California High Speed Rail Thread

[TWAK]

d) the destroyer is a new one, but it could be a one-off.

Originally Posted by jmecklenborg

When it comes to infrastructure projects, there are three types of politicians:

a)the booster
b)the can-kicker
c)the obstructionist


Jerry Brown was a booster. Newsom is a can-kicker. Trump is an obstructionist.

A city only gets a booster mayor and a state only gets a booster governor when that person has no higher aspirations.

The Governator was around when voters approved CAHSR, so that can put perspective into why the project costs more in 2025.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by TWAK

d) the destroyer is a new one, but it could be a one-off.

The Governator was around when voters approved CAHSR, so that can put perspective into why the project costs more in 2025.

The "flaw" in the CAHSR plan wasn't the physical plan. It was that the state bond issue simply aimed to make it "too big to fail" and then force the federal government (or possibly a future state bond issue) to bail it out at some unknown future date. But that bailout requires a convergence of people that you can't count on being there more than once every 10 years. And the more and more opponents throw dirt on any project, the less likely that a future moderate will go along with a booster. You literally have to wait for a generation of politicians, journalists, and the public to die off because they made their minds up 30 years ago and they aren't going to change.

I think the really crazy thing about CAHSR isn't the politicians - it's the unending opposition from the LA Times and other local media.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by jmecklenborg

The "flaw" in the CAHSR plan wasn't the physical plan. It was that the state bond issue simply aimed to make it "too big to fail" and then force the federal government (or possibly a future state bond issue) to bail it out at some unknown future date. But that bailout requires a convergence of people that you can't count on being there more than once every 10 years. And the more and more opponents throw dirt on any project, the less likely that a future moderate will go along with a booster. You literally have to wait for a generation of politicians, journalists, and the public to die off because they made their minds up 30 years ago and they aren't going to change.

I think the really crazy thing about CAHSR isn't the politicians - it's the unending opposition from the LA Times and other local media.

Hmm... I don't get that the LA Times is against CAHSR. There have been Op-Eds in the LA Times against CAHSR, but then there have also been Op-Eds that have been FOR it, too. I don't read the LA Times too often, but I know they have published articles about delays and cost overruns, but that doesn't mean that they're against (or for) CAHSR. They're just reporting the delays and cost overruns, which should be transparent, since it is a state government project.

[Busy Bee]

I'm not sure the Ralph Vartabedian anti-HSR musings necessarily represent the stance of the LA Times at large but they seem to have no problem having a cynical hyper-critical anti-CaHSR message being the predominant theme people interpret.

[CrazyCres]

CA High-Speed Rail passenger service could start in Central Valley before 2033

The scenario in the report that provides the highest cost-recovery potential would connect the project to Gilroy from Madera and to Palmdale from Bakersfield, but without high-speed rail infrastructure to Merced. That scenario could provide a cost-recovery ratio between 192% and 315%. The inclusion of high-speed rail infrastructure to Merced would still offer a high recovery ratio, potentially between 186% and 304%, the report says.

https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/high-speed-rail/article311748729.html

[202_Cyclist]

California High-Speed Rail Authority accelerates timeline for 2026 rail installation

Progressive Railroading
Aug. 29, 2025

"The California High-Speed Rail Authority’s (CHSRA) board yesterday approved the issuance of invitations for bids for the provision of high-speed rail track and other required system components. The materials will be used to install the nation’s first electrified high-speed track and systems within the next year.

"This procurement will not only accelerate construction of high-speed track, but by purchasing directly from American manufacturers, we will deliver significant savings to the state," said CHSRA CEO Ian Choudri in a press release.

American manufacturers can competitively bid in six separate procurements, just as authority nears completion of its southern railhead project in Kern County. This 150-acre rail staging yard located at the southernmost end of the state's Central Valley segment will allow freight trains to receive and deploy the materials directly to the point of installation along the initial 119-mile alignment. Materials needed to lay track along the 119-mile segment will be 100% state funded and include several commodities, including rail, ties, overhead contact system poles, fiber optic cable and ballast, with a total approved cost of $507 million spread over multiple anticipated contract awards..."

https://www.progressiverailroading.com/h...meline-for-2026-rail-installation--75290

[38 Geary]

Nice!

[202_Cyclist]

The rest of the country is increasingly a shithole but at least California is leading the way.

Legislature, Gov. Gavin Newsom agree to fund high-speed rail through 2045
https://amp.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article312074405.html

[patriotizzy]

I've always wanted the high speed rail but this state instills no confidence when it comes to any project. I'm doubtful but hopeful.

[Busy Bee]

Great to hear California is stepping up. This should have been the case with firm substantial state funding commitments from day one.

[electricron]

Yes, the State of California has promised to fund CHSR $1 billion/year until 2045, another $20 billion in total. Actually, only anther $15 billion because the present program lasts until 2030.
Good news, the IOS has been funded. Bad news, not enough funding in place to reach both LA and SF.

And there is always a possibility a future Governor would rather use this funding for something else, and redirects the funds. Future legislatures are not beholden to future expenditures promised today. They could kill this funding, or add more funding. It could go either way.

Never-the-less, California has still left CHSR in a condition of not being fully funded.

[202_Cyclist]

More money, less red tape. Here’s CA high-speed rail’s wish list for success

By Erik Galicia
September 17, 2025
Fresno Bee


The Gilroy-to-Palmdale high-speed rail scenario, with no Merced extension, produces a cost-recovery ratio of between 191.93% and 314.52%, according to a new report from the California High-Speed Rail Authority. SCREENSHOT CAHSRA
rylink=cpy

“Since becoming its CEO last year, Ian Choudri has made changes at California’s High-Speed Rail Authority.

He reorganized agency leadership, brought in experts from the U.S. military and the private sector’s Brightline West bullet train initiative. Choudri also launched a complete review of California high-speed rail to find the quickest, most cost-effective and financially successful path forward.

Amid the Trump administration’s pull-back of federal dollars, the project’s roadmap has begun to take shape…”

https://www.fresnobee.com/news/local/high-speed-rail/article312028146.html

[HusBy]

Well it's disappointing not to see the Palmdale to LA segment on this map.

At least with CalTrain electrification the trains can run through to SF, unfortunately we're stuck with Metrolink and their horrible leadership, so we can't have the same.

With this new focused effort, where does it leave the Palmdale to LA segment? Can it still finishing planning and engineering?

[Crawford]

That Caltrain route still has plenty of road crossings. I assume they would remove all crossings if HSR got to that section, right?

Also, the right-of-way is just two track. So they would comingle the Caltrain and HSR service? It would work but there would be capacity restrictions, especially at peak hours.

[38 Geary]

Originally Posted by Crawford

That Caltrain route still has plenty of road crossings. I assume they would remove all crossings if HSR got to that section, right?

Also, the right-of-way is just two track. So they would comingle the Caltrain and HSR service? It would work but there would be capacity restrictions, especially at peak hours.

There's currently 71 at grade crossings on the Caltrain corridor. Some are being converted to grade separated crossings, but the ones that aren't will be upgraded to quad gates to allow for 110 mph speeds. I think eventually they plan to convert all to full grade separated though over the next 30 years, which would bring the speeds up to 125 mph. At 110 mph they estimate a run time of 2 hours and 38 minutes from LA's Union Station to SF's Salesforce Transit Center. They do plan to blend service, but there will be passing tracks at strategic locations so HSR trains can overtake Caltrain. CAHSR in general will run much less frequently than Caltrain.

[HusBy]

Originally Posted by homebucket

There's currently 71 at grade crossings on the Caltrain corridor. Some are being converted to grade separated crossings, but the ones that aren't will be upgraded to quad gates to allow for 110 mph speeds. I think eventually they plan to convert all to full grade separated though over the next 30 years, which would bring the speeds up to 125 mph. At 110 mph they estimate a run time of 2 hours and 38 minutes from LA's Union Station to SF's Salesforce Transit Center. They do plan to blend service, but there will be passing tracks at strategic locations so HSR trains can overtake Caltrain. CAHSR in general will run much less frequently than Caltrain.

Ok that's all really good to know. Still wondering what the plan for Palmadale <> LA Union Station will be. Until then, the system will be hamstrung at best.

[ardecila]

Caltrain has a neat map of all the crossings:
https://www.caltrain.com/ccs/interactivemap

Virtually all crossings from San Francisco to San Jose are grade separated or have a project in planning/design to add grade separation, with the exception of Burlingame and San Mateo and a few others. South of San Jose, Caltrain is lagging a bit especially in the sprawling areas of Morgan Hill and Gilroy. I think they have been punting on that section because CAHSR was considering building a new HSR-only corridor next to the 101 freeway.

[TWAK]

So many jurisdictions on the map from the Fresno Bee.

Originally Posted by HusBy

Well it's disappointing not to see the Palmdale to LA segment on this map.

At least with CalTrain electrification the trains can run through to SF, unfortunately we're stuck with Metrolink and their horrible leadership, so we can't have the same.

With this new focused effort, where does it leave the Palmdale to LA segment? Can it still finishing planning and engineering?

Hopefully there is a way to get Metrolink electrified like CalTrain, at least for the portions that will be blended.

Perhaps any part that's blended should be electrified first.

[craigs]

Originally Posted by TWAK

So many jurisdictions on the map from the Fresno Bee.

Hopefully there is a way to get Metrolink electrified like CalTrain, at least for the portions that will be blended.

Perhaps any part that's blended should be electrified first.

IIRC, for the initial segment of CAHSR, the two will only share tracks for about 13.5 miles between Burbank Airport North and Los Angeles Union Station.

[202_Cyclist]

Originally Posted by TWAK

So many jurisdictions on the map from the Fresno Bee.

Hopefully there is a way to get Metrolink electrified like CalTrain, at least for the portions that will be blended.

Perhaps any part that's blended should be electrified first.

Indeed, there was a recent excellent proposal for Metrolink electrification.

https://bsky.app/profile/calelectricrail.org/post/3lyvpgkixv22w