Atlantic Canada airport thread

[MonctonRad]

The Fredericton campus of Moncton Flight College is closing it's doors (at least temporarily).

The reason is that MFC has lost their contracts to train Chinese pilots. This is partly due to economic difficulties in China, and also due to the new Canadian restrictions on international students.

90% of the students at the Fredericton campus were Chinese nationals.

The Moncton campus of MFC is unaffected. This is because the Moncton campus focusses on domestic (Canadian) students.

[q12]

Saint John was removed from the route maps:



https://www.flyporter.com/en-ca/about-porter/who-we-are/porter-and-embraer

[sailor734]

Yes, and Montreal has changed from "destination" to "hub"

I must say I'm a little surprised at the sheer number of Florida destinations. Seems like a little overkill.....especially with Miami, Ft Lauderdale and West Palm all being so close to each other

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sailor734

yes, and montreal has changed from "destination" to "hub"

Referring to YHU no doubt.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Referring to YHU no doubt.

I expect so. I'm still a little puzzled at the YHU choice. Seems to be somewhat limited as a "hub" with no provision for US preclearance or CBSA service. Especially with Porter's big expansion of US destinations.

[KnoxfordGuy]

Halifax...a Porter hub? Cool.

[J81]

Originally Posted by sailor734

I expect so. I'm still a little puzzled at the YHU choice. Seems to be somewhat limited as a "hub" with no provision for US preclearance or CBSA service. Especially with Porter's big expansion of US destinations.

The destinations they plan to fly to out of YHU probably all have US customs.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by J81

The destinations they plan to fly to out of YHU probably all have US customs.

I thought I read that this new terminal would not have provision for CBSA services either and is intended for domestic flights only? Everything I see refers to it as a "domestic" terminal and talks of service to "Canadian destinations"

https://skiesmag.com/press-releases/mont...receive-new-domestic-passenger-terminal/

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by sailor734

I thought I read that this new terminal would not have provision for CBSA services either and is intended for domestic flights only? Everything I see refers to it as a "domestic" terminal and talks of service to "Canadian destinations"

https://skiesmag.com/press-releases/mont...receive-new-domestic-passenger-terminal/

Even if YHU will only be a domestic airport (and this may be the case given a testy relationship between YHU and Aeroports de Montreal, the operators of YUL and YMX), it will still give Maritime residents more options for connecting flights to western Canada. YYZ is congested and is a pain. YOW is becoming an option (thanks to Porter). YHU will be a third option. As a Porter hub, I have no doubt that YHU will eventually connect through to Vancouver, Edmonton, Calgary and perhaps Winnipeg.

And, of course, with Westjet, you can fly to Calgary (year round) and Edmonton (seasonally) via YQM.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

https://www.narcity.com/canadas-best-airport-2025?




Someone want to remind me again why it’s so crazy to suggest that Saint John (YSJ) and Fredericton (YFC) two cities an hour away from each other, with two of the worst airports in Canada, share a new, not terrible airport located midway between the two cities?

There’s far more people located in the Saint John and Fredericton CMA’s than the Moncton CMA. Yet, Moncton has a good airport, while Fredericton and Saint John both have — airports.

The obvious solution is to build a new airport between Saint John and Fredericton… and I don’t think we should wait for all the baby boomers to die off first before we take the idea seriously. With the right attitude and vision, this new airport is something that could be executed and realized within a decade, and would be transformative for central and southern NB. The long term economic benefits will far outweigh the short term costs.

The premier is from Fredericton… and young enough to get a lot of use out of it the rest of her life, unlike her predecessor. As for spending political capital on such a large project… what the risk exactly in building a better airport for the two of the three largest cities in the province to share?

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

https://www.narcity.com/canadas-best-airport-2025?




Someone want to remind me again why it’s so crazy to suggest that Saint John (YSJ) and Fredericton (YFC) two cities an hour away from each other, with two of the worst airports in Canada, share a new, not terrible airport located midway between the two cities?

There’s far more people located in the Saint John and Fredericton CMA’s than the Moncton CMA. Yet, Moncton has a good airport, while Fredericton and Saint John both have — airports.

The obvious solution is to build a new airport between Saint John and Fredericton… and I don’t think we should wait for all the baby boomers to die off first before we take the idea seriously. With the right attitude and vision, this new airport is something that could be executed and realized within a decade, and would be transformative for central and southern NB. The long term economic benefits will far outweigh the short term costs.

The premier is from Fredericton… and young enough to get a lot of use out of it the rest of her life, unlike her predecessor. As for spending political capital on such a large project… what the risk exactly in building a better airport for the two of the three largest cities in the province to share?

Why not? In a word "billions".

Sunk costs in existing facilities and construction costs of building new. The gain isn't worth the cost in most people's eyes given the many other competing needs for public money.

Besides, it's not the airports, it's the level/frequency of service that's the problem today. Go back to 3-4 flights a day to YYZ ,YUL and maybe YHX plus seasonal service south and the majority of people would be satisfied.

Neither of these airports need much in the way of services (lounges/bars/food options/shops etc) as there are no connecting passengers needing to kill time . People simply get on or off a plane and leave the facility.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by sailor734

Why not? In a word "billions".

Sunk costs in existing facilities and construction costs of building new. The gain isn't worth the cost in most people's eyes given the many other competing needs for public money.

Besides, it's not the airports, it's the level/frequency of service that's the problem today. Go back to 3-4 flights a day to YYZ ,YUL and maybe YHX plus seasonal service south and the majority of people would be satisfied.

Neither of these airports need much in the way of services (lounges/bars/food options/shops etc) as there are no connecting passengers needing to kill time . People simply get on or off a plane and leave the facility.

NB’s GDP is what, 37 billion? Spending a billion or two on a new airport should be seen as an opportunity rather than an expense. Would be a good way to boost our GDP on something actually useful and forward thinking.

If Greater Saint John and Greater Fredericton shared a single airport, the frequency of flights will increase, and there will be more interest in airlines to invest in new routes.

The only option we have at the moment, is for the province to subsidize more flights in and out of New Brunswick. It’s a good option and something we should be doing, but investing in a bigger, better airport than YQM will get the airlines interested in investing in new routes themselves. Imo, we should be looking at both- subsidizing new routes at our existing three airports, but also exploring a shared airport model for Fredericton and Saint John.

[MonctonRad]

Look at the bright side - YQM Romeo LeBlanc in Moncton was rated higher than YHZ Robert Stanfield in Halifax,

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Look at the bright side - YQM Romeo LeBlanc in Moncton was rated higher than YHZ Robert Stanfield in Halifax,

That’s not a bright side for people in Saint John and Fredericton…

[Justanothermember]

It's shocking how high YYZ is rated, given how much of a cluster — it is.

[ChampduLarge]

I am happy to see Moncton's airport ranked relatively well. I am always fascinated by airports and watching them get refreshed and then in a myriad of ways they get worse over time. In Moncton, I am saddened by the decision to not use some doors to exit the baggage area, and by the Tim Horton's that no longer operates outside the secure area, though I can see why that was likely problematic. It needs a little bit of a refresh. I honestly don't find YYZ bad at all, would rather fly through there than Montreal any day. I've flow through Pearson hundreds of times and have had very few bad experiences.

[sailor734]

Originally Posted by Justanothermember

It's shocking how high YYZ is rated, given how much of a cluster — it is.

Yes, I didn't place much value on this study after I saw that.

[EnvisionSaintJohn]

Originally Posted by ChampduLarge

I honestly don't find YYZ bad at all, would rather fly through there than Montreal any day. I've flow through Pearson hundreds of times and have had very few bad experiences.

Same.

I’ve never had any real issues flying through Toronto, but have had some absolute horror stories flying through Montreal. It’s like they go out of their way at Air Canada in Montreal to dream up near impossible connections for people travelling onwards to the Maritimes.

To me, it’s like a night and day difference between YUL and YYZ. I’ll only fly through Montreal now if it’s the only option, and I’ll actually pay more to avoid it entirely. Flying to and from MTL is fine, it when you gotta clear customs and make a connecting flight that it becomes très misérable.

[dhottawa729]

Originally Posted by EnvisionSaintJohn

https://www.narcity.com/canadas-best-airport-2025?

Sorry for this long post- it’s a topic I’ve become passionate about recently…

Ever since that report came out in early 2024 ranking YSJ as the worst airport in Canada I’ve been super concerned for its existence. It’s become a crummy airport that is in dire need of investment because let’s be real, NB is not getting a new airport anytime in the next 10-20 years, if ever. With WestJet and Porter having pulled out, Air Canada reducing to almost minimal service on terrible schedules, and Flair apparently having issues raising capital, I really do feel like the airport is hanging by a thread or in sudden-death overtime and that something needs to be done urgently to turn things around. The major airlines KNOW people will drive to other airports, but do we want to?? If we do it, it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy, but what are we to do when ticket cost is high, flight service is poor and the building is crammed and out-dated?

Recently I’ve seen online adds for Air Canada branded buses and worry that this could be the fate of YSJ. That would be devastating for business and tourism and super inconvenient for residents, and as a region of this size we can’t accept that very real and very possible outcome as it would be crushing for the local economy. Pascan has taken a chance on us and is a small ray of hope and we need to support them. The airport needs major airlines for long-term financial security though.

The airport absolutely needs external money from every angle they can get it to both modernize and expand the terminal, and maybe put a temporary hold on airport fees to reduce ticket prices and lure back the customers that don’t even consider YSJ when booking travel.

The moniker of “Canada’s Worst Airport” is deeply troubling to me and I really do think the community and its leadership all need to rally together to do something about that, and fast! It’s very bad press for our city.

It would be wonderful if the Irving Family, for instance, bought naming rights for the airport as a memorial to the family empire while giving YSJ some capital to modernize the terminal and keep ticket prices competitive. Remarkably, 2025 is the 100-year anniversary of Irving setting up shop in Saint John and it would be such a great memorial to a family that has had such an influence on the City for many generations, and especially after the passing of Arthur and JK earlier this year! Love ‘em or hate ‘em, they’ve put food on many of our plates for 100 years. Irving is basically synonymous with Saint John afterall.

Does anyone else share these feelings? I feel like there’s nothing I can do except cross my fingers or write an online post and hope someone will read it and be inspired.

[magee_b]

Originally Posted by dhottawa729

Sorry for this long post- it’s a topic I’ve become passionate about recently…

Ever since that report came out in early 2024 ranking YSJ as the worst airport in Canada I’ve been super concerned for its existence. It’s become a crummy airport that is in dire need of investment because let’s be real, NB is not getting a new airport anytime in the next 10-20 years, if ever. With WestJet and Porter having pulled out, Air Canada reducing to almost minimal service on terrible schedules, and Flair apparently having issues raising capital, I really do feel like the airport is hanging by a thread or in sudden-death overtime and that something needs to be done urgently to turn things around. The major airlines KNOW people will drive to other airports, but do we want to?? If we do it, it’s a self-fulfilling prophecy, but what are we to do when ticket cost is high, flight service is poor and the building is crammed and out-dated?

Recently I’ve seen online adds for Air Canada branded buses and worry that this could be the fate of YSJ. That would be devastating for business and tourism and super inconvenient for residents, and as a region of this size we can’t accept that very real and very possible outcome as it would be crushing for the local economy. Pascan has taken a chance on us and is a small ray of hope and we need to support them. The airport needs major airlines for long-term financial security though.

The airport absolutely needs external money from every angle they can get it to both modernize and expand the terminal, and maybe put a temporary hold on airport fees to reduce ticket prices and lure back the customers that don’t even consider YSJ when booking travel.

The moniker of “Canada’s Worst Airport” is deeply troubling to me and I really do think the community and its leadership all need to rally together to do something about that, and fast! It’s very bad press for our city.

It would be wonderful if the Irving Family, for instance, bought naming rights for the airport as a memorial to the family empire while giving YSJ some capital to modernize the terminal and keep ticket prices competitive. Remarkably, 2025 is the 100-year anniversary of Irving setting up shop in Saint John and it would be such a great memorial to a family that has had such an influence on the City for many generations, and especially after the passing of Arthur and JK earlier this year! Love ‘em or hate ‘em, they’ve put food on many of our plates for 100 years. Irving is basically synonymous with Saint John afterall.

Does anyone else share these feelings? I feel like there’s nothing I can do except cross my fingers or write an online post and hope someone will read it and be inspired.

I feel pretty much the same. Pre-covid, the management team in place seemed to be doing a pretty good job. They attracted porter and flair, and seemed to be working with their counterparts at other atlantic airports to attract new services to the region (They had brought in someone to actually focus on route development). They did a lot of leg work understanding the market potential, the leakages happening to other airports, and building a business case for airlines to either come to YSJ or expand their services here.

They also managed to build a case for government investment in refurbishing and upgrading the airfield infrastructure - which had been needed for a longtime.

Post-covid and post-management change, the airport just seems stuck. Unable to adapt to the new reality of the airlines (larger planes, less frequency), and no longer appear to be participating in the route development work done by the atlantic canada airports association. And based on their terminal development ideas, they don't seem very practical, serious or realistic.

The terminal is in dire need of investment - either a significant expansion and re-configuration to handle the new reality of passenger loads/flows resulting from the larger aircraft, or a greenfield terminal development. YFC did a great job of taking advantage of the covid downturn to expedite work on their terminal.

It's going to take significant work to turn things around there (if it can happen at all) - and based on what I have seen from the current team in terms of what they are sharing publicly, I don't really have faith that they are up for the challenge.

In the meantime - My air service (realistic) hope, is that the airport authority can work with AC to have YYZ/YUL at minimum 2 x daily year round (and time them for connections), work with Flair on a thru service on their YYZ flights to make a one-stop service to either YYC/YEG, and do whatever they can to bring porter back. All of these should be possible based on the YSJ market and current airline operating environment (there are real limitations out of the airport's control in terms of available pilots, aircraft availability/engine issues)