The Metro Vancouver Retail Thread

[NewfBC]

The Nordstrom space - 230k sq ft.

Downtown Toronto IKEA Urban format store - 66k sq ft.

Eately Toronto Manulife Centre - 50k sq ft.

Simons Park Royal - 100k sq ft.

Lots of room in the Nordstrom space for these.. and more.


Across the street...
HBC Retail space - 637k sq ft.

Ron.

[Phrescata]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

I imagine Cadillac Fairview buying the downtown building and then developing it as part of Pacific Centre.

I agree, and if CF does buy it and expand Pacific Centre I hope they reopen the direct access to Granville station. I assume they would.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by Phrescata

I agree, and if CF does buy it and expand Pacific Centre I hope they reopen the direct access to Granville station. I assume they would.

They sold half their Vancouver portfolio in 2017. They seem to be trying to diversify internationally with their portfolio.

https://vancouversun.com/news/local-news...stake-in-vancouver-real-estate-portfolio

[jollyburger]

Report from the Monitor. Nothing else really new.

In the evening of March 14, 2025, shortly before the Applicants’ materials were served, RioCan’s counsel emailed the Company’s counsel and the Monitor’s counsel with a proposed DIP term sheet contemplating DIP funding to be provided by RioCan (the
“RioCan DIP”). RioCan’s counsel indicated that the DIP term sheet was provided on a
confidential basis, therefore the Monitor does not discuss its terms herein. But the Monitor can advise that it is presently of the view that the RioCan DIP is unworkable on its terms, and that the DIP Credit Facility offered by the DIP Lenders remains the only workable arrangement for the Company

The Monitor supports the extension of the RioCan-HBC JV Stay. In particular, the Monitor is of the view that on a balancing of the relative prejudice to the parties involved, the RioCan-HBC JV Stay is appropriate in the circumstances. If the RioCan-HBC JV Stay is not granted, the Applicants will be in default of the terms of their only workable DIP

https://www.alvarezandmarsal.com/sites/d...0-%20HBC%20et%20al%20-%2016-MAR-2025.pdf

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by dreambrother808

I imagine Cadillac Fairview buying the downtown building and then developing it as part of Pacific Centre.

There is precedent for that. Cadillac Fairview bought the former Queen St. Simpsons building housing Hudson's Bay in Toronto and tout it as part of Toronto Eaton Centre.

*****

Remember that Hudson's Bay was trying to lease the 2 basement levels to third party retailers in about 2012, but there were no takers. I think a wholesale redevelopment is the only thing that will bring retailers (as opposed to office) into the Hudson's Bay store, as some levels have low ceilings.
Remember that the existing escalators in the basement levels are a mess - they do not line up with each other, making wayfinding difficult.

Here's what they tried to shop around in 2012:

[jollyburger]

I know they bought a bunch of other department stores but it's crazy how much they monetized their real estate holdings and still managed to dump HBC with that much debt.

So they sold Zellers leases to Target for close to 2 billion dollars (2011). The Toronto store/office space went to Cadillac Fairview for 650 million dollars (2014). Another $480 million (2023). $151.5 million from QuadReal for the Oakridge Park redevelopment.

[officedweller]

When the latest reorganization separated HBC into a separate entity, the writing was on the wall that they were going to dump it.
With the recent erosion of goodwill (poor maintenance, store closures/shutdowns), no one will buy it as a going concern, as it would be an uphill battle to attract customers.

[NewfBC]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

I know they bought a bunch of other department stores but it's crazy how much they monetized their real estate holdings and still managed to dump HBC with that much debt.

So they sold Zellers leases to Target for close to 2 billion dollars (2011). The Toronto store/office space went to Cadillac Fairview for 650 million dollars (2014). Another $480 million (2023). $151.5 million from QuadReal for the Oakridge Park redevelopment.

I believe they also took out a $200 million mortgage on downtown Vancouver.

Ron.

[jollyburger]

Not consulting your secured creditors is always a good plan of action. Well played HBC.

The HBC lease only accounts for 1.5% of the Georgian Mall mall which has 100 tenants. 600K sq feet mall total/90K sq feet occupied by HBC

Desjardins has not consented to this property being included in the Lease
Monetization Process or SISP. Desjardins was only notified that its collateral was proposed to be included in the Lease Monetization Process and the SISP when the Applicants delivered their motion record for the comeback hearing, after the close of business on March 14, 2025. The Applicants clearly shared the Lease Monetization Process and SISP with their other lenders in advance, but did not share them with Desjardins despite it being a first-ranking secured creditor of property that they are proposing be subject to those processes. Desjardins instead was only provided with less than one business day’s notice. Desjardins strongly objects to any sale taking place without its consent.

https://www.alvarezandmarsal.com/sites/d...Mortgage%20Lenders%20-%2016-MAR-2025.pdf

The judge will decide on the motions later this week

Justice Peter J. Osborne, presiding over Monday’s hearing, expressed concerns that selling off assets too quickly could eliminate any chance of saving part of the business.

Hudson’s Bay had been in talks with landlords to keep roughly 40 stores open. However, those discussions fell apart late last week. The retailer had proposed that landlords temporarily waive rent payments and potentially invest in keeping select locations operational. Without such agreements, full liquidation is the only path forward.

Retail analyst Carl Boutet weighed in on the situation, citing financial documents submitted to the court. “Their monitor anticipates $465 million in revenue from liquidation, which after operating costs would generate around $158 million in net cash flow,” Boutet said. “But with $258 million in senior debt, a significant portion of unsecured debt—including payments owed to suppliers—will not be recovered.”

Boutet also noted disparities in financial priorities, adding, “Executives have requested to double their liability insurance to $50 million, while the key employees responsible for managing this crisis will receive only $3 million in compensation.”

For now, the focus is on whether the court will approve the company’s request to move forward with liquidation sales. An outcome is expected later this week. Meanwhile, questions linger over the role of Hudson’s Bay’s leadership, including the company’s governor, Richard Baker.

“Where is Governor Baker in all of this?” Boutet asked. “He’s been awfully quiet.”

https://retail-insider.com/retail-inside...liquidation-as-court-hears-future-plans/

[Capitol Hill]

What would be a positive outcome for this whole endeavor? It doesn’t sound like keeping 40 stores open would be viable, it’s not like they have anything revolutionary for retailing up their sleeves. Liquidation screws unsecured creditors. What a freaking mess, I wish the courts could claw back moneys from previous sales.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by connect2source

With the imminent demise of HBC and the very likely closure of the landmark downtown Vancouver location, perhaps players like Simons would be incentivized to perhaps look at the former Nordstrom / Eatons space again given that they would face far less competition without Hudson's Bay close-by. I still think downtown Vancouver and Pacific Centre specifically would be a far better fit for Simons over potentially Oakridge. Regardless, I hope something is in the works for that giant space as having two massive empty former dept. store spaces wont likely bode well for downtown retail.

Yes, people underestimate the impact of this but particularly The Bay as the Eatons/Nordstrom space had always presented a sterile face to the street.

Somebody should be applying pressure to get the VAG to move into one of those spaces. Maybe RioCan would go for a land swap with Larwill Park?

[Vin]

Originally Posted by s211

Walmart!

Good idea since Vancouver only has one other store. It can easily take up two floors. Another one could be Toys R Us since they are closing the Lansdowne store (also closed the Metrotown one although relocated to Station Square).

One good way to utilize the Bay building quickly is to put in the Vancouver Art Gallery. At the new location, they can build a mall instead.


Americans killed Hudson Bay.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Yes, people underestimate the impact of this but particularly The Bay as the Eatons/Nordstrom space had always presented a sterile face to the street.

Somebody should be applying pressure to get the VAG to move into one of those spaces. Maybe RioCan would go for a land swap with Larwill Park?

What makes The Bay building a good candidate for an art gallery? It would probably cost more to convert than building new, and according to the mortgage it's worth $200m+. And why would RioCan want to acquire a parking lot and a hole in the ground on an off centre site Downtown? They're not going to build a new mall. (Despite Vin saying they will).

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Changing City

What makes The Bay building a good candidate for an art gallery? It would probably cost more to convert than building new, and according to the mortgage it's worth $200m+. And why would RioCan want to acquire a parking lot and an off centre site Downtown? They're not going to build a new mall.

The same reason The Post would have been a good candidate. Big open floorplates. Add to that a better location for transit.

As to what RioCan could do with Larwill, how about office or hotel? RioCan does residential, is not zones for it they could ask for a dispensation on that site to facilitate a VAG move.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by whatnext

The same reason The Post would have been a good candidate. Big open floorplates. Add to that a better location for transit.

As to what RioCan could do with Larwill, how about office or hotel? RioCan does residential, is not zones for it they could ask for a dispensation on that site to facilitate a VAG move.

The Bay building is full of columns. If RioCan wanted a new retail building, it would be way cheaper and easier to re-vitalise that building rather than building from scratch, and a better location for them too. They could even convert some of the upper floors to hotel or residential (or office, but not in the current market). It would be expensive to get it to meet seismic code, but not impossible. It wouldn't have any parking, but that's not a huge issue (and I think there's a covenent on the Bay Parkade for now).

[NewfBC]

Originally Posted by Vin

Good idea since Vancouver only has one other store. It can easily take up two floors. Another one could be Toys R Us since they are closing the Lansdowne store (also closed the Metrotown one although relocated to Station Square).

One good way to utilize the Bay building quickly is to put in the Vancouver Art Gallery. At the new location, they can build a mall instead.


Americans killed Hudson Bay.

The Toys R Us on Broadway is closing as well.

Ron.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by NewfBC

The Toys R Us on Broadway is closing as well.

Ron.

I saw that, and my first reaction was that I'd thought Toys R Us had closed years ago.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

I saw that, and my first reaction was that I'd thought Toys R Us had closed years ago.

The US chain went bankrupt and closed down in 2018. Fairfax Financial of Toronto bought for $300m and ran the Canadian stores until 2021, when they sold them to Sam Putnam. He's the Canadian owner of Sunrise Records (and HMV Canada that he picked up when they went bankrupt in 2017). He also bought Bed Bath & Beyond, and turned them into Rooms + Spaces, and took the David's Tea stores and turned them into T Kettle. Almost all of those have subsequently closed. He's just bought Ricki's and Cleo clothing stores (in receivership).

[hollywoodnorth]

the IKEA expansion in Richmond is underway. Excavation and site prep has been ongoing for a couple months now.

[SpongeG]

I wonder what they can do with all the bay stores now. There is no real store to take over an entire space, Guildford could be broken up into more mall space perhaps. Bring in Zara, Decathalon, even a winners/homesense would be good for the area. The old Sears space never got properly used though.