Metro Vancouver Transit Discussion II

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by ilikeredheads

don't expect the fare system would change because there's no way you can implement distance-based fares fairly without getting rid of the 90min free transfers. The suggestion of that is pretty much a PR and political suicide.

That's not true at all. It's the opposite. MOST people would be supportive of new fares (especially if they initially launched them with a lower base-rate) than a one-zone fare. I think that's crucial for public perception, IMO. You can play around with the other zone fares so that it's effectively revenue neutral... but offering a slight fare DECREASE would be HUGE for acceptance.

It's VERY likely distance-based fares would ONLY apply to train and seabus fares where they have faregates to regulate and monitor ingoing and outgoing passengers. They may do it on BRT, but we don't have any proper BRT, so it depends on how they do that.

Buses will VERY likely remain base fare rides. I won't affect 90 minutes free transfers or 120 minute system times at all. I mean, right NOW zone are basically a crudely implemented distance based fare... but not evenly distributed. With a true distance based fare, you basically have 20-30 zone steps, dynamically set based on your starting station.

Get on a 30-minute bus ride from white rock to Surrey Central, for example, and then take the train to New Westminster. You'll likely pay LESS on the new system as Surrey Central to New Westminster is <6km.

On the other hand, taking a bus from Surrey to Langley will cost you a bit more. IN those cases, SOME travelers may opt to take a bus that gets them further east instead of taking the train if they don't value their time or comfort.

Riders end up paying more for convenience (faster, more frequent service) while long-distance bus riders get a bit of a break. It's kind of crazy that Scott Road to Columbia will cost more than Scott Road to Langley Town Centre when the Surrey SkyTrain extension is done.

[NewfBC]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

T It's kind of crazy that Scott Road to Columbia will cost more than Scott Road to Langley Town Centre when the Surrey SkyTrain extension is done.

Zone 3 to Zone 2 vs Zone 3 to Zone 4 should cost the same... no?

Ron.

[dpogue]

Originally Posted by NewfBC

Zone 3 to Zone 2 vs Zone 3 to Zone 4 should cost the same... no?

Ron.

There is no zone 4 in the current system. Everything south of the Fraser and east of Burnaby/New West is zone 3.

[NewfBC]

Originally Posted by dpogue

There is no zone 4 in the current system. Everything south of the Fraser and east of Burnaby/New West is zone 3.

There is also no Skytrain to Langley in the current system. Stay tuned.

Ron.

[casper]

Originally Posted by NewfBC

There is also no Skytrain to Langley in the current system. Stay tuned.

Ron.

Westcoast Express has a zone 4 and 5.

Zone 4: Pitt Meadows, Maple Meadows, Port Haney
Zone 5: Mission City.

If they redo all of this, I think it is time to get rid of premium paid for the airport as well as the premium paid for the west coast express.

[Migrant_Coconut]

I do wonder if they'd keep the base fare the same or lower it a buck or so... because by the same logic, there's really no need to pay $2.70 just for a short hop across one of the bridges.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by casper

...I think it is time to get rid of premium paid for the airport as well as the premium paid for the west coast express.

I don't mind the YVR premium. It's a specialty run for most people, not a regular commute, and they've carved out exemptions for residents, passholders and Sea Island trips.

[cganuelas1995]

Is it me or do community shuttle drivers drive like jackasses?

[chowhou]

Airport rapid transit fees are pretty common worldwide, and ours is pretty reasonable compared to others I believe. For example, the Hong Kong MTR is pretty famous for being significantly cheaper than the Skytrain, but taking the Airport Express from the airport to Hong Kong station is $120HKD (over $20 CAD).

It wouldn't be hard to implement in a distance based fare scheme. Simply make trips from Templeton to Bridgeport a $5 "distance".

[cganuelas1995]

Originally Posted by chowhou

Airport rapid transit fees are pretty common worldwide, and ours is pretty reasonable compared to others I believe. For example, the Hong Kong MTR is pretty famous for being significantly cheaper than the Skytrain, but taking the Airport Express from the airport to Hong Kong station is $120HKD (over $20 CAD).

It wouldn't be hard to implement in a distance based fare scheme. Simply make trips from Templeton to Bridgeport a $5 "distance".

With regards to buses, how do we do DBF without requiring people to tap off while alighting? Compass reader on the pole?

[dpogue]

Originally Posted by cganuelas1995

With regards to buses, how do we do DBF without requiring people to tap off while alighting? Compass reader on the pole?

Standard buses are planned to remain a flat fare.

For BRT, it sounds like they're planning to have Compass readers/gates at the bus stop platforms, so you would tap in/out at the bus stop rather than on the vehicle itself.

[Lexus]

I spotted the e-bus today at Coquitlam Central with a sign on the front that said “Testing only.”
It seems to be a Turkish manufacturer: Karsan e-Jest

Untitled by Lexus LX 700, on Flickr

https://www.karsan.com/en/electric-bus/e-jest

• Video Link

• Video Link

[RedArbutus]

So this is Translink testing those, yes? I wonder if they're comparing them to the Electrips they tested in mid-March?

https://buzzer.translink.ca/2025/03/were-testing-a-30-foot-battery-electric-bus/

[Kisai]

Originally Posted by cganuelas1995

With regards to buses, how do we do DBF without requiring people to tap off while alighting? Compass reader on the pole?

Option 1: you monitor for two taps on the same vehicle. Not technically harder.

Option 2: for BRT/RapidBus you put a "Tap-in" station at the bus stop and have everyone tap in before the bus arrives, so everyone can just get on the bus as it pulls in, just like a skytrain station. Then people have to tap off the bus when they leave, or tap-out at the bus stop they leave at.

The reason buses became 1-zone was largely because people forget to tap-out and get charged a full 3-zone. The busses all have readers at all doors, yet the readers that aren't at the front of the bus are never used.

There's also Option 3:
Have a GPS-connected app to tap-in and tap-out. So activate the app, tap once somewhere on the bus, and when you get off the bus, you pull the app up and go "I'm done my trip", and the phone will register the location you "tapped out at" and then wait 10 minutes to see if you're still in the bus route path. If you're "still on the bus" because you tapped early, it will check again in 10 minutes. If you haven't moved in 10 minutes and are 20m away from the bus route, it will consider it tapped out.

That's something a little more complex to setup, but it's entirely in the realm of doable.

[cganuelas1995]

Originally Posted by Kisai

Option 1: you monitor for two taps on the same vehicle. Not technically harder.

Option 2: for BRT/RapidBus you put a "Tap-in" station at the bus stop and have everyone tap in before the bus arrives, so everyone can just get on the bus as it pulls in, just like a skytrain station. Then people have to tap off the bus when they leave, or tap-out at the bus stop they leave at.

The reason buses became 1-zone was largely because people forget to tap-out and get charged a full 3-zone. The busses all have readers at all doors, yet the readers that aren't at the front of the bus are never used.

There's also Option 3:
Have a GPS-connected app to tap-in and tap-out. So activate the app, tap once somewhere on the bus, and when you get off the bus, you pull the app up and go "I'm done my trip", and the phone will register the location you "tapped out at" and then wait 10 minutes to see if you're still in the bus route path. If you're "still on the bus" because you tapped early, it will check again in 10 minutes. If you haven't moved in 10 minutes and are 20m away from the bus route, it will consider it tapped out.

That's something a little more complex to setup, but it's entirely in the realm of doable.

I think the tapping out on the vehicle is a non starter because you'll end up with a line up of people trying to get off, extending the dwell time especially for those busy routes.

[Mac Write]

I've been looking at OMC 2 from Apple Maps, Google Maps and I can't figure out how they got a fully assembled Mark V out of the OMC 2 2 track internal tracks to the track connecting OMC 1. I can't see a direct shot from the building onto the overpass track. the trains have to go through 2 switches and I don't see the room for a 5-car train to clear the switches to make it onto the track to get over to OMC 1.

[madog222]

Originally Posted by Mac Write

I've been looking at OMC 2 from Apple Maps, Google Maps and I can't figure out how they got a fully assembled Mark V out of the OMC 2 2 track internal tracks to the track connecting OMC 1. I can't see a direct shot from the building onto the overpass track. the trains have to go through 2 switches and I don't see the room for a 5-car train to clear the switches to make it onto the track to get over to OMC 1.

Presumably they do the final coupling on the overpass track parallel to the main line.

[jollyburger]

Not sure if these are new but a bunch of renderings/photos of the new OCC at Edmonds



https://www.theplan.it/eng/award-2025-Tr...ts-and-engineers-of-record-hatch-stantec

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by madog222

Presumably they do the final coupling on the overpass track parallel to the main line.

They don't have to couple the entire train together as one operation. They can feed the first two cars onto the connecting track, couple them, then move them along to make space for the third car, couple it, etc. etc.

[Mac Write]

Can anyone get concrete info on this? ChatGPT extended thinking said it was a straight shot even when I said it wasn't. So lets get some contrite info and maybe they will do a video on how they assemble the train for us.