PHILADELPHIA | Highrise Development Thread X

[TK2001]

Hi my name is Thomas and I like buildings and Philadelphia.

Now let's continue

[mcgrath618]

If anyone insults other members, they will be banned for 10 days in accordance with forum rules.

Come on guys. You’re better than this. We can have a civil conversation about this proposal for the waterfront. Instead of mudslinging and straw mans, let’s talk more about competing proposals like Bridgeman’s Tower and Philadelphia’s WTC.

[PENNSYLVANIAPROGRESS]

Originally Posted by mcgrath618

If anyone insults other members, they will be banned for 10 days in accordance with forum rules.

Come on guys. You’re better than this. We can have a civil conversation about this proposal for the waterfront. Instead of mudslinging and straw mans, let’s talk more about competing proposals like Bridgeman’s Tower and Philadelphia’s WTC.

is it a supertall ?

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Got some exposures after coming back from NYC

[TK2001]

Is there a reason why the 2301 JFK forum is closed? That thing is still definitely under construction

[TK2001]

Delete

[TK2001]

Philadelphia skyline by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Philadelphia skyline by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

[TK2001]

Two Liberty Place concept massing by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place concept massing by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

I figured I share these, I haven't seen them before. Also, why oh why did Cigna NOT want a symmetrical tower like on the right of the last image. Jahn himself was not very fond of the outcome of Two Liberty Place. But hey, I still cherish it

[jaysb]

Originally Posted by TK2001

Two Liberty Place concept massing by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place concept massing by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

I figured I share these, I haven't seen them before. Also, why oh why did Cigna NOT want a symmetrical tower like on the right of the last image. Jahn himself was not very fond of the outcome of Two Liberty Place. But hey, I still cherish it

such a shame these are rarely visible in the skyline shot from the Art Museum.

[TK2001]

One Liberty Place was only seen from the Art Museum from 1986-1989. Mellon Bank Center blocked its view

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by TK2001

I figured I share these, I haven't seen them before. Also, why oh why did Cigna NOT want a symmetrical tower like on the right of the last image. Jahn himself was not very fond of the outcome of Two Liberty Place. But hey, I still cherish it

I thought that Cigna made the request for more office space so late in the process that "the bulge" was the best/only option....that could be urban legend, not sure.

[TK2001]

Jahn made more than a handful of concepts for specifically Two Liberty Place, specifically at the request of Cigna. It seems they kept demanding more and more space in the tower, to the point where Two Liberty's roof was drawn to stand above One Liberty's roof. Everything from flat roofs, angled planes, hell even the mall was greatly changed during the process...as you can see above. That's a different hotel and mall design. Looking back at my archives, it looks like there was well over 20 designs made to give 2 LP more space. The earliest drawings I've found are dated back to March 1986, and the design with that date label shows 2 LP at the same height as it's original symmetrical plan...yet one of the designs has a crown just like the Bank of the Southwest Tower. I have another drawing dating back to August 1987 (when tenants were first moving into One Liberty) and it shows the form we know today. Yet it shows more floor space popping out in certain areas. It looks like that design was revised to what we see today. And I specifically believe that due to the construction cost exceeding the budget, the stone cladding at the top that was supposed to look just like One Liberty was cut

[TK2001]

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Liberty Place model late 1987 by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

All of the images I was talking about above.

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr

Two Liberty Place redesigning by Philly SkyGuy, on Flickr
And here's some of the wacky designs. These drawings were captured at One Liberty Observation Deck. I won't be shocked if this is still up there

[PHL10]

Originally Posted by TK2001

And here's some of the wacky designs. These drawings were captured at One Liberty Observation Deck. I won't be shocked if this is still up there

Wow, super cool. Thanks for the info TK!

[Double L]

Originally Posted by TK2001

Hi my name is Thomas and I like buildings and Philadelphia.

Now let's continue

Sounds like an Alcoholics Anonymous support group.

[JohnIII]

This is the first time anyone has explained what happened to Liberty Two in a concrete way that I've ever heard. I knew a lot of people who worked on the construction of Liberty One and Liberty Two and when they were built Liberty Two wasn't suppose to be so wide but when Cigna talked about moving in we heard that they were going to expand the building. At the time it was told that Liberty One was 999' and they passed out dark blue sweat shirts to the workers; it was also being talked about that Liberty Two would be taller than Liberty One; some were saying it would be about 80 floors and others were even saying it would be 100 floors because one of the ideas was that it would have had a crown similar to Liberty One and it was exciting people it would've been cool to finally get a 100 story building but know one really know outside of the design team.

We were also told at the time by some that Liberty Two would have a crown like Liberty One however it was known as well that the original design was to follow a concept that was planned for a skyscraper that was originally destined for Houston, Texas oddly enough; I don't remember the company that was suppose to have the originally design but for some reason that deal fell through thankfully and as a result the architects etc. started to bring what is now Liberty One and eventually Liberty Two in 1984 or something like that.

[TK2001]

In reality One Liberty Place is 62 floors with the roof height at 885 feet tall (1984 design had a 815 foot high roof). Heights stated on the internet for the spire is 945, 965, and I've seen 1,006 feet, and the One Liberty Place website states the whole tower rises to 1,090 feet. But I'm pretty sure that's including sea level. To be honest, it's still a mystery to me. But I know the exact sweatshirt you are talking about, it popped up on ebay on 2022 or 2023.

One Liberty Place broke ground May 13, 1985 and Two Liberty Place broke ground February 16, 1988. At One Liberty's groundbreaking, the model of the two symmetrical towers and taller hotel was revealed. At the groundbreaking of Two Liberty, the model posted above was revealed.

And I hope those people you know have photos! Despite me researching for six years, I haven't found any concrete photos of the Two Liberty's concrete core rising. See what I did there? Alright I'm logging off

[JohnIII]

Came across something interesting regarding Liberty One; its intriguing. There are 2 websites that seem to regard above sea elevation; one being Elevation Finder; and when you put the address of 17th and Market in Philadelphia PA the different websites record different heights; 42.3 feet and the other 33 feet.

If Liberty One doesn't take into the account of above sea elevation then I guess its 1090 feet.

If Liberty One does take into the account an above sea elevation of 42 feet then I guess Liberty One's height is 1047 feet.

If Liberty One does take into the account an above sea elevation of 33 feet then I guess Liberty One's height is 1057 feet.

What is really interest is this; in either of these 2 circumstances a few things change as far as Philadelphia Skyscrapers are concerned.
(1) Philadelphia would have 3 skyscrapers over 1,000 feet which only 2 other cities in America have.
(2) If Liberty One is at either of these 3 listed heights; then the Comcast and Comcast Tech Center could be higher. for example if Liberty One is 1047' not counting above sea level; then Comcast is as well when its not listed to be that tall. Should they be corrected?

I find the height of 1090' to be amazing, wow that would be amazing. The website does say 1090' above the streets so it would seem that the built is 1090'; for the streets are already above sea level.

Hey if Liberty One is 1090' great, fine, cool, good skyscraper indeed.

[William Van Alen]

As long as we're on the topic of One Liberty, I recently came across the city of Ürümqi in the Xinjiang province of China on my google maps adventures. Imagine my shock as a Philadelphian when I looked at a skyline picture and saw this tower.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhong_Tian_Plaza

Looked more into it and all I could find was the wikipedia page that said it looks like One Liberty.

[R5Ryder]

Originally Posted by William Van Alen

As long as we're on the topic of One Liberty, I recently came across the city of Ürümqi in the Xinjiang province of China on my google maps adventures. Imagine my shock as a Philadelphian when I looked at a skyline picture and saw this tower.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhong_Tian_Plaza

Looked more into it and all I could find was the wikipedia page that said it looks like One Liberty.

https://www.ocfrealty.com/naked-philly/r...y-place-often-imitated-never-duplicated/

Per linked article:

Tehran Iran


Santiago Chile


And a couple of others in China.