LOS ANGELES | Politics, Economics, and Business Development

[LA21st]

How is threatening or extortion legal? Do you have an example of what they do?

[SoCalKid]

Originally Posted by LA21st

How is threatening or extortion legal? Do you have an example of what they do?

It's stuff like - "Agree to these unionization terms for your or we will come after anything you do, whether it's a hotel or not, and trash you in the media". So if you're a hotel developer and you know they have members of city council who will back them, it's tough to fight them.

I've heard stories of them intimidating workers who oppose unionization as well. They oppose secret ballots and only call for open ballots where the union knows who voted against them. But I don't think it's old school mafia threats of violence type intimidation.

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

Originally Posted by SoCalKid

It's stuff like - "Agree to these unionization terms for your or we will come after anything you do, whether it's a hotel or not, and trash you in the media". So if you're a hotel developer and you know they have members of city council who will back them, it's tough to fight them.

I've heard stories of them intimidating workers who oppose unionization as well. They oppose secret ballots and only call for open ballots where the union knows who voted against them. But I don't think it's old school mafia threats of violence type intimidation.

Yup, this is exactly how they do it and have delayed, killed or extorted from many developers and projects. Outrageous and its only going to get worse since their plant Hugo Soto Martinez is in city council.

[SoCalKid]

Oceanwide Plaza update from a court filing a few days ago:

"Continuing Interest and Active Negotiations: At the May 6, 2025 status conference, Debtor's counsel reported continuing interest and substantial progress in selling the Property. Since that time, Debtor and its professionals have maintained intensive engagement with multiple interested parties, with particularly focused negotiations ongoing with at least one serious interested party.

Imminent Formal Offer: Through these sustained efforts, Debtor has been advised that a formal offer is expected to be forthcoming in the next few weeks. While Debtor remains unable to disclose specific terms at this time due to the sensitive nature of ongoing negotiations and confidentiality requirements, the level of engagement and specificity of discussions indicates genuine and serious interest from qualified parties.

Anticipated Information Sharing: Debtor is hopeful and expects to have more concrete information to share with the Court and stakeholders by the status conference scheduled for August 19, 2025."

Let's all pray that this is a serious, well capitalized buyer with a real plan to finish the project. I think we can all agree getting this thing finished would have a huge positive effect on South Park.

[scania]

Ahhh. Definitely intriguing.

[craigs]

Originally Posted by SoCalKid

Oceanwide Plaza update from a court filing a few days ago:

"Continuing Interest and Active Negotiations: At the May 6, 2025 status conference, Debtor's counsel reported continuing interest and substantial progress in selling the Property. Since that time, Debtor and its professionals have maintained intensive engagement with multiple interested parties, with particularly focused negotiations ongoing with at least one serious interested party.

Imminent Formal Offer: Through these sustained efforts, Debtor has been advised that a formal offer is expected to be forthcoming in the next few weeks. While Debtor remains unable to disclose specific terms at this time due to the sensitive nature of ongoing negotiations and confidentiality requirements, the level of engagement and specificity of discussions indicates genuine and serious interest from qualified parties.

Anticipated Information Sharing: Debtor is hopeful and expects to have more concrete information to share with the Court and stakeholders by the status conference scheduled for August 19, 2025."

Let's all pray that this is a serious, well capitalized buyer with a real plan to finish the project. I think we can all agree getting this thing finished would have a huge positive effect on South Park.

Oh, that is interesting. Do you have the case number? I can "accidentally" look it up on Monday. Oops!

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by SoCalKid

Oceanwide Plaza update from a court filing a few days ago:

"Continuing Interest and Active Negotiations: At the May 6, 2025 status conference, Debtor's counsel reported continuing interest and substantial progress in selling the Property. Since that time, Debtor and its professionals have maintained intensive engagement with multiple interested parties, with particularly focused negotiations ongoing with at least one serious interested party.

Imminent Formal Offer: Through these sustained efforts, Debtor has been advised that a formal offer is expected to be forthcoming in the next few weeks. While Debtor remains unable to disclose specific terms at this time due to the sensitive nature of ongoing negotiations and confidentiality requirements, the level of engagement and specificity of discussions indicates genuine and serious interest from qualified parties.

Anticipated Information Sharing: Debtor is hopeful and expects to have more concrete information to share with the Court and stakeholders by the status conference scheduled for August 19, 2025."

Let's all pray that this is a serious, well capitalized buyer with a real plan to finish the project. I think we can all agree getting this thing finished would have a huge positive effect on South Park.

I dont want to jinx it or say I know anything for sure, but a big wig at my company (big player in commercial real estate) seemed confident Oceanwide was gonna be turned around. He didnt say when but he was kicking himself for our company not being involved. Likely because its a great comeback story/press coverage and he wanted to be apart of it.

This was back in March or Apirl I think. My guess was he was hearing rumors/talk. It didnt feel like "if" it felt like "when" as he discussed it. He roots for downtown LA and sees its potential even with the last few years. He doesnt need downtown to do well, but he sees potential for sure.

Oceanwide would be a signal LA is coming back. Paramount is also moving its HQ out of NYC to LA with the Skydance Merger. I believe Paramount Studios will be the new HQ (great for that area) and the SM office will just be the secondary office. And theres several other good signs LA/Hollywood in the last 2 weeks.

[scania]

Originally Posted by LA21st

I dont want to jinx it or say I know anything for sure, but a big wig at my company (big player in commercial real estate) seemed confident Oceanwide was gonna be turned around. He didnt say when but he was kicking himself for our company not being involved. Likely because its a great comeback story/press coverage and he wanted to be apart of it.

This was back in March or Apirl I think. My guess was he was hearing rumors/talk. It didnt feel like "if" it felt like "when" as he discussed it. He roots for downtown LA and sees its potential even with the last few years. He doesnt need downtown to do well, but he sees potential for sure.

Oceanwide would be a signal LA is coming back. Paramount is also moving its HQ out of NYC to LA with the Skydance Merger. I believe Paramount Studios will be the new HQ (great for that area) and the SM office will just be the secondary office. And theres several other good signs LA/Hollywood in the last 2 weeks.

Interesting…when you say Hollywood…are specifically talking about the film industry?

[Illithid Dude]

I would love for Oceanwide to be completed. Fingers crossed for good news.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by scania

Interesting…when you say Hollywood…are specifically talking about the film industry?

Yes

[scania]

Originally Posted by LA21st

Yes

Hmph…intriguing again!!!

[SoCalKid]

I think there is some optimism in Hollywood after the increased tax credits passed. That industry has also been dealing with serious permitting/regulatory issues in LA that mirror what we see in housing/development. There have been some gestures from local leaders indicating that they'd like to help lighten the regulatory burden, but we'll see if anything meaningful comes out of that. It certainly hasn't (on the local level) for housing/development.

[LA21st]

What is the reason for the regulations? I dont understand the benefit.

[SoCalKid]

Originally Posted by craigs

Oh, that is interesting. Do you have the case number? I can "accidentally" look it up on Monday. Oops!

Case Number: 24-11057 (DS)

I've just been looking up the court docket on Stretto:

https://cases.stretto.com/oceanwideplaza/court-docket/

[SoCalKid]

Originally Posted by LA21st

What is the reason for the regulations? I dont understand the benefit.

LA's government is obsessed with process, regulation, and multiple layers of approvals. Read the book "Abundance", LA is a shining example of every issue they talk about. No one in the government ever stops to think "does this process make sense" or "do we need these rules"? It's just a never ending parade of new ones on top of the old ones trying to fix the system, but instead just layering new byzantine systems on top of the old ones. If you don't believe me, look up the new zoning code, which is universally being declared a complicated mess by everyone in the real estate industry.

[SoCalKid]

Originally Posted by LA21st

I dont want to jinx it or say I know anything for sure, but a big wig at my company (big player in commercial real estate) seemed confident Oceanwide was gonna be turned around. He didnt say when but he was kicking himself for our company not being involved. Likely because its a great comeback story/press coverage and he wanted to be apart of it.

This was back in March or Apirl I think. My guess was he was hearing rumors/talk. It didnt feel like "if" it felt like "when" as he discussed it. He roots for downtown LA and sees its potential even with the last few years. He doesnt need downtown to do well, but he sees potential for sure.

Interesting. I'd be curious what company, but I won't ask because I think the whole point of this forum is to maintain anonymity. I'd say that view you describe is outside of the industry consensus - most large real estate companies considered Oceanwide a losing opportunity when it came to market, which is why it still hasn't sold. There was an article where the head of Related California (Bill Witte - very smart dude and a straight shooter) said the same in case anyone thinks I'm just being a downer. But I want nothing more than for a buyer to come through and prove the industry wrong with a great project that makes huge returns.

[LA21st]

Originally Posted by SoCalKid

Interesting. I'd be curious what company, but I won't ask because I think the whole point of this forum is to maintain anonymity. I'd say that view you describe is outside of the industry consensus - most large real estate companies considered Oceanwide a losing opportunity when it came to market, which is why it still hasn't sold. There was an article where the head of Related California (Bill Witte - very smart dude and a straight shooter) said the same in case anyone thinks I'm just being a downer. But I want nothing more than for a buyer to come through and prove the industry wrong with a great project that makes huge returns.

I wont say the company but Ill just say he knows all the big players and talks with them often on other deals. The big banks/investment firms.
This isnt a small operation.

But I think he was just referencing "talks" nothing concrete or anything. Which I think that one article confirmed. He just knew beforehand.

[SoCalKid]

Originally Posted by LA21st

I wont say the company but Ill just say he knows all the big players and talks with them often on other deals. The big banks/investment firms.
This isnt a small operation.

But I think he was just referencing "talks" nothing concrete or anything. Which I think that one article confirmed. He just knew beforehand.

Oh I see what you mean - he was confident because he knew a buyer was chasing it, not because he thought the economics were a slam dunk. That makes a lot more sense.

[LA21st]

Yea, he didnt mention the numbers or anything. Just thinks at some point it will get turned around. How exactly and to what cost, who knows lol.

[Illithid Dude]

I work in the film industry and am intimately acquainted with the intricacies of filming in Los Angeles. The new tax credits are helpful and definitely a step in the right direction, but are only one part of the problem. The bigger issue is how cumbersome it is to navigate Film LA, the "non profit" organization that controls filming in Los Angeles. The contract with Film LA was due to run out and the industry was pushing to only renew it for six months so their terms could be negotiated but City Council, in all their infinite wisdom, decided to renew their contract for a full five year term, which most likely means that nothing will change until that term is up.