in Montreal!

They really should… it’s not Paris.

[Monolith]

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F7mhvzfm4ss4h1.jpeg

[Chocolite]

[Nouvellecosse]

^ Very cool pic! Did you take it yourself? The city looks really hefty now.

[J.OT13]

Tunney's/Mechanicsville/Hintonburg Skyline, Ottawa.

Originally Posted by ponyboycurtis

[Zeej]

Originally Posted by Calgarian

I wonder if Montreal will ever drop the height limit. Would be cool to see a 300m tower in Montreal!

Never say never but it's highly unlikely in the near term.

While the height limit remains, the city has, however, upzoned large parts of the downtown to support higher heights and densities, so over time the skyline will continue to fill in with more 180-200m towers.

I would personally like to see something - anything - in the 220-230m range, where the developer pays for a non-market rate projet and initiates a design competition. Surely, we can come up with a creative and mutually beneficial solution for increased height and density.

Of course, this is a skyscraper forum, so every meter counts. In the real world, no one really cares about tower heights or really tangibly understands the difference between a 200m tower and a 250m tower. Tall building.

[Docere]

# of buildings over 100m+

NYC 884
Toronto 403
Chicago 356
Miami 150
Houston 115
San Francisco 100
Atlanta 98
Los Angeles 88
Calgary 83
Seattle 75
Montreal 73
Vancouver 72
Philadelphia 65
Boston 59
Dallas 58
Austin 52

150m+

NYC 324
Chicago 137
Toronto 108
Miami 69
Houston 40
Los Angeles 32
San Francisco 27
Boston 26
Seattle 22
Calgary 20
Dallas 20
Jersey City 20
Atlanta 18
Austin 18
Montreal 18
Philadelphia 18
(Vancouver 7)