WINNIPEG| The Exchange District |Market Lands Redevelopment

[1ajs]

theres also a culture thats grown around the drug use and the only way to realy curve it is to do something very asshole and send a message this is not acceptable being drunks one thing but this is beyond reasonable


ino biking in with scrap should be allowed at thescrap yards
scrap can not be brought in via taxi period

caught dealing meth fentinal u get 10yrs period and if someones found to of died from ur supply 25 to life.

if ur a street person thats got a camp thats kept safe clean and doing nothing wrong but surviving give resources like we do if ur a pig hoarding fire risk come down on them.... if ur cracked out and found that way pick them up they are a danger to them selfs and everyone around them end of story drop em at selkirk for a while assess and figure out who we can help vs whos just broken and will never stop make it not a vacation
yes guna cost money but at this point we need to just spend it

[EdwardTH]

Originally Posted by pspeid

Wab has spoken in the past about not allowing himself personal excuses for continuing on a self-destructive path in his life. I wish he'd speak out on this more, but maybe he doesn't want to sound "preachy"? Nevertheless, I think it's a message that needs to be repeated, IMO.

Wab was also someone who was very well-positioned to stop making excuses and get his shit together, not everyone can replicate that. He had a lot of anger due to cultural baggage but otherwise was somewhat privileged. There's a massive difference between a guy who has anger issues but otherwise has a supportive family, an education and a middle class upbringing, vs somebody who maybe ran away from an abusive home at 14, lived on the street and got into drug use and the drug trade.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

Wab was also someone who was very well-positioned to stop making excuses and get his shit together, not everyone can replicate that. He had a lot of anger due to cultural baggage but otherwise was somewhat privileged. There's a massive difference between a guy who has anger issues but otherwise has a supportive family, an education and a middle class upbringing, vs somebody who maybe ran away from an abusive home at 14, lived on the street and got into drug use and the drug trade.

Granted, everyone has their own set of challenges, and some are much more difficult than others. That being said, the need for people suffering from addictions to recognize they have make the decision to stop abusing themselves and others, I believe, is shared by everyone in that situation.

I'm not suggesting it's easy or simply a matter of "just say no". I think it can take repeated attempts and requires lots of support, but until people make that decision, I can't see changes happening. That's the message I believe has to get out there, from as many sources as possible, so listeners can't dismiss the message based on their perceptions of the messenger.

[borkborkbork]

Originally Posted by pspeid

Granted, everyone has their own set of challenges, and some are much more difficult than others. That being said, the need for people suffering from addictions to recognize they have make the decision to stop abusing themselves and others, I believe, is shared by everyone in that situation.

I'm not suggesting it's easy or simply a matter of "just say no". I think it can take repeated attempts and requires lots of support, but until people make that decision, I can't see changes happening. That's the message I believe has to get out there, from as many sources as possible, so listeners can't dismiss the message based on their perceptions of the messenger.

Here's the thing. What happens when someone hears that message, and doesn't dismiss it? When they recognize that they have to "stop abusing themselves and others"?

In Manitoba, the answer is "go to a RAAM clinic". Except you have to show up an hour+ before they open if you want any chance of being seen. They don't have the funding or staffing to meet actual needs. And then you can wait months for treatment. And longer for sober housing, which is a misnomer because there's open and widespread drug use in River Point and other AFM housing options.

Like we can moralize about it or talk about how to present it. But at the end of the day, what matters is treatment beds and staffing.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by borkborkbork

Here's the thing. What happens when someone hears that message, and doesn't dismiss it? When they recognize that they have to "stop abusing themselves and others"?

In Manitoba, the answer is "go to a RAAM clinic". Except you have to show up an hour+ before they open if you want any chance of being seen. They don't have the funding or staffing to meet actual needs. And then you can wait months for treatment. And longer for sober housing, which is a misnomer because there's open and widespread drug use in River Point and other AFM housing options.

Like we can moralize about it or talk about how to present it. But at the end of the day, what matters is treatment beds and staffing.

Treatment doesn't stop with delivering the message, but it can start with it. Sadly, like you pointed out, as with all medical services, there is a lack of facilities available to meet the demand.

Taking a multi-faceted approach of messaging/treatment/long term supports/limiting supply/prosecution of drug suppliers always seems to be the goal, but one that remains elusive. I wish I were smart enough to offer "the" solution, but I don't have it, other than keep pushing in the direction of helping those in need.

[trueviking]

Originally Posted by borkborkbork

Like we can moralize about it or talk about how to present it. But at the end of the day, what matters is treatment beds and staffing.

I truly don't understand why there isn't an all hands on deck approach happening right now....i get it, we can't kick people out of encampments until we have the systems in place to help them....so why the hell are we not moving as quickly as possible to do that? Why is the first thing the province does is give a quarter of a billion dollars back to people who drive the biggest cars? Imagine the impact that could have had on this problem. How is this not an emergency? Everyone complains but the governments are motionless.

[TimeFadesAway]

Originally Posted by trueviking

I truly don't understand why there isn't an all hands on deck approach happening right now....i get it, we can't kick people out of encampments until we have the systems in place to help them....so why the hell are we not moving as quickly as possible to do that? Why is the first thing the province does is give a quarter of a billion dollars back to people who drive the biggest cars? Imagine the impact that could have had on this problem. How is this not an emergency? Everyone complains but the governments are motionless.

People want the problem to go away but they don't want to pay for it. So the problem remains. There's no public will to put any money towards this.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by TimeFadesAway

People want the problem to go away but they don't want to pay for it. So the problem remains. There's no public will to put any money towards this.

IMO it's going to take a government led by someone who has no plans on being re-elected, plus some wealthy movers and shakers who simply want to make a positive difference in their community.

Spending the money needed to make a recognizable dent in the homeless crisis will probably mean taking money away from other areas. Even public spirited people can get very short sighted when their personal priorities are threatened, no matter how important the issue. Add to this the mean-spirited folks who think every homeless/addicted person "deserves" their condition and you have re-election suicide.

Do we have the people and the will to do it? I'd like to think Wab is more disposed towards dealing with homelessness than his predecessor, but sadly he seems more interested in stalling the gas tax hike at the moment. We're lucky to have a few local movers and shaker who genuinely seem to want to help the issue, but they're also relying on some government partnership to move the process along.

[EdwardTH]

Originally Posted by TimeFadesAway

People want the problem to go away but they don't want to pay for it. So the problem remains. There's no public will to put any money towards this.

I think if you polled the population you'd find a large portion of people actually are happy to pay for it if something gets done. But nobody is accountable. It's not like education or transit where there is one branch of gov't who is responsible. The issue doesn't stick to any one branch, person or party so they can all keep passing the buck.

[Unbending]

[Hecate]

Originally Posted by trueviking

I truly don't understand why there isn't an all hands on deck approach happening right now....i get it, we can't kick people out of encampments until we have the systems in place to help them....so why the hell are we not moving as quickly as possible to do that? Why is the first thing the province does is give a quarter of a billion dollars back to people who drive the biggest cars? Imagine the impact that could have had on this problem. How is this not an emergency? Everyone complains but the governments are motionless.

Then they go and give a ridiculously massive raise to the wealthy teachers driving around those giant cars and SUV’s

While homelessness and addictions problems continue to escalate.

[drew]

^ you got a real hate on for the teachers it seems.

FYI - police, fire fighters and paramedics all make substantially more than teachers, including much more lucrative pension plans and take a massive percentage of the COW's budget.

IMO the only issue with education in Manitoba is the excess amount of school divisions and resulting redundancy in numerous high paying administrative positions. But that's not teachers.

[Hecate]

Originally Posted by drew

^ you got a real hate on for the teachers it seems.

FYI - police, fire fighters and paramedics all make substantially more than teachers, including much more lucrative pension plans and take a massive percentage of the COW's budget.

IMO the only issue with education in Manitoba is the excess amount of school divisions and resulting redundancy in numerous high paying administrative positions. But that's not teachers.

At least police and firefighters work year round. But teachers…Cant stand them.

Yesterday, I taught an 18 year old born and raised in manitoba, what the difference between vegan and vegetarian meant.

This person was accepted into university. We are currently raising some of the dumbest people in Canadian history. Kids are performing worse and worse every year, and we’re giving the people responsible for this decline accolades and rewards.

Do you get raises the worse you perform?

God help us all.

[Mr Tall Forehead]

Originally Posted by drew

^ you got a real hate on for the teachers it seems.

FYI - police, fire fighters and paramedics all make substantially more than teachers, including much more lucrative pension plans and take a massive percentage of the COW's budget.

IMO the only issue with education in Manitoba is the excess amount of school divisions and resulting redundancy in numerous high paying administrative positions. But that's not teachers.

Agree. The excessive amount of school divisions also makes it more likely for wing-nut, single issue fringe candidates to get elected, which we are certainly seeing evidence of these days.

[rivercity]

Yeah, lets blame teachers. What about parents?

[drew]

Originally Posted by Hecate

Yesterday, I taught an 18 year old born and raised in manitoba, what the difference between vegan and vegetarian meant.

This person was accepted into university. We are currently raising some of the dumbest people in Canadian history. Kids are performing worse and worse every year, and we’re giving the people responsible for this decline accolades and rewards.

OK, we are trading anecdotes now.

Yesterday some 18 year old kid born and raised in Manitoba taught me the theory of relativity.

Therefore, we are currently raising some the most intelligent well rounded kids in Canadian history - no - world history!

[EdwardTH]

Originally Posted by Hecate

At least police and firefighters work year round. But teachers…Cant stand them.

Yesterday, I taught an 18 year old born and raised in manitoba, what the difference between vegan and vegetarian meant.

This person was accepted into university. We are currently raising some of the dumbest people in Canadian history. Kids are performing worse and worse every year, and we’re giving the people responsible for this decline accolades and rewards.

Do you get raises the worse you perform?

God help us all.

By that logic are police not accountable for crime getting worse and worse? They're getting even bigger raises than teachers right now while violent crime surges.

[WildCake]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

By that logic are police not accountable for crime getting worse and worse? They're getting even bigger raises than teachers right now while violent crime surges.

Hecate needs to see a professional to talk about why he's feeling so negative towards one specific profession rather than vent about it in an online forum about (checks notes) building and road construction.

[FactaNV]

To get back on track, this construction we're seeing is the apartments and studios right? Is the market hall separate or just the last piece of the puzzle that'll be built after?

[Wpg_Guy]

Originally Posted by FactaNV

To get back on track, this construction we're seeing is the apartments and studios right? Is the market hall separate or just the last piece of the puzzle that'll be built after?

I don’t believe they have the funding in place for the market. It’s definitely a phase 2.