Port of Vancouver Discussion

[officedweller]

The footings of the north viaduct have also been unbolted from the foundations for seismic stability.

https://www.reddit.com/r/vancouver/comments/hkojtx/interesting_fact_lions_gate_bridge_piers_on_the/

[aberdeen5698]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

The deck replacement was like 60% of the cost of doing a new 4 lane cable stayed bridge so it wasn't cheap.

That's because they kept the bridge open while they did it. Amazing.

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

You may already know this, but American Bridge (the company involved with the LGB project) went on to handle a similar project on the Angus Macdonald Bridge between Halifax and Dartmouth in the mid-2010s.

Yeah, I remember driving down the St. Lawrence and exclaiming "Hey, they've got a Lion's Gate Bridge here!!!".

[jollyburger]

The B.C. government has thrown its support behind a proposal to dredge Burrard Inlet to allow oil tankers to fill up from the Trans Mountain pipeline and still fit under the Second Narrows Bridge.

Energy Minister Adrian Dix said the idea, most recently advanced by Prime Minister Mark Carney in March, would utilize the additional capacity of the newly expanded pipeline, which transports diluted bitumen and refined oil products from Alberta to the Westridge Marine Terminal in Burnaby.

“Broadly, the premier and us have indicated our support for it,” Dix said in an interview.

Currently, the largest ships that can be accommodated at the Burnaby terminal are Aframax tankers. But they can’t be filled to their maximum capacity of almost 600,000 barrels of oil, due to the weight of the ship then striking the bottom of Burrard Inlet.

Dix argued there would be fewer tankers overall if existing ones were filled to capacity. However, the proposal is also likely to produce renewed concern from environmental advocates and local officials worried about the impact of a tanker crash and oil leakage in local waterways — something the BC NDP government had expressed concern about in the past as well.

https://www.nsnews.com/economy-law-polit...-to-tmx-allies-in-burrard-inlet-10619207

[chowhou]

I wonder how much environmentalist backlash this one is going to get, perhaps none at all because dredging is out-of-sight, out-of-mind. Max laden Aframax tankers have a draft of 52 feet which according to the depth charts probably means dredging in front of the TMX terminal, beneath the Second Narrows and to the west, and the entire First Narrows from the Lions Gate to Brockton Point.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by chowhou

I wonder how much environmentalist backlash this one is going to get, perhaps none at all because dredging is out-of-sight, out-of-mind. Max laden Aframax tankers have a draft of 52 feet which according to the depth charts probably means dredging in front of the TMX terminal, beneath the Second Narrows and to the west, and the entire First Narrows from the Lions Gate to Brockton Point.

There's substantially less support for environmental issues that have a localized impact than larger projects that can directly be tied to an increase in emissions which affects everyone. You'll see some, but most won't notice, and I think overall most people have recognized our fate is a world with a destroyed environment, so largely the response now is to ignore it.

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by chowhou

I wonder how much environmentalist backlash this one is going to get, perhaps none at all because dredging is out-of-sight, out-of-mind. Max laden Aframax tankers have a draft of 52 feet which according to the depth charts probably means dredging in front of the TMX terminal, beneath the Second Narrows and to the west, and the entire First Narrows from the Lions Gate to Brockton Point.

I didn't realize it was so shallow around Lions Gate. I would have assumed the cruise ships would require similar depth.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

I didn't realize it was so shallow around Lions Gate. I would have assumed the cruise ships would require similar depth.

I believe cruise ships and freighters have pretty much completely opposite requirements. The entire business model of a cruise ship is to have as many decks above water as possible in order to have nice pleasurable areas for clients. Any amount of ship underwater is wasted passenger space. The entire business model of a freighter is to load down the ship with as much cargo as much as possible without sinking it. Any amount of ship above water is wasted cargo space!

[MIPS]

Which is why there's been so much debate over the Lions Gate Bridge being "too low" for cruise traffic but cargo traffic has never really cared.

[chowhou]

I remember being taught as a kid to look and see how much red was exposed on the hulls of bulk freighters to tell if they were coming or going. Lots of red exposed? That's an empty ship coming into harbour. Not much red exposed? That ship is laden down and ready to leave.

(Put your crab traps down near the ships ready to leave, they probably just illegally dumped their sewage so the crabs are swarming around them. )

[jollyburger]

Here's the risk assessments for the bridges that includes details on the mudline

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/drivin...018-03-16-lions-gate-risk-assessment.pdf

https://www2.gov.bc.ca/assets/gov/drivin...18-03-16-ironworkers-risk-assessment.pdf

This article from 2014 says they were waiting on Metro Vancouver to finish the new watermains because dredging wasn't possible because of two watermains.

https://www.pressreader.com/canada/vancouver-sun/20140510/282269548418158

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by chowhou

(Put your crab traps down near the ships ready to leave, they probably just illegally dumped their sewage so the crabs are swarming around them. )

Ewwww...

[jollyburger]

Roberts Bank Terminal 2 project moving closer to reality

A new container terminal facility at Roberts Bank in Delta has moved another step closer to reality with the Vancouver Fraser Port Authority (VFPA) issuing a notice announcing that procurement is set to begin this summer.

The port authority on Wednesday (May 14) said it will issue a request for qualifications in July 2025 for a construction partner to deliver the landmass and wharf component of the Roberts Bank Terminal 2 (RBT2) project, a significant step towards delivering the project.

In a news release, Victor Pan, VFPA Chief Financial Officer, said, RBT2 is a transformational, nation building project that will support Canada’s economic security and trade resilience, enabling the trade of more than $100 billion in goods annually once fully operational.

The project will be delivered via a progressive design-build contracting model, he said, adding more than 18,000 jobs will be created during construction, and once operational the new terminal is anticipated to generate more than 17,000 well-paying, long-term jobs and add more than $3 billion in GDP annually.

Construction mobilization and early works are expected to occur in 2027, with major land reclamation works expected to begin in 2028. Terminal operations are set to begin in the mid-2030s.

https://www.biv.com/news/transportation/...roject-moving-closer-to-reality-10662481

[casper]

Originally Posted by MIPS

Which is why there's been so much debate over the Lions Gate Bridge being "too low" for cruise traffic but cargo traffic has never really cared.

We should look at potentially building a cruise ship birth at BC Ferries Tsawwassen terminal. Time to look at capturing more of those tourist dollars.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by casper

We should look at potentially building a cruise ship birth at BC Ferries Tsawwassen terminal. Time to look at capturing more of those tourist dollars.

Studied and rejected. See previous page.

[Capitol Hill]

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news...cline-from-record-breaking-previous-year

Vancouver cruise passenger numbers are in, 1.2 Million passengers on 301 sailings, down from 1.3 Million in 2024. In comparison, Seattle had 1.9 Million passengers on 298 sailings.

Vancouver averaged 1987 passengers per sailing, Seattle 3187 passengers per sailing. Of course, Vancouver’s cruise terminal is a nicer operation than Seattle’s.

[djmk]

Originally Posted by Capitol Hill

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news...cline-from-record-breaking-previous-year

Vancouver cruise passenger numbers are in, 1.2 Million passengers on 301 sailings, down from 1.3 Million in 2024. In comparison, Seattle had 1.9 Million passengers on 298 sailings.

Vancouver averaged 1987 passengers per sailing, Seattle 3187 passengers per sailing. Of course, Vancouver’s cruise terminal is a nicer operation than Seattle’s.

Vancouver has 62% of the passengers per ship than Seattle. Either Vancouver is getting significantly smaller ships or same size ships with significantly less people

[madog222]

^Smaller ships

[Capitol Hill]

Originally Posted by djmk

Vancouver has 62% of the passengers per ship than Seattle. Either Vancouver is getting significantly smaller ships or same size ships with significantly less people

Many, but not all, of the ships that Seattle gets can only get under the Lions Gate Bridge at low tide.

[djmk]

Originally Posted by Capitol Hill

Many, but not all, of the ships that Seattle gets can only get under the Lions Gate Bridge at low tide.

we need a different low tide

[C3YVR]

Many of the ships Vancouver gets are smaller but attract the luxury segment of the market. Pre/post passengers will stay longer and spend more, this partially explains why Vancouver has a luxury retail district and Seattle doesn't.