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  #1281  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 12:27 PM
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EnvisionSaintJohn EnvisionSaintJohn is online now
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Originally Posted by DevelopmentAndy View Post
Intellectual midgets saying "We need immigration." No, locals can also work at Tim Horton's. Criticizing the idea of immigration reform is just sad with this Port Dog and Pony Show. Thanks for posting though.
I'd say historically, Saint John has been at its best when it was an entry point for immigration and had a steady flow of immigrants from around the world looking to find a better life in Canada. Immigrants no longer arrive in Saint John by ship at the Port, but they do arrive at the air-port. For the city to grow, develop, and prosper, we need to attract migrants, both international and internal. Toronto might not need more immigrants, but Saint John absolutely does.

Saint John's problem has never been immigrants. Saint John's current problem is an outdated property tax system that the government has yet reform, and nearly 50% of the CMA population living outside the city limits. Even if the best we get is moderate property tax reform and more of the KV/GB suburbs property taxes going towards a regional budget, the situation would be fundamentally better for the Port City and for the region as a whole. Still, the optimal solution for the city and the region as a whole would be some form of regional amalgamation where all the constituent communities of the region contribute equally to a regional budget, even if they retain their councils and city/town identities.

The biggest thing holding back Port Saint John's growth back is our small population. Saint John should get rid of that "Small City: Big Heart" slogan, yesterday! The only good thing about that slogan is that the city did not have to pay the marketing students in New Jersey that came up with it.

It really is a shame that the city went with a free slogan/brand picked by marketing students in New Jersey for a school project instead of doing something fun and interesting like hosting a public competition for the new city slogan. While the slogan was free, the marketing campaign was not. Saint John deserves a better slogan that that.

The city's slogan should be aspirational, not self deprecating... "Canada's First City", "First Canadian City", "Canada's Port City", or "the Port City" would all be much better slogan's for the city than Small City, Big Heart...

Port Saint John at least has some big, aspirational ideas for the region, but the city and province don't exactly seem to have a lot of big ideas or big solutions to make Saint John a better city and region. I don't get what the hold up is to fixing the housing crisis in Saint John. The provincial and federal governments should be funding major affordable housing and population growth solutions for Saint John so that we see way more mid rises and high rises going up not just around the Central Peninsula, but around the entire city and region.

The province has given Saint John an especially bad deal in terms of fair taxation for nearly half a century, and that no amount of tax reforms will make up for. The federal government has also let Saint John down in the past many times. It's time for both the feds and the province to step up and attempt to right these historical wrongs by funding some big, ambitious housing and infrastructure solutions here in Canada's oldest incorporated city... a city with one of the biggest infrastructure deficits in all of Canada. It's not unreasonable to expect housing developments to keep up with growth, but for the most part, that has not been happening in Saint John since 2020, as we have seen thousands of renters in Saint John be squeezed out of the rental market.

Not only should the lack of housing not be an issue used to foster hate against immigrants, it should be an issue that is actually helped solved by immigrants. We don't need more TFW's to help out Tim Horton's owners, , but we do need more immigrants that want to come to Canada and be builders... literally. The last time I checked NB's housing minister lives in Uptown Saint John, and both he and the premier are Liberals like the Prime Minister himself. Mark Carney literally never shuts up about how Canada will build big, build bold and build now to not just get out of the housing crisis, but also the economic crisis that Canada finds itself facing. I think Hickey and Holt should be leaning on the Carney Liberals to fund some big housing projects here in New Brunswick's main three cities, but especially for Saint John, as the housing minister certainly knows how much Saint John needs the help more than any other city in New Brunswick.


Ports will undoubtedly be central to Canada's economic strategy that seeks to expand the reach of our global trading relationships. Ports like Saint John could even be an important part of Canada's housing solutions through the import of modular housing. Though one day, it would be best for Canada to be a net exporter of modular housing products.

Here's an example of a 10 storey, modular apartment building in China with modules the size of shipping containers that was assembled in a single day:

Video Link


A lot of countries have a comparative advantage to Canada when it comes to manufacturing things like modular housing. While the country remains in a housing crisis, we should be looking at all the options around the world, or starting new ones. JDI and other Canadian companies are already expanding modular housing manufacturing here in Canada, but they could also look to expand their operations abroad in countries like Mexico with lower labour costs and more robust manufacturing sectors. Canadian companies and Canadian resources could contribute to global housing solutions, and ports like Saint John could help make these global developments and connections possible.

The last thing a growing port city needs is an isolationist attitude... we need the growth, we need the immigrants, we need the big, positive ideas. Here in the Saint John Region, one of the best things about growth via migration (both international and internal), is that these new people bring fresh, new perspectives, new experiences, and new ideas to this old city that has seen its fair share of economic and demographic challenges. Many of these new Saint Johners are coming from much bigger Canadian cities and much bigger cities from around the world where the problems of Saint John probably do seem quite small and insignificant in comparison to where they are coming from.

I hope we could both agree that immigrants are not the problem in Saint John, and that instead, the problem is a lack of big solutions to solve big problems like the housing and affordability crises and a lack of solutions to provide better economic opportunities to the people of Saint John, New Brunswick, and Canada.
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  #1282  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 1:03 PM
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Does anyone know if these remaining "pockets" of water will be filled in, or do they serve a purpose?

Moreover, how about future port expansions? Here's a look at the Port's still yet to be updated land use plan from 2011. We should be getting a new land use plan soon, as this plan was designed to last no longer than 10-15 years, and much of it is quite outdated.



Sections 9, 6, and 5 seem like the logical next steps for future port expansion in the inner harbour, and I hope Wayne Long and Dominic LeBlanc are doing everything in their power to make these expansions possible.
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Peace and Athabasca and Coppermine and Slave, And Yukon and Mackenzie—the highroads of the brave. Saskatchewan, Assiniboine, the Bow and the Qu'Appelle, And many a prairie river whose name is like a spell. They rumor through the twilight at the edge of the unknown, "There's a message waiting for you, and a kingdom all your own. — Bliss Carman
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  #1283  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 1:12 PM
CharlotteCountyLogan CharlotteCountyLogan is offline
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I see a Royal Caribbean ship is diverting to SJ on Monday due to weather making for another 3 ship day. Saint John is certainly reaping the rewards from a busy storm season.

Last edited by CharlotteCountyLogan; Oct 10, 2025 at 3:14 PM.
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  #1284  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 1:39 PM
FromMaine FromMaine is offline
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The CES was a frankenstein of services, really covered way too much in one giant loop that was a mash of Transatlantic and Carribean/South American.

Sounds like they'll announce a new service rotation in the coming weeks to cover the ports, my guess is they'll get something closer to what the AT3, or repurpose AT1 or AT2 to hit SJ.

Will be interesting to see what kinds of vessels this brings to SJ too.

https://www.hapag-lloyd.com/en/services-...xpress-service--ces--service--here-.html
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  #1285  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 3:04 PM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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Originally Posted by CharlotteCountyLogan View Post
I see a Royal Caribbean shit is diverting to SJ on Monday due to weather making for another 3 ship day. Saint John is certainly reaping the rewards from a busy storm season.
Wonder if they will try and open the City Market? Tough to have 3 ships in on a statutory holiday when most everything uptown is closed.
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  #1286  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 3:28 PM
bingun bingun is offline
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Wonder if they will try and open the City Market? Tough to have 3 ships in on a statutory holiday when most everything uptown is closed.
They've been opening it on Sundays for cruise ship days, which I think is a great move, but I doubt they will be open on Monday.

We also had a triple cruise ship day for Truth and Reconciliation Day. I wonder if it is deliberate on the part of the cruise ship companies? I have also noticed we get fewer Friday/Saturday visits.
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  #1287  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 9:39 PM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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Originally Posted by bingun View Post
They've been opening it on Sundays for cruise ship days, which I think is a great move, but I doubt they will be open on Monday.

We also had a triple cruise ship day for Truth and Reconciliation Day. I wonder if it is deliberate on the part of the cruise ship companies? I have also noticed we get fewer Friday/Saturday visits.
Truth and Reconciliation Day is pretty irrelevant as everything of interest to visitors is still open. Dumping thousands of passengers into a city on a day that it is virtually closed is a little different.
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  #1288  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 9:56 PM
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Truth and Reconciliation Day is pretty irrelevant as everything of interest to visitors is still open. Dumping thousands of passengers into a city on a day that it is virtually closed is a little different.
I mentioned it because the city market was in fact closed.
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  #1289  
Old Posted Oct 10, 2025, 11:33 PM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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I mentioned it because the city market was in fact closed.
That's weird. Although I suppose the city treats it as a government facility not a commercial enterprise.


edit Now that I think about it I suspect that being city owned and controlled the root cause of many of the issues with the Market.

Last edited by sailor734; Oct 11, 2025 at 1:25 PM.
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  #1290  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2025, 12:35 PM
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199,154 passengers now planned for 2025. A new record. 82 ships.
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  #1291  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2025, 1:27 PM
sailor734 sailor734 is offline
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199,154 passengers now planned for 2025. A new record. 82 ships.
We could easily get one more diversion to push us over 200K. The Atlantic seems to stay active into November these days.
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  #1292  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2025, 7:50 PM
bingun bingun is offline
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Between a strong cruise season and the situation south of the border, I am really hoping we see some strong tourism numbers/statistics in the Saint John region and NB as a whole.

I am not sure what the best attraction/metric will be, but things like the Fundy Trail Provincial Park might be one to watch out for, as that is ticketed per person. The museum would be ideal, but we need a few years. With the free entry over the summer, I am not sure if the national parks will be accurately tracking numbers this year.
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  #1293  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2025, 8:08 PM
darkharbour darkharbour is offline
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Originally Posted by bingun View Post
Between a strong cruise season and the situation south of the border, I am really hoping we see some strong tourism numbers/statistics in the Saint John region and NB as a whole.

I am not sure what the best attraction/metric will be, but things like the Fundy Trail Provincial Park might be one to watch out for, as that is ticketed per person. The museum would be ideal, but we need a few years. With the free entry over the summer, I am not sure if the national parks will be accurately tracking numbers this year.
Full tourist numbers will be out later this fall I believe, but I know from people in the industry that at least one small town in the region saw visitor information centre stats up by 75% this summer.
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  #1294  
Old Posted Oct 11, 2025, 9:39 PM
CharlotteCountyLogan CharlotteCountyLogan is offline
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Being from costal Charlotte County I've seen a lot more tourists around and I've heard from people that there have been more tourists than normal. Good to see people want to travel to our beautiful part of the world.
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  #1295  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2025, 12:41 PM
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bridgeoftea bridgeoftea is offline
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I've always wondered why there isn't some sort of local law or policy that when a cruise ship is in port, your business must be open. Doesn't need to be a full day either, 10-3pm or something.

It must leave a bad taste in peoples mouths when they're walking around and nothing is open.
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  #1296  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2025, 2:07 PM
bingun bingun is offline
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Originally Posted by bridgeoftea View Post
I've always wondered why there isn't some sort of local law or policy that when a cruise ship is in port, your business must be open. Doesn't need to be a full day either, 10-3pm or something.

It must leave a bad taste in peoples mouths when they're walking around and nothing is open.
I think mandating stores to be open might be a little excessive lol. As long as there aren't regulations or obstacles to them being open, it really comes down to the profit incentive. I've been to other, much larger cities on public holidays, and lots of stuff is also closed.

While I think it would be great if the market could be open, it is not straightforward, as you would need to coordinate with all the vendors — or most of them— and with municipal employees.

It could also be wise to include stipulations in the container village leases that they must be open on certain days, such as holidays, when there are X cruise ships in port.
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  #1297  
Old Posted Oct 13, 2025, 3:06 PM
DyAm00394 DyAm00394 is offline
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It could also be wise to include stipulations in the container village leases that they must be open on certain days, such as holidays, when there are X cruise ships in port.
I agree. At least the Container Village is open today until 7pm, so there is at least something open for the cruise passengers today.
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  #1298  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2025, 12:54 PM
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Atlantic Canada ferries see spike in traffic after ferry fares drop

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/article/at...spike-in-traffic-after-ferry-fares-drop/

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Between Aug. 1 and Sept. 25, Bay Ferries saw a 34 per cent jump in passenger and 39 per cent jump in vehicle traffic travelling between Saint John and Digby, N.S., compared to last year.
Great news, more than I expected.
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  #1299  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2025, 3:16 PM
cdnguys cdnguys is offline
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Atlantic Canada ferries see spike in traffic after ferry fares drop

https://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/article/at...spike-in-traffic-after-ferry-fares-drop/



Great news, more than I expected.
So revenue would only be down 30% on a 39% increase in vehicle crossings (fares cut in 1/2). Nice trend! Wondering if they have capacity to double the vehicle crossings and and land at same revenue as before.
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  #1300  
Old Posted Oct 20, 2025, 5:27 PM
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So revenue would only be down 30% on a 39% increase in vehicle crossings (fares cut in 1/2). Nice trend! Wondering if they have capacity to double the vehicle crossings and and land at same revenue as before.
Traffic doesn't have to double to break even on services like that. The people using the ferry in both directions don't just drive around and return home. They spend money in all types of businesses before returning home. That benefits the local businesses and the government who collects taxes on all those extra transactions. That benefit continues to flow into further transactions down the line. It entices more tourists to maybe take the ferry to Nova Scotia and return overland, or vice versa, which means more people may actually decide to do that kind of trip.

To be honest, I don't know how they could actually calculate the total benefit of more affordable travel options, and at what level they actually start getting a positive ROI, but they have to do better than they have in the past.
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