The 401

[sonysnob]

Originally Posted by Gresto

If what they do is called picking up litter, I have a different understanding of the term. In recent years, there has been no - or extremely inadequate - litter pick-up in my area, as far as I can tell. At the 401 exits in central Toronto, they mow the cloverleaf and ramp lawns, shredding the garbage within into a million pieces. What the hell use is that?!

I don't really care to argue about the semantics of litter pickup. But both this year and last year, I've seen work crews from the Area Maintenance Contractor crews out in April and May cleaning up litter in the vicinity of Markham Road in Scarborough.

I'm guessing you are going to argue with me no matter what I write, but you have to keep in mind that there are some areas of our highway network that are extremely difficult to cleanup. Think about the areas around the basketweave, or at the 409 interchange. In some of those areas, the shoulder of the highway aren't exactly full width, so a work truck as well as blocker truck would need to be parked on the shoulder potentially sticking into a live lane. A contractor is pretty limited at what times they could do the type of work that could negatively impact traffic flow.

[Gresto]

^ You're guessing wrong, jack. Unnecessary escalation. I have zero interest in trifling internet arguments, so you just keep believing what you do, and I'll keep believing the shredded litter that I see everywhere with my own eyes.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by Gresto

trifling internet arguments

Not a dig at you or sonysnob, but this forum seems to have been worse for bickering over the past year, and it was always rife with it.

Maybe that's just a reflection of today's society (?)

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

this forum seems to have been worse for bickering over the past year, and it was always rife with it.

Maybe that's just a reflection of today's society (?)

lol, no

Old internet forums are nothing compared to other sites out there, especially social media. We're super tame and a lot of us have known one another in one way or another, either from years of interacting online or meeting IRL

This is totally fine. 401 garbage bad. 'Nuff said.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by haljackey

lol, no

I know, it was probably my "doh!" moment of the day.

In the end, I think we all want the best for our cities and our country. Things are just more divided than ever, which is scary. And it's not even a home-grown issue!

[Dengler Avenue]

^ divided highway good (up to certain extent), divided society bad (no matter what)

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

Things are just more divided than ever, which is scary. And it's not even a home-grown issue!

Nah, this is another falsity IMO. Too many people fall for this but in the end nearly all of us all want to make the world a better place. Just different ways of thinking / acting to get there.

It's just big tent/net politics or whatever. The fewer, but larger nets you cast, the more you're going to catch, but it's a hodgepodge containing stuff you don't want. If you don't sort / chuck it overboard, which includes some decision making, you're goona end up with a bunch of different things that while together, don't really go together.

I think just about every Ontarian wants an efficient, nice looking 401. It's the backbone of our province's economy and it's condition is marketable to visitors and business interests. If it looks great and flows great, they're goona be impressed and that can spell good things. If it's clogged and in bad shape / full of garbage, you're goona get the opposite effect.

[Gresto]

Originally Posted by ScreamingViking

Not a dig at you or sonysnob, but this forum seems to have been worse for bickering over the past year, and it was always rife with it.

Maybe that's just a reflection of today's society (?)

Maybe I overreacted to what I perceived was a needlessly snarky remark, but I'm one of the easiest guys to get along with. Peace to all. Down with bickering.

[haljackey]

Originally Posted by Gresto

Down with bickering.

Yes to memes

[Gresto]

^Some good stuff, and I appreciate the "starter pack" nomenclature. To correct the second one, roughly 500,000 vehicles per day pass through the 401 at Dixon Rd. (last it was measured, years ago). If each one has 6 passengers, that's equal to the Shinjuku train station. Bottom line, the 401 is a nightmare most of the time, and is only getting worse, it seems.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Gresto

^Some good stuff, and I appreciate the "starter pack" nomenclature. To correct the second one, roughly 500,000 vehicles per day pass through the 401 at Dixon Rd. (last it was measured, years ago). If each one has 6 passengers, that's equal to the Shinjuku train station. Bottom line, the 401 is a nightmare most of the time, and is only getting worse, it seems.

The AADT of Highway 401 is actually highest between Highway 400 and Weston Road, not Dixon, which is on the much less busy stretch between the 409 and 427.

This stretch recorded an average annual daily traffic count of 421,000 in 2021, or 461,000 during the summer months.

https://www.library.mto.gov.on.ca/Sydney...traffic_Volumes_1988-2021.pdf&m=resource

There is technically a part of the 401 which registers summer volumes over 500,000, through the 427 interchange, but I believe MTO is counting traffic on both the 401 and 427 here as they interline for a few hundred metres through the interchange.

These are only point recordings however - many more vehicles drive on the 401 every day across the province of Ontario, likely in the range of several million daily trips. The 401 likely exceeds the peak daily load of the busiest point of the Toronto subway system, for example.

[Gresto]

^Thanks for the correction.

[MolsonExport]

the worst thing on those starter packs are those awful orange and black traffic cones. Lord how I hate those things.

[Gresto]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

the worst thing on those starter packs are those awful orange and black traffic cones. Lord how I hate those things.

Some of them are left behind by departing work crews, and languish in place for so long - months, even years - that they are no longer noticed by regular passersby.

[MolsonExport]

Paleontologists from the far future will assume that those awful orange/black traffic cones were the most abundant large fauna from the late Anthropocene period.

[MolsonExport]

spent a lot of time on the Dan Ryan Expressway (the inspiration for the 401) while visiting Chicago from Thursday to Monday.

You can see the similarities with the dual carriageway setup (express lanes and local lanes), but it feels much older (exits on left side, lack of shoulders in some places, very steep angled exits, etc.).

c. 2008

[Loco101]

I drove that a couple of years ago. It was busy but not like the 401 and as you mentioned not up to the same standard. The Chicago area's population has been declining for awhile whereas the GTA's has been exploding.

[haljackey]

‘Continuous 10-lane corridor’: Preliminary study underway to widen Hwy. 401 through Milton

https://www.insidehalton.com/news/contin...80b484a-0e36-5df1-b68e-3311664949c5.html

[sonysnob]

Two vies looking east along Highway 401 from the Highway 400 interchange:

https://www.asphaltplanet.ca/ON/hwy_401_images/401_cl_359_east_c_Sep25_42x28.jpg


https://www.asphaltplanet.ca/ON/hwy_401_images/401_cl_359_east_EB_Sep25_42x28.jpg

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Loco101

I drove that a couple of years ago. It was busy but not like the 401 and as you mentioned not up to the same standard. The Chicago area's population has been declining for awhile whereas the GTA's has been exploding.

Chicago's south side has been losing population for years so that stretch of the Dan Ryan is relatively underutilized compared to what it was originally designed for.

The north side of Chicago is much faster growing and actually has worse highway infrastructure.. the Kennedy Expressway is a famous parking lot.