Edmonton Construction Part 14 (October 2023)

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by CMD UW

No. Maclab is in the process of getting their first 2-tower project underway in 2025.

https://edmontonjournal.com/news/local-n...new-grocery-store-rental-apartments-2025

Holy cow that's amazing! Thanks

[CMD UW]

Originally Posted by Harrison

Better chance Maclab builds something on that Millwoods TOD site then Morguard ever would at Bonnie Doon.

This is the correct response.

[Coldrsx]

Address: 10155 - 94STREET NW
10159 - 94 STREET NW
10175U - 94 STREET NW
Planner Description: The City has received a rezoning application from DIALOG. The current zone is the Mixed Use Zone (MU h85.0 f8.0) and the proposed zone is still the Mixed Use Zone (MU h150.0 f13.0) but with a higher maximum height and floor area ratio. The proposed zone would allow large scale mixed use development up to a height of approximately 42 storeys (150 metres) with a maximum floor area ratio of 13.0. The maximum tower floor plate would be 850 square metres and there would be optional non-residential uses located at ground level. In the Central District Plan, the site is located within the Centre City.
Status: In Review
File Number: LDA24-0421

[Coldrsx]

Attended the Calgary Real Estate forum today.

Some takeaways that Edmonton should be aware of:

- a general shift away from concrete to 6 storey stick-framed due to a cost delta of $75-100/sqft.

- rents need to be $10-20% higher in Calgary to really see a significant addition to supply -> this would translate into 30-40% higher rates in Edmonton. They are suggesting a $4/sqft rent... Edmonton is at $2.50-2.75.

- Expect to see more REITs and larger players in Alberta soon when it comes to purpose-built rental product.

- MANY are leery of office->residential conversions.

- Construction costs have risen 30-35% year over year.

[Coldrsx]

External ID
315143826-064
Job Type
Major Development Permit
Description
To construct alterations to a Residential development - adding 12 Storeys and 188 Multi-unit Housing Dwellings to the east Tower. The total number of Dwellings is increasing from 504 to 692. This is part of a Mixed Use development with 2 Residential Towers and main floor Indoor Sales and Services Use and a 3rd floor Minor Indoor Entertainment Use (fitness facility).
Applicant
DIALOG
Status
Intake - Payment Required
Class of Permit
Create Date
October 21, 2024
Approval Date
Location
10423 - 101 STREET NW Plan 2321876 Blk A Lot 1
Neighbourhood
DOWNTOWN

[TimB09]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

Attended the Calgary Real Estate forum today.

Some takeaways that Edmonton should be aware of:

- a general shift away from concrete to 6 storey stick-framed due to a cost delta of $75-100/sqft.

- rents need to be $10-20% higher in Calgary to really see a significant addition to supply -> this would translate into 30-40% higher rates in Edmonton. They are suggesting a $4/sqft rent... Edmonton is at $2.50-2.75.

- Expect to see more REITs and larger players in Alberta soon when it comes to purpose-built rental product.

- MANY are leery of office->residential conversions.

- Construction costs have risen 30-35% year over year.

Focused on just Calgary or both Edmonton and Calgary?

[Coldrsx]

Sounded like both from the discussions.

[Coldrsx]

Westrich Windsor 1




Former Rileys site

[feepa]

I still feel like the above project is more suitable for outside of the core. This plot of land could be more than this couldn't it? It's adjacent to the warehouse park...

[Harrison]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

External ID
315143826-064
Job Type
Major Development Permit
Description
To construct alterations to a Residential development - adding 12 Storeys and 188 Multi-unit Housing Dwellings to the east Tower. The total number of Dwellings is increasing from 504 to 692. This is part of a Mixed Use development with 2 Residential Towers and main floor Indoor Sales and Services Use and a 3rd floor Minor Indoor Entertainment Use (fitness facility).
Applicant
DIALOG
Status
Intake - Payment Required
Class of Permit
Create Date
October 21, 2024
Approval Date
Location
10423 - 101 STREET NW Plan 2321876 Blk A Lot 1
Neighbourhood
DOWNTOWN

That is a huge increase in density for the second tower, really good to see. I wonder if that means Qualico is seeing strong leasing demand for the first building? If this happens, there will be over 1,000 people living in that development (1.5 people per unit @ 100% occupancy), which would be amazing for Chinatown businesses and Downtown of course.

[Coldrsx]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

External ID
315143826-064
Job Type
Major Development Permit
Description
To construct alterations to a Residential development - adding 12 Storeys and 188 Multi-unit Housing Dwellings to the east Tower. The total number of Dwellings is increasing from 504 to 692. This is part of a Mixed Use development with 2 Residential Towers and main floor Indoor Sales and Services Use and a 3rd floor Minor Indoor Entertainment Use (fitness facility).
Applicant
DIALOG
Status
Intake - Payment Required
Class of Permit
Create Date
October 21, 2024
Approval Date
Location
10423 - 101 STREET NW Plan 2321876 Blk A Lot 1
Neighbourhood
DOWNTOWN

[Rocket252]

Originally Posted by feepa

I still feel like the above project is more suitable for outside of the core. This plot of land could be more than this couldn't it? It's adjacent to the warehouse park...

I agree. Bad decision to build such a structure in the core.

Height and density.

[Slide]

Originally Posted by feepa

I still feel like the above project is more suitable for outside of the core. This plot of land could be more than this couldn't it? It's adjacent to the warehouse park...

Agreed, where's the rest of it... and the design looks better suited to sherwood park's festival way than downtown edmonton.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Slide

Agreed, where's the rest of it... and the design looks better suited to sherwood park's festival way than downtown edmonton.

Nailed it.

[Rocket252]

Was it Mandel that said Edmonton should not settle for crap?

That was 2 mayors and what over 10 years ago

[TimB09]

Originally Posted by Rocket252

Was it Mandel that said Edmonton should not settle for crap?

That was 2 mayors and what over 10 years ago

Economics play into it a lot for sure.

So even though mayors can so no more crap, the development community ultimately decides what to build end of the day.

And with an influx of people in Edmonton, housing is needed.

[Coldrsx]

I might argue that the consumer ultimately decides.

[Rocket252]

If I am not mistaken the city sets the standards and zoning for the location- then approves the development permit based on those criteria.

So if the the zoning is incorrect and the standards are not being followed or crap to begin with it’s the cities fault.

[s211]

Originally Posted by Coldrsx

I might argue that the consumer ultimately decides.

Then it's up to a company to decide which sector of the market it wishes to serve.

Dish up something for the lower quartiles and get in and out quickly, or be patient and shoot for something that a company could look back at in 10-20-30+ years with deep civic pride.

I understand it's far more complex a matter than my platitudes, but where would I be without those.

[YegFan]

As someone who does not know much about development, it's a bit confusing that some projects (Station lands, CNIB, Hat, etc...) seem to make things work with higher quality designs while others appear to be subpar citing the economics.

Having said that, as a business owner, I rely on economic data when making decisions. To me, when I look at the following:

- household income (higher than national average)
- disposable income (higher than national average)
- population projections (higher than national average)
- current supply (very limited higher quality in the downtown/central areas)

All of these appear to be positive for a jurisdiction like Edmonton to entice developers to pursue better quality projects.

The question is what is missing?

would appreciate those who know to provide some insights.