Quebec, the French Language, and Quebecois Identity

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by harls

Dude. People wear shorts here when it's -10.

Our English neighbors in Southern France would do gardening in shorts in early March with +14 C temperature outside. We all thought that was insane.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by lio45

It’s always about what you’re used to. Of course snow will paralyze your city if you’re not equipped for it. Same with cold. Same with wind: in FL I’ll shrug off a direct hit from a Cat 1 storm as relatively harmless (maybe a few tree limbs downed at worst) while in Sherbrooke it would likely destroy half my buildings. The standards are not the same at all.

-5C in my area of FL, pipes would explode everywhere; in Quebec we’re fine even down to -30C. (Pipes start exploding when we get around -35 here. Meanwhile I’m sure -35 would do zero damage in Yakutsk.)

This is the conversation I had on a car trip last week with a guy whose accent I thought was Alsatian. He said he was actually from coastal Normandy, but he had worked in Langres (Eastern France) for some years and had caught the accent there, and had never lost it despite leaving Langres long ago.

So I commented how Langres is the coldest place in France, it must be hard in winter, and he said this: "Ah, je suis parti y vivre en 1986, et mon premier hiver [1985-86 winter was the coldest in France since 1962, and it's never been as cold since then] il a fait moins 15 pendant 3 semaines, moi qui venait de ma Normandie où il ne fait jamais froid l'hiver, j'en pleurais le soir !"

(and I the Southern guy was thinking... "jamais froid l'hiver en Normandie, yeah right...")

All these things are very relative, aren't they. But what I've noticed in the past 15 years or so is we've become less used to cold weather here. Cites get paralyzed now with just some minus 2 frost and half an inch of snow. Trains even stop running. It's crazy. It wasn't like that before.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

This is the conversation I had on a car trip last week with a guy whose accent I thought was Alsatian. He said he was actually from coastal Normandy, but he had worked in Langres (Eastern France) for some years and had caught the accent there, and had never lost it despite leaving Langres long ago.

So I commented how Langres is the coldest place in France, it must be hard in winter, and he said this: "Ah, je suis parti y vivre en 1986, et mon premier hiver [1985-86 winter was the coldest in France since 1962, and it's never been as cold since then] il a fait moins 15 pendant 3 semaines, moi qui venait de ma Normandie où il ne fait jamais froid l'hiver, j'en pleurais le soir !"

(and I the Southern guy was thinking... "jamais froid l'hiver en Normandie, yeah right...")

All these things are very relative, aren't they. But what I've noticed in the past 15 years or so is we've become less used to cold weather here. Cites get paralyzed now with just some minus 2 frost and half an inch of snow. Trains even stop running. It's crazy. It wasn't like that before.

https://x.com/BlaguePasDr0le/status/1514675032630378502/photo/1

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

Only minus 15. So warm!

.

Actually when we say it didn't get down to -20 in the winter, it can mean that it got down to -19.9.

Actual coldest temperature here was -18.7 last winter.

There were also a number of other days below -15.

Also -13.8 on March 22.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Nope. Montreal. Not sure how they do it. The weirdest is two nieces are in French Immersion in the English board and they both have someone from France in their class. Maybe work permit but one has been in the class for years. (My sister commented she kind of has a werid accent almost like a non-native speaker but it's probably just a mix of Quebec standard and rural French) Also a few other immigrants from West Africa. Loopholes or really you can just print a diploma from an English school. Sort of like all the Gatinois I see dropping their kids off at English schools in Ottawa. (This is from license plates so maybe divorce or whatever but I see it a lot)

Sounds like they are taking advantage of some loophole. May not be completely legit.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

My brother-in-law is an immigrant from the UK and he's commented before how surprised he was at how warm & sunny summertime is in Ontario. His family often visits in the summer.

British immigrants complain less about the climate in Canada than French immigrants.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by 1overcosc

It's actually not that uncommon to find two random White American celebrities and discover that they're distantly related to each other through a single 17th century Quebecois ancestor. Angelina Jolie, Madonna, and Mark Wahlberg, for example, are all 10th cousins of each other, descended from the Demers family (brothers Etienne & Jean who moved from France to Quebec in the 17th century). I'm also descended from one of the Demers brothers - patrilineally - although my surname isn't actually Demers because one of my patrilineal ancestors in the 19th century was adopted.

And they and you are probably all related to Céline Dion as well!

I think Madonna and Hillary Clinton definitely are.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Acajack

British immigrants complain less about the climate in Canada than French immigrants.

Sturdier stock. More used to foul weather, especially the Scots.

Much hardier than residents of the Mediterranean Riviera,

You see the same thing with the Yanks. I always chuckle over Californians breaking out the mittens and scarves when the air temperature is +10C.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

All these things are very relative, aren't they. But what I've noticed in the past 15 years or so is we've become less used to cold weather here. Cites get paralyzed now with just some minus 2 frost and half an inch of snow. Trains even stop running. It's crazy. It wasn't like that before.

Even in Quebec people have gotten wimpier when it comes to winter weather. At least in relative terms.

We now get WEATHER WARNINGS when it is going to snow with 5 cm. Some people do make jokes about warning people that there is going to be light snow in Quebec in January.

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Acajack

British immigrants complain less about the climate in Canada than French immigrants.

One of the big comments from my British relatives (this goes for Australian ones / friends from South Africa as well) is how warm it is inside houses during winter here. No matter how cold it gets outside. British housing tends to run damp and drafty, making for a somewhat miserable experience when it's cold out. Apparently the worst housing quality in Western Europe, though I'm not sure what metrics that's based on. A lot easier to appreciate winter when you can go inside to warm up with relative ease.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by niwell

One of the big comments from my British relatives (this goes for Australian ones / friends from South Africa as well) is how warm it is inside houses during winter here. No matter how cold it gets outside. British housing tends to run damp and drafty, making for a somewhat miserable experience when it's cold out. Apparently the worst housing quality in Western Europe, though I'm not sure what metrics that's based on. A lot easier to appreciate winter when you can go inside to warm up with relative ease.

"I'm from Quebec and the coldest winter I ever lived through was in... Paris."

I've heard this often.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by Acajack

"I'm from Quebec and the coldest winter I ever lived through was in... Paris."

I've heard this often.

My ex said the same upon moving to Australia when winter came: no insulation so when it’s +5C outside it’s almost the same inside too, which is of course completely nuts for us (being so used to indoors being always comfortably warm absolutely regardless of outside temp).

[niwell]

Originally Posted by Acajack

"I'm from Quebec and the coldest winter I ever lived through was in... Paris."

I've heard this often.

Actually heard that line from my uncle who moved to Australia 30 years ago. Just replace "Quebec" with Toronto and "Paris" with Sydney. When it goes below 10 degrees it's not much warmer inside.

EDIT: lio beat me to it!

[MolsonExport]

The coldest winter I experienced was August in San Francisco.

So the saying goes. I was there. At night, it got very chilly.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by lio45

https://x.com/BlaguePasDr0le/status/1514675032630378502/photo/1

Fun fact: ocean temperature off the beaches of LA is the same as in... northern Brittany (not even southern Brittany, but northern Brittany). Anytime I tell this to French people they are greatly surprised. They imagine Mediterranean water temperatures.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Actually when we say it didn't get down to -20 in the winter, it can mean that it got down to -19.9.

Actual coldest temperature here was -18.7 last winter.

There were also a number of other days below -15.

Also -13.8 on March 22.

Coldest nighttime temperature in my neighborhood in Paris last winter was... -2.3. And coldest daytime temperature was -0.2.

We had a maximum of +15.3 in January (on Jan. 24), and of +19.0 in February (on Feb. 15). This would have been winters in southern France 20 years ago. Now it's the new normal in Paris. The only big difference is winters are considerably darker in Paris than in southern France, so much more "wintry".

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Sturdier stock. More used to foul weather, especially the Scots.

When I lived in London I saw some English guy walking barefoot on Oxford Street in winter!

That plus our neighbors in shorts and T-shirts in southern France in early March out in the garden. The English people certainly are some odd folks.

Parisians tend to be the opposite, they seem always super cold, especially women (you see people here wearing big heavy coats in mid September when temperature dips below +20, I always find it ridiculous). Sometimes even during heatwaves I see people with (lighter) coats.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by New Brisavoine

Coldest nighttime temperature in my neighborhood in Paris last winter was... -2.3. And coldest daytime temperature was -0.2.

We had a maximum of +15.3 in January (on Jan. 24), and of +19.0 in February (on Feb. 15). This would have been winters in southern France 20 years ago. Now it's the new normal in Paris. The only big difference is winters are considerably darker in Paris than in southern France, so much more "wintry".

Does anyone in Paris think this is a bad thing? I hear lots of missing winter but when it's 23 degrees on Haloween everyone talks about loving it.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

The coldest winter I experienced was August in San Francisco.

So the saying goes. I was there. At night, it got very chilly.

Yeah, summer can be colder than winter in SF. I experienced some beautifully sunny and warm days in January there, and some miserable, cold and foggy days in summer. That's why tourists should never visit in summer. The best time to visit is last week of September and first week of October, when the thermal difference between continent and ocean is greatly reduced, so the fog stops, and the sun is still high in the sky, so that's when you can have the warmest temperatures in SF.

That said, even when it's foggy and cold in SF, it's going to be sunny and warm in the Silicon Valley. So you're only a half hour drive from the Med really.

I remember one day in June some years ago, we were in shorts and T-shirts, +25 temperatures, gorgeous sunshine. We decided to drive to SF to go to the beach there, and when we arrived there, just half an hour of driving, it was like driving 14 hours between French Riviera and Brittany, all foggy and dark, people wearing long pants, sweaters, etc. It was so odd. But not unusual.

At my favorite café on a cliff overlooking the ocean over there they have a bench outside to watch the ocean, there's always a blanket on it. It's pretty romantic though, with the fog surrounding you and the sound of the huge waves crashing on the cliff that you cannot see.

[New Brisavoine]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Does anyone in Paris think this is a bad thing? I hear lots of missing winter but when it's 23 degrees on Haloween everyone talks about loving it.

Yeah, people have a tendency to see everything negatively here. The French are always very negative. Plus we have super strong far-left parties doing their best to make us feel guilty, plus our public TV and radios have non-stop programs about the catastrophe of climate change.

So maybe people like the warmth, but they won't openly express some joy about it, they will just say how crazy/bad it is that it's +15 in January (please! it's been +15 before, it's just more frequent now, that's all). Whenever they have +24 in Biarritz in January, our national media go into overdrive along the lines of "climate change apocalypse now", when in fact hello! there's always been some freak warm days in January on the French Basque Coast. It's perhaps only more frequent now, but nothing unheard of.

Whenever I'm with people who bemoan the warmth in winter or autumn, I go like "Enfin on va pas se plaindre qu'il fasse moins froid quand même", and they never contradict me. In fact I had that conversation with two young women last week, as we were driving back from Normandy. I said "it's going to be +20 in Paris tomorrow", and one was like "oh my God, it's crazy what global change is bringing, really bad, bla bla bla". So I said "ouais enfin c'est quand même bien agréable qu'il fasse 20 degrés", and she didn't deny it. People make me laugh really! As if there was anything we could do here about climate change. It's all about what China and India will do, and to a lesser extent North America. We Europeans could disappear tomorrow and that would change NOTHING to climate change.