Winnipeg Construction X

[Mr Tall Forehead]

Agreed. It seemed Portage turned into more of a traffic funnel when the buses were moved on to Graham.

[OTA in Winnipeg]

Well, those bump outs have to go by July 2025 then. Is that part of the plan? Anyone know?

[bomberjet]

I don't think there are any current plans to remove the bump outs that I know of. Although I don't know if they've specifically listed upgrades anywhere.

Thats quite a lot of work to get done before June with winter and all lol The City did say not everything would be ready for June.

Ultimately, there will be dedicated lanes of some kind on Portage. I think we're wating until then.

[bomberjet]

Based on this map, there are 3 routes along portage. BLUE, then FX7 (purple) and F7 (green) route. So depending upon the number of buses, not sure how much different it will be than the current situation on Portage.
Also looks like Fort street will become very busy with buses with a circuitous connection to Provencher.

https://www.winnipeg.ca/sites/default/files/2024-07/WTMP_2025-APPROVED-System-Map_2024-07-05.pdf

[drew]

^ the current situation on Portage Ave downtown (east bound) during afternoon rush hour is a parking lot. You are literally better off getting off your bus and walking from Memorial to Main. Westbound seems to be smoother.

If they keep the bump outs on Portage, funnel more bus traffic on Portage, this situation can only get worse.

[bomberjet]

Ya I catch the bus at MTS Centre sometimes if the Graham bus is late. Especially in winter, it can be a long wait. Maybe enforcement of a diamond lane can help.

I guess my question is/was. What is the total number of buses now vs new route system that will be on Portage? There may in fact be less buses. Having less routes will make the routes more efficient in terms of full buses. Cram more people onto less buses is basically the plan. Having the articulated buses with the blue route should help.

But ya I agree. If they're just jamming more buses down Portage, something needs to change.

[pegster]

It's hard to know without tracking data and models, but I think people are underestimating how substantial the consolidation of routes is going to be. For example, currently, at Portage and Edmonton (in front of Portage Place), there are 18 westbound bus routes that stop there, and at Graham and Edmonton (behind the Hydro building), another 18 westbound routes. In the new plan, there will be 3 on Portage (albeit at high frequency) and 0 on Graham.

My main concern with moving the busses off Graham and "pedestrianizing" it is that, without a critical mass of foot traffic, it will become a blighted vacuum.

[borkborkbork]

Originally Posted by pegster

My main concern with moving the busses off Graham and "pedestrianizing" it is that, without a critical mass of foot traffic, it will become a blighted vacuum.

Yes. Pedestrian streets only work on streets that are ALREADY lively. Streets that are struggling to begin with tend to be killed by being turned into ped malls.

[bomberjet]

Graham Ave needs to transformed into a tourist type area. At least the portions in the celebration zone. I'd be concerned the area next to the arena and City Place will be turned into an even deeper piss hole than it currently is. It's a concrete tunnel with no street presence.

Plaster it with lights, big screens like times square, etc. Pay to open up the City Place frontage and do something with the blank wall at the arenas. Create a focal point and subsidize it. It will be a long haul either way.

[zalf]

The Short Term Network Plan (PDF warning) shows that buses are only coming off Graham between Carlton and Vaughan at first. The map shows them running along Carlton and Hargrave between Graham and Portage, at least for the time being.

[1ajs]

seen this just pop up on my facebook

[neutroniks]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Graham Ave needs to transformed into a tourist type area. At least the portions in the celebration zone. I'd be concerned the area next to the arena and City Place will be turned into an even deeper piss hole than it currently is. It's a concrete tunnel with no street presence.

Plaster it with lights, big screens like times square, etc. Pay to open up the City Place frontage and do something with the blank wall at the arenas. Create a focal point and subsidize it. It will be a long haul either way.

One can only hope that this will be the plan. True North Square needs to be a catalyst and if the rest of Graham can be as open and welcoming as TNS, then it will be a success. The parking pads need between 300 Main & the arena need to be come a true "Entertainment & Hospitality" part of the SHED otherwise Graham will be literally a shed

Cafes, Patios & Stores!! (Not me beating a dead horse, but yeah.)

[pegster]

Originally Posted by zalf

The Short Term Network Plan (PDF warning) shows that buses are only coming off Graham between Carlton and Vaughan at first. The map shows them running along Carlton and Hargrave between Graham and Portage, at least for the time being.

I believe that map was a proposal from 2021 and is out of date (the city's website is awash in all the variations of this plan). The map council approved this year, which was posted above, only has busses on Graham between Main and Fort.

[pspeid]

^What's happening at the old Nutty Club building?

[WinCitySparky]

That parking lot is part of the 138 Portage development I believe. Addition going there if I recall.

[post_man]

I was surprised to see this lot finally being cleared. It's been empty and overgrown for a long time. Corner of Simcoe and Ellice.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by drew

^ the current situation on Portage Ave downtown (east bound) during afternoon rush hour is a parking lot. You are literally better off getting off your bus and walking from Memorial to Main. Westbound seems to be smoother.

If they keep the bump outs on Portage, funnel more bus traffic on Portage, this situation can only get worse.

When I used to take the bus from my office just off Portage and Main rather than catching it at the closest stop I would literally walk away from the stop to a point closer to home and catch an "earlier" bus on the route. Between opening Portage and Main to pedestrians without a comprehensive traffic plan and now deleting Graham Ave from the bus network I would not be surprised if what I used to do becomes a lot more common to accomplish.

[CoryB]

Originally Posted by neutroniks

One can only hope that this will be the plan. True North Square needs to be a catalyst and if the rest of Graham can be as open and welcoming as TNS, then it will be a success.

True North Square is the worst pedestrian thing to ever happen in downtown Winnipeg.

On a recent rainy day we were heading for lunch to some chicken place on Graham just past True North Square. We take the skywalk there only to find the bridge to the Wawanessa building is "employees only". Seriously? Even the highly secure Hydro Place has an open pedestrian bridge and public access to the ground and second floor.

We make our way from the Liquor Mart down to ground level and exit the door onto the Carlton/Graham corner without issue. Knowing the Liquor Mart is there on the second floor we try to return to the same door we exited on the way back only to find the door was locked. Like how are customers supposed to access the Liquor Mart?

The Liquor Mart issue is potentially easier to solve. I haven't had a chance to look further into the Wawanessa issue though to see how easy it may be for them to add public access.

[neutroniks]

Originally Posted by CoryB

True North Square is the worst pedestrian thing to ever happen in downtown Winnipeg.

On a recent rainy day we were heading for lunch to some chicken place on Graham just past True North Square. We take the skywalk there only to find the bridge to the Wawanessa building is "employees only". Seriously? Even the highly secure Hydro Place has an open pedestrian bridge and public access to the ground and second floor.

We make our way from the Liquor Mart down to ground level and exit the door onto the Carlton/Graham corner without issue. Knowing the Liquor Mart is there on the second floor we try to return to the same door we exited on the way back only to find the door was locked. Like how are customers supposed to access the Liquor Mart?

The Liquor Mart issue is potentially easier to solve. I haven't had a chance to look further into the Wawanessa issue though to see how easy it may be for them to add public access.

Really? I had no idea. That's a pain. When they finally add the skywalk connecting to the Convention Centre, do they just expect people to take the long route and go through City Place? That defeats the whole purpose of the skywalk. You'd think they'd have some portion of it open to public.

The Carlton entrance doesn't make sense either. I've been through those doors when they first opened but maybe they changed it for security purposes if residents were complaining, but even then, you need key card access to reach the residential floors through the elevator. Definitely doesn't sound as inviting as they market it to be.

[zalf]

The public access to the skywalk and LC is by the Hawerchuk statue, under the the LC sign.

The Carlton lobby is for the apartments and the TNSE offices.