Winnipeg | Perimeter Highway

[bomberjet]

Ya that's right, PRS. They had some kind of loop concept on the property. That may have interfered with the plan for the PTH 6 connection into CCW/Inskter/CPT interchange. Is that still the plan if anyone knows? Haven't seen anything recent on it.

[Wpgstvsouth94]

An article was released today about the Costco in headingley being well underway! which makes me wonder that the interchange at portage Avenue and the perimeter will have to undergo some modifications as a part of the ultimate plan with the increased traffic that is going to occur here. The weaving here is so dangerous just like the pembina hwy and fermor and the perimeter it’s so bad. The province should go to Costco and split the price with them for these much needed modifications.

[bodaggin]

Prairie Dog Central is an 8 car train that runs twice a week, for only 5 months, and is struggling to stay afloat at that. They're the only ones that use that rail line.

We're not spending $150 million on a 6-lane overpass for them.

That's lighting money on fire. Either PDS moves outside Lawsons and the crossing is deleted. Or the existing at grade is kept as is and we deal with four, 1-minute inconveniences per week. Until they inevitably go bust.

[Mr Tall Forehead]

Originally Posted by Wpgstvsouth94

An article was released today about the Costco in headingley being well underway! which makes me wonder that the interchange at portage Avenue and the perimeter will have to undergo some modifications as a part of the ultimate plan with the increased traffic that is going to occur here. The weaving here is so dangerous just like the pembina hwy and fermor and the perimeter it’s so bad. The province should go to Costco and split the price with them for these much needed modifications.

I don't know. I typically think developers get off pretty easy in terms of contributing to infrastructure upgrades (esp. here in Wpg), but in this case access to the Costco is two sets of traffic lights west of the interchange and the store is probably 1km away.

That and I would guess about 99% of the people going to the new Costco won't touch the Perimeter on the way to the store. They'll either be driving out from the city on Portage Ave or driving in from the west on the TCH.

[bomberjet]

It would be on the overall site developer as opposed to Costco specifically. Also we have no backbone for anything like that around here.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by bodaggin

Prairie Dog Central is an 8 car train that runs twice a week, for only 5 months, and is struggling to stay afloat at that. They're the only ones that use that rail line.

We're not spending $150 million on a 6-lane overpass for them.

That's lighting money on fire. Either PDS moves outside Lawsons and the crossing is deleted. Or the existing at grade is kept as is and we deal with four, 1-minute inconveniences per week. Until they inevitably go bust.

Basically the same sentiment on CEMR Carman. The inconvenience of both these rail lines is so minimal and the use of these rail lines isn't super certain into the future, so just leave them for now unless it's the last thing standing to make the Perimeter a full fledged freeway.

I'm sure MTI thinks the same way, especially telling that the Carman line wasn't bundled with the McGillivray interchange, unlike the St Anne's road proposal.

There are much bigger fish to fry on the Perimeter and across the province.

[Wpgstvsouth94]

Originally Posted by Mr Tall Forehead

I don't know. I typically think developers get off pretty easy in terms of contributing to infrastructure upgrades (esp. here in Wpg), but in this case access to the Costco is two sets of traffic lights west of the interchange and the store is probably 1km away.

That and I would guess about 99% of the people going to the new Costco won't touch the Perimeter on the way to the store. They'll either be driving out from the city on Portage Ave or driving in from the west on the TCH.

The province should definitely press them about that sharing the cost. It would be nice. I think if I remember correctly, future upgrades to that interchange is a diverging diamond interchange. That is really needed in the interim right now I would say.

[Mr Tall Forehead]

Originally Posted by Wpgstvsouth94

The province should definitely press them about that sharing the cost. It would be nice. I think if I remember correctly, future upgrades to that interchange is a diverging diamond interchange. That is really needed in the interim right now I would say.

The province has no authority to press anyone here. Costco is basically pulling a building permit from the City of Winnipeg. As bomber noted, the time to request anything was when the lots were being subdivided 4-5 years ago. But that would require coordination between the city and province and the stones to actually ask anything from developers.

[Biff]

Costco just wouldn't build their store here in Winnipeg if they had to share costs of road upgrades. They already find Winnipeg as one of, if not the most expensive place in the country for construction. This is why this store is 4 to 5 years behind schedule. They built in other locations until the math worked here.

[WildCake]

Yea I don't think the Costco site with the residential around it is enough to justify forcing Perimeter infrastructure contributions due to the impact this development will have that far away. Sure there will be more traffic, but not enough for the province to start poking its nose into city politics. Nevermind that development agreements are already signed.

On the other hand, I would hope that the province would impose at least a cost-share for future interchanges when huge swaths of greenfield are developed into new neighbourhoods, like east of Sage Creek for the Symington interchange, west of Waverley West for 330, or north of Amber Trails for Pipeline. These areas will be even more removed from the core arterials of the city and will depend a lot more on the Perimeter to get around, and should be reflected in their developer agreement.

[Luisito]

Is the perimeter going to be widened to three lanes each way or are they leaving it at two for now?

[bomberjet]

Four lanes now, six lanes future.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by Luisito

Is the perimeter going to be widened to three lanes each way or are they leaving it at two for now?

Two for now is the general consensus, but the Red River crossings are probably nearing capacity at two lanes, especially North Perimeter.

We'll see what the Province has in mind when the proposals for the replacement of the Red River bridges on the South Perimeter are released.

[Hockey]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Four lanes now, six lanes future.

Yeah although the initial phase on the 100 had some 6 lanes between route 90 and Pembina, IIRC.

I also noticed that 101 functional design had 6 lanes around highway 7, so I wondered if that is the initial or ultimate design. It wasn't totally clear to me.

[bomberjet]

There were some bits that had 6 lanes initial, ultimate would be 8 lanes through there IIRC.

[bomberjet]

Looking again it's only between Kenaston and Pembina as the ramps are so close together. Not really truly 6 lanes. But ramps running out all overlapping. Surprised they didn't implement collector lanes like being proposed on 101 at Henderson / Main. Looks like weave city down there.

[Carboy15]

I'm thinking on the South Perimeter by Route 90 and Pembina, they'd probably turn that segment into a dual freeway (local express lanes), similar to the North Perimeter from the 59 Interchange to Main St.

[bomberjet]

Not sure if our posts crossed paths in the ether, but ya same thinking haha

[bomberjet]

Looking at the 101 slides again. It talks about future widening to 6 lanes along the west side from Portgage to McPhillips. But from McPhillips to Lag it is just 6 lanes, not future 6 lanes. Then goes back to future 6 lanes from Lag to Fermor. So maybe that segment will just be upgraded to 6 lanes whenever that goes ahead.

[craner]

With the Winnipeg area quickly approaching 1M the need for 6 lanes is probably there. I’m guessing the problem might be the existing interchange structures aren’t wide enough to accommodate 6 lanes ?