OC Transpo

[LRTeverywhere]

Originally Posted by Uhuniau

They don't improve the passenger experience when the same passengers who once squeezed into a 60-foot diesel artic now squeeze into a 40-foot electric.

Good thing we have 154 60' Battery busses on order then!

[hwy418]

If OC Transpo is so broke that they feel the need to save $1.6M by cutting mid-day and evening service on the LRT, then why are they looking to fund the construction of the $5.5M roundabout in Orleans so they can turn buses around?

A complete rethink is needed at OC Transpo - start at the top and work down a few management levels. I'm tired of hearing about them not meeting their own projections, cry foul about the state of their finances, beg for handouts, then spend money on stupid pet projects.

Wonder how much they're spending on replacing bus flags all over the City for the revised bus service we're about to get...

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by hwy418

If OC Transpo is so broke that they feel the need to save $1.6M by cutting mid-day and evening service on the LRT, then why are they looking to fund the construction of the $5.5M roundabout in Orleans so they can turn buses around?

A complete rethink is needed at OC Transpo - start at the top and work down a few management levels. I'm tired of hearing about them not meeting their own projections, cry foul about the state of their finances, beg for handouts, then spend money on stupid pet projects.

Wonder how much they're spending on replacing bus flags all over the City for the revised bus service we're about to get...

Same way the whole city is broke but we have $400 million for an arena etc,
Just announced today plans to move forward with the $129 Million Byward market plan. Horrible timing almost feels like trolling from city staff.

[Uhuniau]

Originally Posted by hwy418

Wonder how much they're spending on replacing bus flags all over the City for the revised bus service we're about to get...

I'm more curious about the costs of re-covering the new signs to avoid confusion with the old ones until the changeover finally happens.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Same way the whole city is broke but we have $400 million for an arena etc,
Just announced today plans to move forward with the $129 Million Byward market plan. Horrible timing almost feels like trolling from city staff.

To be fair, the complaints are about ongoing operational funding. Delaying capital projects doesn't solve the operational funding problem, it just kicks it down the road and makes it more expensive.

That said, I totally agree with the comments on OC management. They need a complete culture overhaul. I really cannot hear one more OC manager talk substituting "capacity" for "service" and hoping no one understands the difference. They are a service organization that specializes in gaslighting the public.

[lrt's friend]

Also, remember the millions spent on Park n Rides lots that serve little purpose, and are not on rapid transit lines. We cry about money but we make poor investments.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by phil235

To be fair, the complaints are about ongoing operational funding. Delaying capital projects doesn't solve the operational funding problem, it just kicks it down the road and makes it more expensive.

That said, I totally agree with the comments on OC management. They need a complete culture overhaul. I really cannot hear one more OC manager talk substituting "capacity" for "service" and hoping no one understands the difference. They are a service organization that specializes in gaslighting the public.

Well building a roundablout might save X minutes which could be a decent investment but seems doubtful.

We don't need to invest in a new arena at all. I know we might lose it but these are nice to haves not essential.

[phil235]

Originally Posted by YOWetal

Well building a roundablout might save X minutes which could be a decent investment but seems doubtful.

We don't need to invest in a new arena at all. I know we might lose it but these are nice to haves not essential.

Sure, no idea about the roundabout project. But again, cutting capital projects does not solve the operating funding issue, and as a general rule we end up spending more on them later.

As for the arena, I guess it depends on what you call "essential". Sure, we don't need a new arena, but literally hundreds of thousands of people use that facility every year. If we don't invest in those type of facilities, you are looking at a general decline in what the city has to offer and in the quality of life generally. It also means a decline relative to most other cities that have those types of facilities. Over the long term, that makes Ottawa a less attractive place to live, we get less of the best and brightest and that has negative economic impacts.

I don't think it is particularly extravagant to invest in an arena like that once every 60 years.

[Truenorth00]

Sure. Invest in the arena. After they get all the actual priority stuff done. This council's decisions are the equivalent of a homeowner with a roof leak prioritizing a major kitchen makeover.

[J.OT13]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Also, remember the millions spent on Park n Rides lots that serve little purpose, and are not on rapid transit lines. We cry about money but we make poor investments.

Chapel Hill Park and Ride is a doozy. It's not as much that they built it, it's that it's served by two infrequent buses that make a ridiculous detour to Blair, and a rush hour only from Navan, through the PnR to Blair. That park and ride could get some far better usage if buses that serve it were relatively frequent and went straight to Blair. There are some really stupid people deciding routes in this City.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Sure. Invest in the arena. After they get all the actual priority stuff done. This council's decisions are the equivalent of a homeowner with a roof leak prioritizing a major kitchen makeover.

I guess it's like a leaky garage only the wife uses and prioritizing a wet bar in the man cave. Transit just isn't an essential for many. Until you discover without a garage you can't have people over to use the man cave because all the on street parking is full because everyone made the same decision.

[Truenorth00]

🧵 City budgets are about priorities. Ottawa didn’t have a stadium crisis, a road widening crisis nor a police station crisis.

We had transit, affordability and housing crises.

It was @_MarkSutcliffe’s decision to pipeline $2B into stadium, cops, extra lanes & paving marshland.

Quick math to show how bad his spending problem is:

$419M to OSEG
$400M Bruce Coburn extension in Navan
$800M ($100M/yr over 8 years) for road widening
$50M Byward Market cop boardroom
$13.4M annual increase to police budget
$ god knows how much to staff/maintain new chopper

His spending is almost as bad as his mgmt of money coming in.

-2.5% property tax cap
-New deal for Ottawa in March brought $543M & feds might match. Where is this money?
-Refusing “4 unit by right” zoning means he’s putting $176M of fed housing accelerator funding at risk

....

PS: ah yes, who could forget the fact that he raided city reserves once already, depleting them by $227M.

https://x.com/scorn_chip/status/1822995924550926748?t=qVJtJDkE8G600GrqXay62g&s=19

And that's only half the story. During the election, his supposedly hippie opponent warned about the budget challenges. He dismissed them. And they've now proven accurate.

[hwy418]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

also, remember the millions spent on park n rides lots that serve little purpose, and are not on rapid transit lines. We cry about money but we make poor investments.

100%!

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by lrt's friend

Also, remember the millions spent on Park n Rides lots that serve little purpose, and are not on rapid transit lines. We cry about money but we make poor investments.

Gotta pander to those suburbanites.

[lrt's friend]

Originally Posted by J.OT13

Chapel Hill Park and Ride is a doozy. It's not as much that they built it, it's that it's served by two infrequent buses that make a ridiculous detour to Blair, and a rush hour only from Navan, through the PnR to Blair. That park and ride could get some far better usage if buses that serve it were relatively frequent and went straight to Blair. There are some really stupid people deciding routes in this City.

We also built Park n Rides in the south end based on the 2006 plan that we had already cancelled and beyond the Line 2 terminus. A total waste of money which does not enhance transit in the area.

[Truenorth00]

The City of Ottawa website has this chart comparing Ottawa's low property tax increases to other cities (Toronto, Edmonton, Calgary, Vancouver) for 11 years.

I wanted to know, had we just done the average tax increase of those cities each year, what would the budget look like?



So, I did some quick math. If Ottawa had increased taxes at the same average rate of those other cities, over 11 years we would have collected an additional $1.35-billion in property taxes.

This year's budget would have an additional $347-million in revenue.

https://x.com/SjamieIt/status/1823055242331554156

[Ottawacurious]

Ouch. Ty for doing that exercise!

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Ottawacurious

Ouch. Ty for doing that exercise!

Not my work. Just posting the great work of others calling out this BS. Here's another summing all their spending on road expansions:

https://x.com/scorn_chip/status/1823439239284945203/photo/1

$800+M for 13 road expansions over a decade. Ask yourself, if that's value for money. Compared to every other priority. Especially given that they keep complaining how they are broke. Road expansions they can find money for. Transit they can't. That's a choice. Ottawa motorists deserve the traffic congestion that is coming.

[bartlebooth]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

Not my work. Just posting the great work of others calling out this BS. Here's another summing all their spending on road expansions:



https://x.com/scorn_chip/status/1823439239284945203/photo/1

$800+M for 13 road expansions over a decade. Ask yourself, if that's value for money. Compared to every other priority. Especially given that they keep complaining how they are broke. Road expansions they can find money for. Transit they can't. That's a choice. Ottawa motorists deserve the traffic congestion that is coming.

Jesus, that’s enraging. What’s the time frame for that spending?

Edit: Didn’t see that 10 year time frame. Still.

[lrt's friend]

To be fair, many of those roads are only proposals and who knows when they will be built. Furthermore, those areas are also growth areas with increasing tax bases. Infrastructure does need to be built where population is growing fastest.