Cambie Corridor Updates

[jollyburger]

They're researching solar panel designs that aren't as in your face.



https://www.alucobond.com/en/news-dates/...erte-fassade-als-energiequelle-164a0261/

[mcj]

Originally Posted by PBlonde

How efficient are solar panels when it's cloudy or raining? I had always thought it wouldn't be worth getting solar panels in the lower mainland because there's only a few months a year of sunshine.

There's tonnes of information out there on the efficiency numbers you can google. In short though, it depends on the type of cloud cover but usually it's a roughly ~20% to 50% decline in power output. They'll still output power, and we've just had sunshine for a week in January here if you haven't noticed. The Vancouver that got "only a few months a year of sunshine" no longer exists, our climate has changed.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by PBlonde

How efficient are solar panels when it's cloudy or raining? I had always thought it wouldn't be worth getting solar panels in the lower mainland because there's only a few months a year of sunshine.

They are less efficient but still work when it's light out. They absolutely do not need direct sunlight.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by mcj

There's tonnes of information out there on the efficiency numbers you can google. In short though, it depends on the type of cloud cover but usually it's a roughly ~20% to 50% decline in power output. They'll still output power, and we've just had sunshine for a week in January here if you haven't noticed. The Vancouver that got "only a few months a year of sunshine" no longer exists, our climate has changed.

Out of interest, google tells me we get 1800-1900. Toronto 2000-2100. Calgary gets around 2400. Edmonton (where my family loves their solar panels on their SFHs) gets 2300.

Edit: Hours of sunshine per year.

[Migrant_Coconut]

The other big problem is albedo. At the equator, sunlight hits the Earth at a direct angle and goes right in, but at high latitudes half the sunlight bounces off the atmosphere and back into space.

Between that and cloud cover, Canada has less than half the capacity factor (theoretical max output, not actual output) that America has.

[officedweller]

8555 Cambie is a midblock site.
What's to be built to the south? Likely a tower?

[jollyburger]

Interesting infill from Wesgroup and Yamamoto Architecture

Mass timber that they want to see replicated in other projects.

No balconies because of thermal bridging/mass timber, communal space on the podium rooftop.

As we learned in the River District, deep excavations are extremely costly and can make a project unviable. While parking minimums are no longer being enforced, minimum numbers of cars are still required to lease out rental apartments. As the number of units increases, the number of bikes increases as well. In typical projects, bicycle parking is located on P1, which creates an extremely inefficient parkade. Cars must circulate through a wide drive aisle, often navigating one or more levels of the parkade and excavation, before reaching the first parking stalls. Our proposal minimizes the excavation to only one level, almost exclusively to park cars. Utility rooms are moved to grade or level 2, and bikes are loaded on level 2, with a dedicated, oversized elevator providing convenient access to both bikes and mechanical rooms.

The design for 7275 Cambie responds to the recent design expression along the Cambie Corridor and the width and scale of Cambie Street
with a contemporary expression. The proposed design incorporates the tower and level 2 into a singular form that floats above the active
ground level and slope of the site. In other locations and villages, alternative design approaches might be more appropriate. The prototype
design lends itself to many different expressions that can take clues from neighbourhood context. The characteristics of specific sites
including dimensions and topography will also create appropriately scaled podiums and contextual fit.

7525 Cambie St rezoning application

The City of Vancouver has received an application to rezone the subject site from C-1 (Commercial) District to CD-1 (Comprehensive Development) District. The proposal is to allow for the development of a 12-storey mixed-use rental building with a 2-storey podium, and includes:

97 units;
Commercial space on the ground floor;
A floor space ratio (FSR) of 4.19; and
A building height of 43.9 m (144 ft.)

This application is being considered under the Transit-Oriented Areas Rezoning Policy.

https://www.shapeyourcity.ca/7525-cambie-st-2

[officedweller]

What would occupy the windowless 2nd floor?

[madog222]

Originally Posted by officedweller

What would occupy the windowless 2nd floor?

Bike parking, storage units, mechanical, and a rain water retention tank below the podium rooftop planting.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by mcj

There's tonnes of information out there on the efficiency numbers you can google. In short though, it depends on the type of cloud cover but usually it's a roughly ~20% to 50% decline in power output. They'll still output power, and we've just had sunshine for a week in January here if you haven't noticed. The Vancouver that got "only a few months a year of sunshine" no longer exists, our climate has changed.

Google says also there's like a 50% drop in the intensity of the light even with no cloud cover since it's so low in the sky (more atmosphere to go through) and I guess the optimal placement for the sun in the summer isn't ideal for the angle in winter months.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

Google says also there's like a 50% drop in the intensity of the light even with no cloud cover since it's so low in the sky (more atmosphere to go through)...

IIRC it's less about the thickness of the atmosphere and more about the angle - sunlight goes straight in near the equator, but the closer you get to the poles, the more it ricochets off the air and back out into the void.

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by madog222

Bike parking, storage units, mechanical, and a rain water retention tank below the podium rooftop planting.

It'll be interesting to see if the City finally budges on their not allowing a FSR exclusion of bike parking above Level 1. Maybe this is just a water table area relaxation, but I did see some Broadway Applciations go ahead and try and get rejected (they had to move it back into the parkade to get the exclusion).

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

It'll be interesting to see if the City finally budges on their not allowing a FSR exclusion of bike parking above Level 1. Maybe this is just a water table area relaxation, but I did see some Broadway Applciations go ahead and try and get rejected (they had to move it back into the parkade to get the exclusion).

They're not claiming it's the water table. "Bike parking, additional bulk storage and mechanical services are strategically relocated to the second level of the podium which creates an efficient parkade that is only one-level deep."

"As we learned in the River District, deep excavations are extremely costly and can make a project unviable. While parking minimums are no longer being enforced, minimum numbers of cars are still required to lease out rental apartments. As the number of units increases, the number of bikes increases as well. In typical projects, bicycle parking is located on P1, which creates an extremely inefficient parkade. Cars must circulate through a wide drive aisle, often navigating one or more levels of the parkade and excavation, before reaching the first parking stalls. Our proposal minimizes the excavation to only one level, almost exclusively to park cars. Utility rooms are moved to grade or level 2, and bikes are loaded on level 2, with a dedicated, oversized elevator providing convenient access to both bikes and mechanical rooms."

The first two floors are concrete; the tower is mass timber.

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by Changing City

They're not claiming it's the water table. "Bike parking, additional bulk storage and mechanical services are strategically relocated to the second level of the podium which creates an efficient parkade that is only one-level deep."

Oh well then I wish them the worst int hat case

[trofirhen]

I think tha all the building designs are somehow heavy and boxy. Perhpas I am misreading the neighbourhood contex (and need for continiity) but I wish this could have been smarter, crisper, more upbeat.

[jollyburger]

Just noticed there was a previous proposal for this site:

66 strata units

https://www.shapeyourcity.ca/7525-cambie-st

[b5baxter]

Originally Posted by logan5

The article doesn't mention it, but I'm wondering how much of the buildings electrical needs those solar panels are providing. Solar panels are relatively cheap now and are above 20% efficiency. It makes a lot of sense to incorporate these onto any building.

I would estimate about 20-30% of the electrical needs.
There are several 1-2 story buildings in Vancouver where solar energy provides 100% of the energy. But when you get above two stories it becomes difficult to offset 100%

[b5baxter]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

The other big problem is albedo. At the equator, sunlight hits the Earth at a direct angle and goes right in, but at high latitudes half the sunlight bounces off the atmosphere and back into space.

Between that and cloud cover, Canada has less than half the capacity factor (theoretical max output, not actual output) that America has.

That wikipedia article has a few problems. Potential irradiation is close to the same for all latitudes - it is just the seasonal variation that is different. Sure the angle of the sun might encounter more atmosphere at higher latitudes but I don't think that difference is a huge factor. Lower temperatures also improve photovoltaic performance.

Having installed 100s of solar energy systems, some of the best performance I have seen is on Baffin Island above the arctic circle (of course only in the summer - no power in the winter).

The capacity factor for solar in Vancouver is 12% - double the number they have in that article.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by b5baxter

The capacity factor for solar in Vancouver is 12% - double the number they have in that article.

Be that as it may, I think we both agree that ~20% of 12% is nowhere near enough to get anything larger than a duplex off the grid.

[b5baxter]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Be that as it may, I think we both agree that ~20% of 12% is nowhere near enough to get anything larger than a duplex off the grid.

It is not 20% of 12%. The capacity factor is based on the nameplate rating which already takes into account conversion effeincy.

And the goal is not to get off the grid. The goals might be things like:
- saving money
- helping reduce the need for imported power in BC
- reducing ghg emissions on the grid
- making more power available for heat pumps and EVs
- having power for critical loads when the grid goes down

BTW I double checked my calculations and the capacity factor is closer to 13.5%.