Highway 107 Upgrades (Burnside Expressway) | U/C

[Keith P.]

I have not seen this and likely will not for some time as I seldom visit that part of the Supercity (remember that term?) but based upon a few recent experiences with DTPW projects I have to think that it will be problematic. They seem continually challenged to be able to provide proper signage, and are very stingy with their use of lighting. I don’t understand why highway roundabouts are often unlit or have very minimal lighting. Even worse is the deficient signage used by DTPW generally.

This was illustrated last week one evening when I had to visit Bayers Lake and left by the Lacewood exit to get on to the 102. As I approached the traffic lights I fortunately knew what lane I needed to take to get to downtown. But I was struck by how utterly useless the road signs were. One indicated “Bedford”, the other “Clayton Park” along with Lacewood Dr., the street I was already on. That’s it. I immediately imagined myself being a visitor who had entered the BL shopping area from the 103 end and was unfamiliar. No signage indicating “Downtown” or Highway 102 inbound. It was quite ridiculous. They just seem to assume you would already know.

When I encountered the Burnside/Akerley roundabout last week I saw no signage at all except for one smallish directional sign. I presume there will be more prominent signage once it opens fully, but I’d be shocked if it is good signage. I recall getting very confused with the signage up the hill where Akerley becomes the 107. DTPWmust assume all road users are locals who know where they want to go.

[Dmajackson]

I drove it tonight just as the snow was starting to fall. I went from Burnside Drive to Highway 102 inbound. It felt quicker than I thought it would be but that's likely because it was nighttime. I'll post again once I drive it in the daytime (likely on Sunday). It feels like the new section of 103 from Tantallon to Hubbards.

The Bedford end is a bit strange. The Glendale/Duke exit is from the left lane. To make the "left" onto the 102 inbound requires a wide swing to the right. The approach signs say "Duke/Glendale", "Halifax/Windsor", and "Airport/Truro" (or similar). I get why they say this (control cities of the 101/102) but unfortunately I can also see how people heading into actual Bedford will get confused and take the Duke exit instead of merging onto the 102 inbound and taking Sunnyside or HP exit which is where 95% of Bedford is actually located.

I didn't try it tonight but I am wondering about the safety of having the exit to Duke/Glendale being from the left lane with a relatively short ramp. If the ramp gets backed up it could get hazardous. Magazine Hill has the same issue.

[q12]

Here are a couple screenshots (Credit: Waze Nova Scotia Community on Twitter @Waze_NS)

Inbound towards Dartmouth




Outbound towards Bedford/Sackville


Source:
Dashcam footage
https://twitter.com/Waze_NS/status/1870292190414372887

[OldDartmouthMark]

Drove from Burnside to Sackville and exited at the 102 south tonight. Overall impressions are very good as it seemed to be a quicker route than the Magazine, though I didn’t time it and it’s not a straight up comparison anyhow.

I had expected the route around the lake would seem unwieldy but actually it didn’t feel that pronounced, nor were the grade changes very noticeable - in fact I wouln’t have noticed if I weren’t looking for it. It was just a nice, quick, smooth ride (new pavement!). The exit to the 102 was effortless and I did not find the signage to be confusing in the least.

For my first drive, it gets a thumbs up! 👍🏻

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

The exit to the 102 was effortless and I did not find the signage to be confusing in the least.

Well, there are only three possible choices of destination. Unfortunately they left the name “Sackville” off the strangely undersized Duke St/Glendale sign.

How Sackville’s Duke St received that name when there is already one downtown is another question entirely.

[TheOldskoo]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Well, there are only three possible choices of destination. Unfortunately they left the name “Sackville” off the strangely undersized Duke St/Glendale sign.

How Sackville’s Duke St received that name when there is already one downtown is another question entirely.

And there's a Water Street in basically every single waterfront town and city, what of it?

I drove the highway today to check it out; it will directly improve my daily commute.

[Dmajackson]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Well, there are only three possible choices of destination. Unfortunately they left the name “Sackville” off the strangely undersized Duke St/Glendale sign.

How Sackville’s Duke St received that name when there is already one downtown is another question entirely.

Duke Street is in Bedford. That said you are right about the duplicate names. Halifax's policy says no communities adjacent to each other should have the same street names in use. Since Bedford and Halifax share a community border there's a good number of streets that are repeated. Duke/First/Second/North/Cedar/High/George/Summit are all used in both communities. I think the reason they haven't changed them is Halifax's unique numbering system ensures the civic addresses aren't duplicated.

One thing I didn't mention last night is it was very nice to see the province invest in proper lighting for the entire length.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Well, there are only three possible choices of destination. Unfortunately they left the name “Sackville” off the strangely undersized Duke St/Glendale sign.

My thoughts on signage are that their main function is to inform you where each lane will take you. Halifax/Windsor will obviously take you to 102 south and exit to the 101. Airport/Truro will obviously take you to 102 north. Duke/Glendale will obviously take you to the Bedford Commons shopping area, etc.. Most people who use this road know where they want to go and are aware of the highway layout in general and just want to know which lane goes where. For tourists in today’s world, most of them will be using some kind of navigation system to tell them where to go.

I think the signage installed achieves the goal.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Most people who use this road know where they want to go and are aware of the highway layout in general and just want to know which lane goes where. For tourists in today’s world, most of them will be using some kind of navigation system to tell them where to go.

This seems to be the way DTPW thinks. I would suggest to you that a great many people, especially older folks, do not use nav systems when driving. I may be an outlier in this case but I find them very difficult to use in general and a distraction. That argument would favor having even less useful signs if it were true.

I find our signage deficient compared to many other places, though not all. NB is equally bad for the most part. I have seen in other places where signage is very detailed and helpful. I would assume our issue is because the signage is specified by engineers and not by someone coming from a user/visitor perspective.

[Haliguy]

I drove through last night and thought the signage works very well.

[MonctonRad]

I look forward to trying this out the next time I'm in Halifax.

It pleases me immensely to see the roadway so well lit.

On the other hand, I remain greatly disappointed that the main dual carriageways in Moncton (Wheeler Blvd, Veteran Highway and the Trans Canada) are largely unlit.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

This seems to be the way DTPW thinks. I would suggest to you that a great many people, especially older folks, do not use nav systems when driving. I may be an outlier in this case but I find them very difficult to use in general and a distraction. That argument would favor having even less useful signs if it were true.

I find our signage deficient compared to many other places, though not all. NB is equally bad for the most part. I have seen in other places where signage is very detailed and helpful. I would assume our issue is because the signage is specified by engineers and not by someone coming from a user/visitor perspective.

I would suggest that the current level of signage is a happy medium between too much information and the “less useful signs” that you’re referring to. You have to remember that you are driving at 80(+) km/h, aware of traffic around you, while trying to digest the information on the sign to understand which lane you have to be in. If you clutter up the sign with every possible destination, you might blow by it before you have a chance to read it all.

Before navi systems, if I were driving in an unfamiliar place, I would read a map so that I would understand where I was going, be familiar with the route, and know the names near my destination. In other words, I took some responsibility for my travels and didn’t expect the government to lay it all out for me with complicated signage. Now, with car navi, a cheap Garmin, and more often now, your phone, navigation is easy and you really can just rely on that to get you there for the most part. It’s not new technology, either, as it’s been available for something like a quarter century. Most people are aware, and I find the older generations have no problem with this tech, but even if they do, they will take responsibility for their journey, and not expect signs to do it all for them. At least most will, as your objections indicate that not all do.

[q12]

Source: Youtube thanks to user

Andrew Bowie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-u8tznpgoI


Source: Youtube thanks to user

Andrew Bowie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-u8tznpgoI

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by OldDartmouthMark

Now, with car navi, a cheap Garmin, and more often now, your phone, navigation is easy and you really can just rely on that to get you there for the most part. It’s not new technology, either, as it’s been available for something like a quarter century. Most people are aware, and I find the older generations have no problem with this tech, but even if they do, they will take responsibility for their journey, and not expect signs to do it all for them. At least most will, as your objections indicate that not all do.

I am seriously allergic to nav systems. Part of the problem is that Siri just does not understand me, so voice commands simply do not work and never have. I don’t understand why, but that’s how it has always been so I need to manually enter a street address if I know it, which is a pain and not something I can/comfortably do while driving. If I manage to do that it usually works but then if I get there and need to drive around for a parking space or whatever I can’t turn it off. It makes me feel ridiculous so I tend to avoid using it because of the hassle. This is with both an iPhone and an in-car nav system; neither one works much differently nor better than the other.

[Dartguard]

I just drove the Route this afternoon from Cole Harbour to the 102 and back and I have to say I love this Road. Very surprised to see how much traffic was on the Road in both directions but it is Christmas week so folks are about. I took the Halifax Windsor exit to merge with the 102 and the ramp comes up pretty quickly. The recent Snow is tempering peoples speed but the merges work very well as the collector lanes have enough room to merge. The hill however past the Magazine needs another lane just to get the heavy's out of the way of two lanes of at speed traffic.

I was very curious about this route as I have work obligations at Bayers Lake and Traffic through Halifax has been brutal at any time of day for about the last year and a half. Its only going to get busier. Big City problems and Opportunities.

[Haliguy]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I look forward to trying this out the next time I'm in Halifax.

It pleases me immensely to see the roadway so well lit.

On the other hand, I remain greatly disappointed that the main dual carriageways in Moncton (Wheeler Blvd, Veteran Highway and the Trans Canada) are largely unlit.

Agree, its nice to see a well lit highway finally. Our highways are too dark in the Maritimes. Hopefully, they will look at better lighting along the bi-hi in the next few years.

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

I am seriously allergic to nav systems. Part of the problem is that Siri just does not understand me, so voice commands simply do not work and never have. I don’t understand why, but that’s how it has always been so I need to manually enter a street address if I know it, which is a pain and not something I can/comfortably do while driving. If I manage to do that it usually works but then if I get there and need to drive around for a parking space or whatever I can’t turn it off. It makes me feel ridiculous so I tend to avoid using it because of the hassle. This is with both an iPhone and an in-car nav system; neither one works much differently nor better than the other.

I guess they are not for everybody. I never use voice command software, so Siri isn’t an issue for me. I just enter my destination before I start driving and hit cancel when I arrive, if I am not going to the exact location that nav is pointing me to… or I just chuckle when it tells me to make a U turn… if possible. I haven’t had any issues with using it, but can see how others might have difficulties. I’ve always had a good sense of direction that perhaps I take for granted sometimes, and also have the ability to focus on the important tasks while ignoring the background noise. So signage plus technology always gets me where I’m going.

[Dmajackson]

I drove it today in the daylight from Port Wallace exit to Highway 101. Then for fun, I drove it back this evening taking the freeway system from Highway 101 to MacKay Bridge (101-102-107-118-111). Inbound this route allows you to get all the way onto the Peninsula without hitting a single traffic light.

It's a great highway. The median is cable-stayed and they are installing wildlife fences. The blasted cliff at the Anderson Connector is quite impressive and it's the first time I've ever seen Anderson Lake.

[Keith P.]

Turns out I’m not the only one having issues with the signage and design of this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/halifax/s/ROVY5ifhyD

[OldDartmouthMark]

Originally Posted by Keith P.

Turns out I’m not the only one having issues with the signage and design of this:

https://www.reddit.com/r/halifax/s/ROVY5ifhyD

3 signs and 4 lanes? Dude thinks that the space between the yellow line and the barrier is a lane? Probably shouldn’t be driving, IMHO. Go back and read the driver’s handbook again, at least.