Downtown Vancouver Updates II

[jollyburger]

Free idea for the Gastown BIA: Move the Steam Clock down where the Gassy Jack statue was and force all the tourists to walk down to the end of Water Street.

Some businesses like Inform have to be realistic and figure out that Gastown isn't the right neighbourhood for them. I bet Filson, Aesop, COS and Le Labo are counting down the days on their lease renewals.

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

So if these businesses are down 30% (in July I assume?) since previous years. Wasn't too clear in the snippit.

"turned three blocks of Water Street in Gastown into a pedestrian-only zone" also this is not true.

It reads like a lobbying piece written as a news article. Journalism-free to the point where simple facts aren't checked.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Indeed. Note how the complaints in the article come from lingerie, framing and interior decorating: businesses that rely on pickup from drivers from across town.

I'd sure like to hear from restaurants, bars and other cruise ship-adjacent tourist traps which the closure is actually supposed to benefit (Old Spaghetti Factory doesn't count, they're kept alive by nostalgia alone).

Yes, lets chase a diversity of businesses from Gastown so it becomes a bar zone. Because that's worked out so well for the stabby Granville Street Vomitarium.

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by csbvan

It reads like a lobbying piece written as a news article. Journalism-free to the point where simple facts aren't checked.

Oh absolutely.

And if anyone thinks I'm exaggerating, here's the pilot plan map:

https://vancouver.ca/files/cov/parki...trian-zone.pdf

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by csbvan

It reads like a lobbying piece written as a news article. Journalism-free to the point where simple facts aren't checked.

Lobbying piece for who exactly? There's three businesses mentioned, all in different fields. Funny that you leap to the conclusion that it is some sort of lobbying rather than just concerned business owners. I dare say somewhere like the Old Spaghetti Factory, that hipsters turn their nose up at, employs more people than a couple vape shops.

And if they're seeing these kind of declines in the peak season it doesn't bode well for the rainy season when they all have to rely on locals.

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Yes, lets chase a diversity of businesses from Gastown so it becomes a bar zone. Because that's worked out so well for the stabby Granville Street Vomitarium.

I've been to Water St a number of times since the street closure and it feels far more safe, with far more people on the street, and far less visible street disorder than it did before. The large increase in pedestrian activity has absolutely made it feel like a safer place to be.

And if certain businesses are leaving Gastown, it is because they were on their way out before the pedestrianization.

It's funny how Kelowna can have a large chunk of its downtown closed for 4 months in the summer, with great success, and yet certain anti-urban curmudgeons in Vancouver act as if it's pie in the sky to do it here. How embarrassing for a major city that these attitudes persist. As if we can't be as vibrant as little Kelowna.

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Lobbying piece for who exactly? There's three businesses mentioned, all in different fields. Funny that you leap to the conclusion that it is some sort of lobbying rather than just concerned business owners. I dare say somewhere like the Old Spaghetti Factory, that hipsters turn their nose up at, employs more people than a couple vape shops.

And if they're seeing these kind of declines in the peak season it doesn't bode well for the rainy season when they all have to rely on locals.

It's written without any fact checking. The article simply regurgitates what a select few business owners said and calls it news, even if there are blatant inaccuracies. How is that not written with an agenda?

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by csbvan

It's written without any fact checking. The article simply regurgitates what a select few business owners said and calls it news, even if there are blatant inaccuracies. How is that not written with an agenda?

What kind of fact checking were you expecting? For the businesses to publish their books to verify what they told the reporter? It's from the Vancouver Sun which even in this era of declining media is still a reputable source. And businesses aren't exactly some hotbed of anti-ABC/Ken Sim sentiment.

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by whatnext

What kind of fact checking were you expecting? For the businesses to publish their books to verify what they told the reporter? It's from the Vancouver Sun which even in this era of declining media is still a reputable source. And businesses aren't exactly some hotbed of anti-ABC/Ken Sim sentiment.

For starters, the opening sentence is incorrect. The story literally leads with a lie! Then it goes on to give a one sided opinion rooted in conjecture from a couple business owners that represent a fraction of the neighbourhood. It's a junk article, c'mon!

And we can agree to disagree on the Vancouver Sun as reputable. I suppose whether you give the VS any weight these days depends on whether you like the musings of Douglas Todd (who else even still writes for them locally?). My opinion on him is rock bottom.

[GenWhy?]

"“If they had to do this experiment, why did they tack it onto the end of us all suffering from three months of road construction?” said Haliburton. “My clients who are local often say they’ve tried to come down, (but) they’ve circled (looking for parking, and then left). They’re not going to come down while this is on.”"

Gastown was gifted to GIANT parkades and people still just look for street parking and give up. Sounds like a skill issue.

The article is full of odd remarks. Like Kimprints still has full car access for pick-ups. Unless they closed Alexander Street too that I'm unaware of.

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by GenWhy?

Oh absolutely.

And if anyone thinks I'm exaggerating, here's the pilot plan map:

https://vancouver.ca/files/cov/parki...trian-zone.pdf

Isn't it three blocks from Carrall to Richards?

[csbvan]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

Isn't it three blocks from Carrall to Richard?

But most of it is car-light, not pedestrian-only. It's basically 2 car free Plazas connected by a car-light stretch of water street.

[jollyburger]

The only way the Gastown pedestrian pilot makes any sense is if they actually hold events or offer the space to associations to activate the space.

[Jimbo604]

Downtown Victoria timed closure of Government Street begins
Pedestrian priority times part of city’s Build Back Victoria program
Victoria News (vicnews.com) Don Descoteau Jun 11, 2021 4:30 PM

"It’s the first day of the City of Victoria’s closure of the street to vehicle traffic in afternoons and evenings, as part of the Build Back Victoria program. The closure is in effect seven days a week from noon to 10 p.m. and is designed to bring more people downtown and support local businesses. ..." Link

Originally Posted by jollyburger

The only way the Gastown pedestrian pilot makes any sense is if they actually hold events or offer the space to associations to activate the space.

True that, they gotta nurture it a fair amount. As we've seen already, a vibrant pedestrian zone just doesn't materialize when cars are removed. In this case at least.

Imho, COV should take note of Victoria's Government St which is pedestrianized during the day but open to traffic at night. It works well from my experiences. This doesn't address all the issues Gastown is experiencing now, but at least recognizes that a full-time pedestrianized street is a dead zone in the evening/night/early morning.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by jollyburger

The only way the Gastown pedestrian pilot makes any sense is if they actually hold events or offer the space to associations to activate the space.

And even that is only going to be effective May-September. Vancouver's issue for outdoor activation is always the long rainy season. People will go to outdoor events on a cold sunny day, but on a 5 C day with rain, not so much.

[BaddieB]

Originally Posted by Jimbo604

but at least recognizes that a full-time pedestrianized street is a dead zone in the evening/night/early morning.

...a non pedestrianized street would be ever more dead in those times.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by whatnext

And even that is only going to be effective May-September. Vancouver's issue for outdoor activation is always the long rainy season. People will go to outdoor events on a cold sunny day, but on a 5 C day with rain, not so much.

It's only intended to be in place in July and August.

[BaddieB]

Originally Posted by whatnext

And even that is only going to be effective May-September. Vancouver's issue for outdoor activation is always the long rainy season. People will go to outdoor events on a cold sunny day, but on a 5 C day with rain, not so much.

Kind of, I think it would make a lot of sense to keep Gastown pedestrian only in the Christmas season and have a Christmas market there.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It's only intended to be in place in July and August.

So they'll make a decision based only on data from what are the two of the driest months and the two busiest months for tourism. That doesn't sound terribly bright.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by whatnext

So they'll make a decision based only on data from what are the two of the driest months and the two busiest months for tourism. That doesn't sound terribly bright.

It was ABC's idea. All the City's webpages related to the project start 'As directed by Council. The motion was submitted by councillor Kirby-Yung, and includes looking at making Water Street car-free or car-light on a seasonal or year-round basis. So this is just the initial test of what could happen.

If you are opposed to a two month trial of a short section being restricted to vehicles, you seem to be suggesting that Water Street should have remained a traffic sewer, with no attempt to change it?