YVR & Sea Island Developments Discussion II

[osirisboy]

Why do we want ek in Vancouver?

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by osirisboy

Why do we want ek in Vancouver?

Is this a trick question? Because there is massive demand for routes they serve.
There are certain days there have been more Canadians on the middle east carriers than Americans. One of the ME3 not flying is the biggest hole in aviation in Western Canada.

[Capitol Hill]

Regarding EK and YVR, the 773 can carry a lot of cargo. I don’t know how much trade of BC products get exported by air that direction, but the 773 will help with transporting it.

[osirisboy]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Is this a trick question? Because there is massive demand for routes they serve.
There are certain days there have been more Canadians on the middle east carriers than Americans. One of the ME3 not flying is the biggest hole in aviation in Western Canada.

Versus air Canada flying there instead

[Johnny Aussie]

Korean Air increasing next summer

Double daily on 787-10s

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/251202-kens26yvr

Korean Air on Tuesday 02DEC25 filed service changes for Seoul Incheon – Vancouver, as the carrier expands service during Northern summer 2026 season. From 29MAR26, the Skyteam member will operate 14 weekly flights, instead of 11.

KE071 ICN1845 – 1235YVR 781 D
KE075 ICN2240 – 1630YVR 781 D

KE076 YVR0055 – 0430+1ICN 781 D
KE072 YVR1430 – 1750+1ICN 781 D

[SpongeG]

It would be nice to see a Busan flight.

[gaviscon]

Is T'Way successful compared to Korean Air so far? I saw in a Youtube video that they don't have in-flight entertainment

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

Is this a trick question? Because there is massive demand for routes they serve.
There are certain days there have been more Canadians on the middle east carriers than Americans. One of the ME3 not flying is the biggest hole in aviation in Western Canada.

That is for sure!! Transport Canada blocked EK from Vancouver ... so it went to Seattle instead. I do not know the precise reason EK was denied access, but it sucks any way you cut it.
The premise was that EK posed some threat to YVR, and that it would "cannibalize" routes (that has happened, to a degree, in Australia, where EK is a connecting airline to Europe)
but YVR is not linked the way Australia is, by EK or any of the ME3. // The other argument by Canada was that EK is subsidized by Dubai, presenting "unfair" competition and "unfair" profit margins. / Whatever the justification was, it all seemed - and still seems - pretty lame. (?) Tight-assed Canadian protectionism .. or YYZ favouritism? Please tell me, someone.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by gaviscon

Is T'Way successful compared to Korean Air so far? I saw in a Youtube video that they don't have in-flight entertainment

T’way is rebranding as Trinity Airways next year. Not sure what that means for changes in service but what I’ve read it appears they will become a hybrid carrier. So perhaps their services will be enhanced. Nothing concrete yet that I can find.

As for Korean, they become one of only a handful of intl carriers that will be flying (at least) double daily from YVR next summer: Korean, Cathay Pacific, British Airways, Lufthansa and KLM/Air France (different carriers but same group so can be seen as the same or separate)

[Johnny Aussie]

AC moving HKG to the late evening bank. YVR INTL going to be very busy at night

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/251203-acns26hkg

Air Canada during Northern summer 2026 season is adjusting operational schedules on Vancouver – Hong Kong route, currently scheduled with daytime departure from Vancouver, evening from Hong Kong. From 29MAR26 (Vancouver departure), service will shift to overnight hour service from Vancouver, mid-morning from Hong Kong.

Boeing 787-9 operates this route on daily basis.

AC007 YVR0015 – 0510+1HKG 789 D
AC008 HKG0945 – 0620YVR 789 D

[Johnny Aussie]

October pax stats are out

https://www.yvr.ca/-/media/yvr/documents/facts-sheets/2025/10---october/october-traffic-update.pdf

Overall up 6.4% up over 135,000
Domestic up 9.1% up ~ 99,000
Int’l up 3.5% up ~ 36,000

Asia Pacific and Europe had huge increases:

Asia Pacific up 19.3%
Europe up 12.7%

Misc Intl was up 3.5%

Transborder continues to struggle down 9.1%

[nname]

Asia Pacific broke all-time record achieved in Oct 2018. This is the first month YVR surpass the monthly number for Asia Pacific since COVID.

Domestic, Europe, Total, and YTD also hits all-time record. Domestic smashed the previous record (Oct 2023) by more than 5%, and total traffic is 6.4% above the record month of Oct 2024.

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

AC moving HKG to the late evening bank. YVR INTL going to be very busy at night

The added night rotation will likely means YVR-EWR will go back to 789. Currently the route is down to 1x daily 789 (instead of 2x 7M8) for the month of May.

This also means AC will require to add one more plane for the extra rotation for the evening departure, and the widebody requirement for YVR for long-haul will increase to 16 in S26 (up from 14 in S25, but down from 17 in Dec-Jan W25 and the record of 18.5 in S19).

So where did AC find the extra 2 planes?

[VancityAvgeek33]

I wonder if Qatar will want yvr too! Especially given Qatar is playing in Vancouver for thr fifa. I know it’s a little thing but will be interesting to see if any of the airlines in the UAE/Qatar/Saudi Arabia announce Vancouver flights soon!

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by VancityAvgeek33

I wonder if Qatar will want yvr too! Especially given Qatar is playing in Vancouver for thr fifa. I know it’s a little thing but will be interesting to see if any of the airlines in the UAE/Qatar/Saudi Arabia announce Vancouver flights soon!

EK yes
Saudia is a long shot. So no.
QR landing rights are maxed out. Currently limited to 12x weekly (daily to YYZ, 5x weekly to YUL). They get 14x weekly as of W26, and daily to YUL is already loaded as of October 25, 2026.

So in the short to medium term, EK is probably all that is coming to YVR.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone

EK yes /editing mine/
So in the short to medium term, EK is probably all that is coming to YVR.

Well, it's better than nothing at all. And better than lame, seasonal Air Canada service. If EK does YVR landing rights, will there be a limit on how many days per week? (Probably, look at TK)

[Zmonkey]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Well, it's better than nothing at all. And better than lame, seasonal Air Canada service. If EK does YVR landing rights, will there be a limit on how many days per week? (Probably, look at TK)

UAE and Canada have expanded air rights, there are now 14 new slots for UAE Carriers to fly into Canada (so it moves to 35 a week). 14 can be split into any airport in Canada and will likely mean daily to Vancouver and an increase to Toronto (which currently has 2 A380 flights to the UAE a day).

Canada has a cap of 12 flights a week to Turkey. 6 a week for Toronto, 3 to each of Montreal, Vancouver. TK asked for an increase of 5 this year which was rejected by Canada. Air Canada and Transat lobbied against the increase. Air Transat will now fly from Toronto to IST and have a code share agreement with Turkish.

[nname]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

UAE and Canada have expanded air rights, there are now 14 new slots for UAE Carriers to fly into Canada (so it moves to 35 a week). 14 can be split into any airport in Canada and will likely mean daily to Vancouver and an increase to Toronto (which currently has 2 A380 flights to the UAE a day).

Canada has a cap of 12 flights a week to Turkey. 6 a week for Toronto, 3 to each of Montreal, Vancouver. TK asked for an increase of 5 this year which was rejected by Canada. Air Canada and Transat lobbied against the increase. Air Transat will now fly from Toronto to IST and have a code share agreement with Turkish.

In my opinion, it's TK's fault.

In previous years, they ask for 1 extra-bilateral frequency for the summer, and was granted and no one opposed.

Then last summer, they asked for 5 extra-bilateral frequency and was rejected, then they tried to reduce the request back to 1 and was rejected again.

They were trying to skip the bilateral negotiation process to quickly gain more access. If they followed the process, they'd probably be getting at least something by now, like every other country in the area in the past couple of years. Canada seems to be much more liberal in giving out more frequency compared to the time when TK was trying to gain access to YVR...

[nname]

Big schedule update from AC, looks like 223 base is in full swing next summer, and a lot of trimmings

Schedule is updated until the end of June, some still look to be work-in-progress

ANC - season begin with 4x weekly, increase to daily 7M8 by mid May
AUS - reduce to 4x weekly 223
ORD - 1x daily 223
DEN - 2x daily 223
HNL - reduce to 1x daily 7M8, 1x weekly 789 will only operate in May
IAH - 1x daily mix of 223/321
LAX - reduce to 4x daily 7M8/223
BNA - reduce to 3-4x weekly 223
EWR - 1x daily 789 instead of 2x 7M8
SNA - 1x daily 223
PHX - 2x daily CR9
YQB - season start May instead of June, increase to 5x weekly 7M8 from June
RDU - 3x weekly 223, season start May instead of June
YQR - reduce to 2x daily 223/CR9, increase to 3x daily by late June
PDX - reduce to 3x daily DH4
PVR - increase to 2x weekly 7M8
SMF - 2x daily CR9
SAN - 3x daily CR9
SFO - reduce to 4x daily 223/7M8/CR9
YXE - reduce to 2x daily 223, then increase to 3x daily 223 by late June
SEA - reduce to 4x daily DH4
YXY - reduce to 1x daily 7M8
YZF - reduce to 6x weekly CR9, increase back to 2x daily by late June

List of 223 destinations next summer: YYZ, YUL, YYC, YEG, YQR, YXE, AUS, ORD, DEN, IAH, LAX, BNA, SNA, RDU, SFO

For the sub-daily flights:
BNA/AUS shares a daily 223
YQB/PVR shares a daily 7M8
MIA/CUN shares a daily 7M8 with Tuesday spare
RDU/IAH shares a daily 223, when the plane flies to RDU, IAH will operates with 321

[thenoflyzone]

Originally Posted by Zmonkey

UAE and Canada have expanded air rights, there are now 14 new slots for UAE Carriers to fly into Canada (so it moves to 35 a week). 14 can be split into any airport in Canada and will likely mean daily to Vancouver and an increase to Toronto (which currently has 2 A380 flights to the UAE a day).

Canada has a cap of 12 flights a week to Turkey. 6 a week for Toronto, 3 to each of Montreal, Vancouver. TK asked for an increase of 5 this year which was rejected by Canada. Air Canada and Transat lobbied against the increase. Air Transat will now fly from Toronto to IST and have a code share agreement with Turkish.

One thing that hasn't been discussed on this thread - or others - is why the UAE increase so close to the last one (in 2022)? It's very unlike Canada to almost double landing rights so soon after almost doubling it a few years ago, especially with a country who is on record as wanting more rights for almost 2 decades.

One person to thank, in my opinion: Trump.

Everyone on this thread should thank Trump, because if it wasn't for him and his anti free trade global agenda, Canada and Mark Carney wouldn't be looking so hard elsewhere for investments.

Carney was in the UAE 3 weeks ago, where he secured a CAD$70 billion investment by the UAE into Canada. That was surely one of the reasons why the bilateral air agreement was expanded so soon.

Who knows, is a similar deal in the works with Qatar or Turkey? There is no hiding the fact that these countries want more landing rights into Canada. They would have seen how Canada and the UAE played this out. Maybe this is the perfect time for these countries to sign similar deals with Canada, and in return, get more landing rights.

We don't know what the future holds, but one thing is certain, if QR and TK are going to get more rights, the next 2-3 years present a very real opportunity to do so. I'm sure as we speak, airline executives at QR or TK are lobbying with their respective countries' top brass in order to see what can be done.

It's a bit crazy to think that if Trump wasn't elected last year, we would have a conservative government at the helm in Ottawa right now, and the Canada-UAE agreement would most likely still be limited to 21x weekly.

[nname]

The AC new 7M8 Rouge now appears in timetable from today's update. Flight number now extended to the 2xxx range.

CUN AC2128 eff. Mar 19
YEG AC2074/76/78 eff. Mar 5
HUX AC2288 on Apr 12
YLW AC1922/24 eff. Mar 5
LAS AC1772 eff. Apr 17
LAX AC1742/46/50 eff. Apr 19
MEX AC2096 eff. Apr 26
MIA AC1754 eff. Apr 15
PVR AC2132 eff. Apr 2
SJD AC2136 eff. Apr 13

For most of the route, the Rouged 7M8 will be operating along side with non-Rouged 7M8, even on the same day

Summer schedule not yet updated, but looking at my previous post, looks like the two MAX rotation (MIA/CUN/PVR/YQB) will be Rouged, as well as anything that specifically mentioned as 7M8 from the post.