Quebec, the French Language, and Quebecois Identity - Page 634

New Brisavoine · #**12661** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 5:28 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Generally speaking in my observations US corporations are totally compliant with Bill 101.

Same in France. US companies are more respectful of French than French companies (who abuse and overuse all sorts of stupid English or pretending-to-be English names). Now it's contaminated Francophone Africa and you see lots of English names in Francophone Africa, because businesses there copy the practices of French companies, and it's the American companies who are actually using French more.

New Brisavoine · #**12662** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 5:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by le calmar

Well yes, the order would come from above. But I imagine the said order would stipulate that the French troops should abstain from retaliating since the stakes are too high, if it ever came to that. But okay, if your point is that the French troops would fight back if they were given the order in spite of all it implies, I suppose they would.

The last time French troops opened fire on US troops was in 1942.

Tvisforme · #**12663** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 6:17 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToxiK

...Google (not technically a media, but still a distributor of information) caves to Trump:

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/google-maps-rename-gulf-mexico-gulf-america-us-users-2025-01-27/...

Sorry, but this particular change is not Google "caving to Trump"; it aligns with their existing policy and will be implemented primarily for US users. International users will see the name per the same policy; for example, Canadians will see "Gulf of Mexico (Gulf of America)". Note that I do not agree with the US renaming the Gulf, as it is just petty political posturing by Mr Trump. However, once it is legally renamed, I would argue that we should expect Google and other providers to reflect this change, with the caveat that there's still easily accessible information reflecting the naming history. Otherwise, we'd still see "Queen Charlotte Islands" instead of "Haida Gwaii".

YOWetal · #**12664** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 8:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

Sorry, but this particular change is not Google "caving to Trump"; it aligns with their existing policy and will be implemented primarily for US users. International users will see the name per the same policy; for example, Canadians will see "Gulf of Mexico (Gulf of America)". Note that I do not agree with the US renaming the Gulf, as it is just petty political posturing by Mr Trump. However, once it is legally renamed, I would argue that we should expect Google and other providers to reflect this change, with the caveat that there's still easily accessible information reflecting the naming history. Otherwise, we'd still see "Queen Charlotte Islands" instead of "Haida Gwaii".

It's a bit different than Haida Gwaii in that it's a shared waterway. The United States can't unilaterally change it's international name in English. Lots of seas have different names to different people. Does French Canada all the English Channel La Manche?

Acajack · #**12665** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 8:57 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOWetal

It's a bit different than Haida Gwaii in that it's a shared waterway. The United States can't unilaterally change it's international name in English. Lots of seas have different names to different people. Does French Canada all the English Channel La Manche?

Yes, we call it La Manche.

A lot of countries refer to the Persian Gulf as the Arabian Gulf.

In French, the most common name used for the Temple Mount in Jerusalem is L'Esplanade des Mosquées, though you may also hear "Le Mont du Temple".

Which name you choose for this may indicate your political leanings in The Eternal Conflict.

Acajack · #**12666** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 9:00 PM**

Though it is totally possible for geographical features to have different names in the countries bordering them.

What the Americans call the Rio Grande is called the Rio Bravo del Norte by Mexicans.

And most Greeks still refer to Istanbul as Constantinople, believe it or not.

MolsonExport · #**12667** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 9:10 PM**

The first time Trump mentioned the idea of changing the name of the Gulf of Mexico, Sheinbaum responded sarcastically, suggesting instead renaming North America as “América Mexicana” or “Mexican America,” because a founding document dating from 1814 that preceded Mexico’s constitution referred to it that way.

“That sounds nice, no?” she added with a sarcastic tone.

She also noted that the Gulf of Mexico had been named that since 1607.

Acajack · #**12668** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 9:28 PM**

Note that I just checked both the French and English versions of Google Maps and what I see on my screen is Gulf of Mexico and Golfe du Mexique. Only.

Tvisforme · #**12669** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 9:53 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOWetal

...The United States can't unilaterally change it's international name in English...

The US change affects the US legal name, and Google's changes would be for American users.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

...And most Greeks still refer to Istanbul as Constantinople, believe it or not.

People just liked it better that way

New Brisavoine · #**12670** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 10:13 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

In French, the most common name used for the Temple Mount in Jerusalem is L'Esplanade des Mosquées, though you may also hear "Le Mont du Temple".

The Esplanade des Mosquées is located on top of the Mont du Temple. Two different things, not two names for the same thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

And most Greeks still refer to Istanbul as Constantinople, believe it or not.

The Turks referred to Istanbul as "Constantinople" until the early 20th century.

See this bond issued by the City of Constantinople in 1913 (it's in gold francs because France was the main creditor of the Ottoman Empire):

New Brisavoine · #**12671** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 10:18 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Note that I just checked both the French and English versions of Google Maps and what I see on my screen is Gulf of Mexico and Golfe du Mexique. Only.

This will apply only within the US. If you use a Canadian IP you won't see "Gulf of America".

kwoldtimer · #**12672** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 11:08 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by YOWetal

It's a bit different than Haida Gwaii in that it's a shared waterway. The United States can't unilaterally change it's international name in English. Lots of seas have different names to different people. Does French Canada all the English Channel La Manche?

It's not changing the name "in English", it's changing the name in the USA. It will remain the Gulf of Mexico in the rest of the Anglosphere.

kwoldtimer · #**12673** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 11:10 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

Though it is totally possible for geographical features to have different names in the countries bordering them.

What the Americans call the Rio Grande is called the Rio Bravo del Norte by Mexicans.

And most Greeks still refer to Istanbul as Constantinople, believe it or not.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wcze7EGorOk

kwoldtimer · #**12674** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 11:11 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

The US change affects the US legal name, and Google's changes would be for American users.

People just liked it better that way

I see what you did there.

New Brisavoine · #**12675** Posted **Jan 29, 2025, 11:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

It's not changing the name "in English", it's changing the name in the USA. It will remain the Gulf of Mexico in the rest of the Anglosphere.

Except in Liberia of course.

ToxiK · #**12676** Posted **Jan 30, 2025, 7:42 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

Sorry, but this particular change is not Google "caving to Trump"; it aligns with their existing policy and will be implemented primarily for US users. International users will see the name per the same policy; for example, Canadians will see "Gulf of Mexico (Gulf of America)". Note that I do not agree with the US renaming the Gulf, as it is just petty political posturing by Mr Trump. However, once it is legally renamed, I would argue that we should expect Google and other providers to reflect this change, with the caveat that there's still easily accessible information reflecting the naming history. Otherwise, we'd still see "Queen Charlotte Islands" instead of "Haida Gwaii".

So Canada should just rename the United States "South Saskatchewan" and Google will change the name on Google Maps?

Tvisforme · #**12677** Posted **Jan 30, 2025, 8:06 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ToxiK

So Canada should just rename the United States "South Saskatchewan" and Google will change the name on Google Maps?

Well, if Canada has an official body that oversees Canadian names for other countries, and if that body makes such a change, and if that change aligns with Google's established and published-before-Trump policy on place names, then perhaps Maps would evolve in that way.

And while your question was deliberately silly - by design, no doubt - at least there'd finally be NHL teams in Saskatchewan.

ToxiK · #**12678** Posted **Jan 30, 2025, 1:00 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

And while your question was deliberately silly - by design, no doubt - at least there'd finally be NHL teams in Saskatchewan.

And a Stanley Cup won by Canada...

MolsonExport · #**12679** Posted **Jan 30, 2025, 3:20 PM**

South Saskatchewan. I like that. I am going to start using that.

Acajack · #**12680** Posted **Jan 30, 2025, 3:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

South Saskatchewan. I like that. I am going to start using that.

The idea actually comes from this SRC political satire program that was broadcast on New Year's Eve. It's the lead in to Le Bye Bye that rings in the New Year at midnight.

https://ici.radio-canada.ca/tele/infoman...donald-trump-trudeau-province-canadienne