Statistics Canada Reports II

[P'tit Renard]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Sure, but Toronto is fairly represented when we look at the country as a whole. We all must bow down to the centre of the universe, but us outer rim planets are doing ok.

Ironic that the so called centre of the universe is forced to shoulder the lion's share of the pain from Trudeau's asinine immigration ponzi scheme, with no net benefits to speak of for the GTA.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by someone123

The theory that immigrants always generate surplus jobs and drive unemployment toward 0% hasn't aged very well. Of course it's obvious that there has to be some economic opportunity and the type of immigrants and their ability to work matters. If there's no opportunity, or the immigrants are unskilled, or they're somehow prevented from working (say by some board governing accreditation in their industry) then you don't necessarily get a net economic benefit.

If you have so-so or worse economic growth and add in chain migration with older relatives coming and so on it must turn strongly negative in a country with public healthcare. Importing an Uber driver and two sick parents for example is not going to help the government's bottom line. On the other hand, importing a solo young doctor who will work for 30 years could be a huge positive.

The verdict is still out overall and for sure there are winners and losers but absolutely the non spousal family reunification is a huge drain.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by phone

Well, Sask is tied with QC for lowest unemployment right now, so

I think part of what's going on is that there's an ideal rate for each given location and the economies are regional. In 2010's Canada, some parts of the country didn't get enough immigrants. Saskatchewan might have been in that bucket while Toronto seems to have gotten a higher rate than the local economy and housing market can comfortably absorb.

It's worth noting that sometimes even in underperforming or declining areas the ideal immigrant rate isn't 0 because immigrants can have different skill sets from the local population and can sometimes take advantage of economic opportunities that nobody would otherwise.

[phone]

Originally Posted by Wigs

Saskatoon is still growing fairly quick, no?
Didn't the city reach 300k with the metro soon to be approaching 400k?

Yeah, its still up there as one of the "fastest growing cities in Canada". We have strong international immigration, intra-provincial migration, and natural growth. But there is no doubt that we lose people to other provinces on a net basis.

IIRC the CMA is somewhere around 360,000 now. When I was a kid in the 90s and 00s, it felt like it was forever stuck at 200,000. It definitely feels significantly bigger than it did in those days. Large new neighbourhoods that have been integrated into the pop geography of the city. Expressways upgraded to freeways. Exurbs growing at a faster rate than the city proper.

I don't think anyone else makes any illusions that we are going to be the next Calgary or anything, but it wouldn't surprise me if we close in on 500k within the next 5-10 years. We are lucky to have a diversified economy. Oil and gas plays a much smaller role in that diversified economy than most people probably think. Not a lot of oil around Saskatoon - that's in other parts of the province.

[P'tit Renard]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

The verdict is still out overall and for sure there are winners and losers but absolutely the non spousal family reunification is a huge drain.

Will Toronto ever realize a win or net benefit from Trudeau's immigration ponzi scheme, especially if Toronto's outsized manufacturing sector gets pummelled by Trumpian tariffs?



Toronto's in no position to absorb another hundred thousand plus in layoffs, given all the excess labour that's already floating around and begging for work.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by someone123

The theory that immigrants always generate surplus jobs and drive unemployment toward 0% hasn't aged very well. Of course it's obvious that there has to be some economic opportunity and the type of immigrants and their ability to work matters. If there's no opportunity, or the immigrants are unskilled, or they're somehow prevented from working (say by some board governing accreditation in their industry) then you don't necessarily get a net economic benefit.

If you have so-so or worse economic growth and add in chain migration with older relatives coming and so on it must turn strongly negative in a country with public healthcare. Importing an Uber driver and two sick parents for example is not going to help the government's bottom line. On the other hand, importing a solo young doctor who will work for 30 years could be a huge positive.

On immigration, Canada really did convince itself that it was The Kid Who Couldn't Miss.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by P'tit Renard

Will Toronto ever realize a win or net benefit from Trudeau's immigration ponzi scheme, especially if Toronto's outsized manufacturing sector gets pummelled by Trumpian tariffs?



Toronto's in no position to absorb another hundred thousand plus in layoffs, given all the excess labour that's already floating around and begging for work.

Well 40 years of immigration has made Toronto what it is. Montreal hasn't had that so it is less dynamic. Of course housing is also a lot less affordable.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by Acajack

On immigration, Canada really did convince itself that it was The Kid Who Couldn't Miss.

Immigration does propel an economy due to the inevitable uptick in consumer demand. What no economy can withstand is a flood of humanity arriving all at once. In the coming years, there will definitely be long term benefits for Canada from the population surge but right now we have to navigate a plethora of problems exacerbated by 'too much, too soon'.

[kora]

Originally Posted by isaidso

What no economy can withstand is a flood of humanity arriving all at once. In the coming years, there will definitely be long term benefits for Canada from the population surge but right now we have to navigate a plethora of problems exacerbated by 'too much, too soon'.

A baby boom is also a population surge all at once. Population growth is population growth, regardless of where it comes from, and history has shown a boom in population alone does not always cause more problems than benefits.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by kora

A baby boom is also a population surge all at once. Population growth is population growth, regardless of where it comes from, and history has shown a boom in population alone does not always cause more problems than benefits.

Quite right.

[Spocket]

Originally Posted by kora

A baby boom is also a population surge all at once. Population growth is population growth, regardless of where it comes from, and history has shown a boom in population alone does not always cause more problems than benefits.

Sure but the differences are that babies are supported by parents and have 18 years, approximately, for the market to prepare to employ them.

Eventually all of these immigrants will find employment but at the wages being paid today, were I a prospective immigrant, Canada would be struck off the list. If we're not admitting targeted immigrants mainly, we're simply importing a slave class. That's what we've got right now. That's not fair to them or Canadians born here.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by kora

A baby boom is also a population surge all at once. Population growth is population growth, regardless of where it comes from, and history has shown a boom in population alone does not always cause more problems than benefits.

Wow this is a crazy post-nation viewpoint.

[Chocolite]

Originally Posted by phone

Yeah, its still up there as one of the "fastest growing cities in Canada". We have strong international immigration, intra-provincial migration, and natural growth. But there is no doubt that we lose people to other provinces on a net basis.

IIRC the CMA is somewhere around 360,000 now. When I was a kid in the 90s and 00s, it felt like it was forever stuck at 200,000. It definitely feels significantly bigger than it did in those days. Large new neighbourhoods that have been integrated into the pop geography of the city. Expressways upgraded to freeways. Exurbs growing at a faster rate than the city proper.

I don't think anyone else makes any illusions that we are going to be the next Calgary or anything, but it wouldn't surprise me if we close in on 500k within the next 5-10 years. We are lucky to have a diversified economy. Oil and gas plays a much smaller role in that diversified economy than most people probably think. Not a lot of oil around Saskatoon - that's in other parts of the province.

Saskatoon has been flying under everyone’s radar for the past decade or so. Very impressive growth for city that doesn’t get mentioned very often. I have to make it out that way someday to check it out.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Chocolite

Saskatoon has been flying under everyone’s radar for the past decade or so. Very impressive growth for city that doesn’t get mentioned very often. I have to make it out that way someday to check it out.

I've only been to Saskatoon once but appreciate its charm and would like to go back someday.

Saskatoon City/CMA population estimates
2004: 206,086/238,334
2014: 247,268/294,067
2024: 308,626/367,336

The city is well over 300,000 and the Metro is rapidly heading towards 400,000

Source:
Census Metropolitan Areas https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/...024&referencePeriods=20040101%2C20240101

Census subdivision boundaries (municipalities)
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/...024&referencePeriods=20040101%2C20240101

[kora]

Originally Posted by Spocket

Sure but the differences are that babies are supported by parents and have 18 years, approximately, for the market to prepare to employ them.

Eventually all of these immigrants will find employment but at the wages being paid today, were I a prospective immigrant, Canada would be struck off the list. If we're not admitting targeted immigrants mainly, we're simply importing a slave class. That's what we've got right now. That's not fair to them or Canadians born here.

The immigrants we accept are mostly young people who have also been supported by their parents in their origin countries. We don't have to pay for their primary or secondary education in many cases, since they often come with university degrees paid for by foreign countries. Further, many immigrants go on to get a Canadian diploma or degree to further their chances of local employment and integrate themselves better to the economy.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by kora

The immigrants we accept are mostly young people who have also been supported by their parents in their origin countries. We don't have to pay for their primary or secondary education in many cases, since they often come with university degrees paid for by foreign countries. Further, many immigrants go on to get a Canadian diploma or degree to further their chances of local employment and integrate themselves better to the economy.

2015 is calling and want's it's immigration policy back. This is no longer true. A very poor primary education is of little to the Canadian economy.

[isaidso]

Originally Posted by kora

the immigrants we accept are mostly young people who have also been supported by their parents in their origin countries. We don't have to pay for their primary or secondary education in many cases, since they often come with university degrees paid for by foreign countries. Further, many immigrants go on to get a canadian diploma or degree to further their chances of local employment and integrate themselves better to the economy.

+1

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by Chocolite

Saskatoon has been flying under everyone’s radar for the past decade or so. Very impressive growth for city that doesn’t get mentioned very often. I have to make it out that way someday to check it out.

When I was in the Toon back in Dec I had a chance to drive around and can say it is growing quite fast. Biggest growth I saw was east and south.

[Chocolite]

Amazing to think it’s almost 400,000, I still think of Saskatoon’s a city of an around 200K. One of these days I’ll make it out there.
Probably gets overshadowed because of the growth of Calgary and Edmonton. I was out visiting Calgary and Edmonton last summer and lots of changes, especially Calgary. I couldn’t believe how much Calgary had changed since my last visit around 2009ish.

Originally Posted by Wigs

I've only been to Saskatoon once but appreciate its charm and would like to go back someday.

Saskatoon City/CMA population estimates
2004: 206,086/238,334
2014: 247,268/294,067
2024: 308,626/367,336

The city is well over 300,000 and the Metro is rapidly heading towards 400,000

Source:
Census Metropolitan Areas https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/...024&referencePeriods=20040101%2C20240101

Census subdivision boundaries (municipalities)
https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1/en/...024&referencePeriods=20040101%2C20240101

[rdaner]

I wonder if the growth of Calgary and Edmonton will begin to affect the politics of Alberta? Is the proportion of Albertans living in these two CMAs increasing relative to the province as a whole?