California High Speed Rail Thread

[Busy Bee]

Those "This page intentionally left blank" really add up.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by ardecila

Weirdly Burbank preserved space for the new airport terminal, but allowed a bunch of warehouses to get built where the HSR station will go. So those brand-new warehouses will need to be seized and torn down. I'm sure the warehouse owner will get a big fat payout from CHSRA...

I work for a company whose building is one mile from the end of a runway and outside the airport access road but nevertheless on airport land (and the airport might have even built our building on spec). I was told that we aren't allowed to modify the exterior of the building in any way without airport approval. This includes needing approval to buy benches for people to sit on for breaks...so people just sit on the curb or sit in their cars.

So the point of my post is that airports allowing construction where future things are planned isn't unusual and in fact seems like a business model for our ostensibly non-profit airports.

[numble]

Originally Posted by hughfb3

Whew!!! Looks like even with the phased approach, they will still build the full viaduct across the 101 and for later phases will build out the rest of the tracks.

1626 pages though… that’s way more than the Sepulveda pass transit corridor documents… the bureaucracy of it all.

For apparently procedural reasons, they did not include their value engineering plans in the Draft EIS/Supplemental EIR. There is no draft EIR for the Sepulveda Transit Corridor yet.

[202_Cyclist]

Originally Posted by ardecila

I believe all CAHSR stations will have baggage screening similar to Brightline or the AVE system in Spain. Similar to airport security pre-9/11, so not crazy. If you don't have bags you just walk thru, no 🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵🞵 or shoes BS.

The Burbank HSR station, under the current plan, will be across the street from the NEW Burbank terminal north of the airfield. So you exit the terminal, cross the drop-off road, walk into the HSR station, and descend down to the train platforms. Maybe there will be a skybridge or underground corridor, the plans are not developed yet.

Weirdly Burbank preserved space for the new airport terminal, but allowed a bunch of warehouses to get built where the HSR station will go. So those brand-new warehouses will need to be seized and torn down. I'm sure the warehouse owner will get a big fat payout from CHSRA...

Airports try to maximize their revenue from sources other than landing fees, so as to keep the fees they charge the airlines serving the airport low and make the airports more competitive with surrounding airports. This is especially true with an airport like Burbank that has a sizable Low Cost Carrier (LCC) presence, with Southwest and Avelo having a significant number of flights at the airport. To maximize non-aeronautical revenue, the airport sponsor will look to other sources of revenue (such as development).

At the same time, there are several grant restrictions with federal Airport Improvement Program (AIP) funding, including compatible land-use. This includes ensuring there are no vertical obstructions that could pose a hazard to aircraft next to the airport and restricting noise-sensitive uses adjacent to the airport. If an airport sponsor violates these grant restrictions, they may have to return the federal funding.

21. Compatible Land Use.
"It will take appropriate action, to the extent reasonable, including the adoption of zoning laws, to restrict the use of land adjacent to or in the immediate vicinity of the airport to activities and purposes compatible with normal airport operations, including landing and takeoff of aircraft. In addition, if the project is for noise compatibility program implementation, it will not cause or permit any change in land use, within its jurisdiction, that will reduce its compatibility, with respect to the airport, of the noise compatibility program measures upon which Federal funds have been
expended."

https://www.faa.gov/sites/faa.gov/files/.../assurances-airport-sponsors-2022-05.pdf

[38 Geary]

NEWS RELEASE: California High-Speed Rail Authority Approves Contractor, Moves Design of Track and Overhead Electrical Systems Forward
June 26, 2024

BURBANK, Calif. – In yet another significant step toward getting electrified high-speed trains operating in the U.S., the California High-Speed Rail Authority’s (Authority) Board of Directors today approved a contractor to begin designing track and overhead contact systems (OCS) for the initial 171-mile passenger service connecting Merced to Bakersfield.

After an extensive competitive procurement process, joint venture SYSTRA | TYPSA was awarded the contract with today’s board action. SYSTRA | TYPSA has worked together for more than two decades and partnered with California rail and transit agencies for more than 35 years.

With an initial contract value of up to $131.2 million, this contract will allow the Authority to:
- Produce high-level designs for track and OCS for the 171 miles connecting Merced to Bakersfield, including detailed designs for the 119-mile section currently under active construction within that Central Valley stretch.
- Design the track system, including the track structure, OCS, along-track cable containment, across-track ducts, access walkways, fencing, and drainage.
- Manage technical and non-technical interfaces with contractors/consultants.

https://hsr.ca.gov/2024/06/26/news-relea...and-overhead-electrical-systems-forward/

[craigs]

Despite seismic concerns, last segment of LA to SF high-speed rail line cleared environmentally

Colleen Shalby
Los Angeles Times
June 27, 2024


Rendering of the kind of electrified high-speed rail train California plans to run in the San Joaquin Valley. (California High-Speed Rail Authority)

California’s entire high-speed rail route from Los Angeles to San Francisco has officially been environmentally cleared for construction after the authority’s board of directors voted Thursday to certify the final review of the line’s critical Palmdale to Burbank segment.

Outgoing CEO Brian Kelly said that when adjusted for inflation, the segment would cost nearly $29 billion.

The 38-mile stretch would connect the Antelope Valley to the San Fernando Valley via a roughly 17-minute trip from the Palmdale Transportation Center to the Hollywood Burbank Airport. Trains would run at about 220 miles per hour through four underground tunnels that would pass through the Acton area, Angeles National Forest and the San Gabriel Mountains National Monument. The tunnels, extending from about 12 to 13 miles in length, are intended to avoid impacts on communities and the environment.

“Today’s approval is more than a historic milestone — it closes the gap between Los Angeles and San Francisco,” Authority Board Chair Tom Richards said in a statement.
. . . .

[202_Cyclist]

Plan to connect California’s 2 high-speed rail projects moves forward


By Travis Schlepp
July 9, 2024
KTLA

"A plan to connect California’s two high-speed rail projects via a dedicated corridor in the High Desert is continuing to make progress.

On Monday, members of the High Desert Corridor Joint Powers Agency assembled in Palmdale to sign two landmark labor agreements to advance the project.

Officials signed a Community Workforce Agreement and a Memorandum of Understanding, two contracts that will ensure the project moves forward with skilled union labor constructing, operating and maintaining the 54-mile transit connector..."

https://ktla.com/news/california/plan-to...-high-speed-rail-projects-moves-forward/

[LAsam]

^Makes good sense to do that. The utility of the CAHSR is further expanded with transfers to Vegas in the equation.

[craigs]

The High Desert Corridor makes sense. Southbound passengers intending to transfer to the Brightline from CAHSR will do so at Palmdale, and folks coming from places like the San Fernando Valley would find it easier to drive (or take Metrolink) to Palmdale than Rancho Cucamonga. I could be wrong, but I think the Antelope Valley Line has more robust service than the San Bernardino Line, too.

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by craigs

I could be wrong, but I think the Antelope Valley Line has more robust service than the San Bernardino Line, too.

I think you're right; the San Bernardino Line has higher ridership, but the Antelope Valley Line has more frequent trains.

[mr1138]

Originally Posted by craigs

The High Desert Corridor makes sense. Southbound passengers intending to transfer to the Brightline from CAHSR will do so at Palmdale, and folks coming from places like the San Fernando Valley would find it easier to drive (or take Metrolink) to Palmdale than Rancho Cucamonga. I could be wrong, but I think the Antelope Valley Line has more robust service than the San Bernardino Line, too.

Apologies if this was already covered in the article posted, but if the two systems are connected in Palmdale, then why would anybody need to transfer trains?

I had always assumed that - given cross compatibility between the two systems - Brightline trains would be able to use the CHSR tracks right into LA Union Station, and potentially operate direct routes between Vegas and SF through the central valley in the future as well.

In theory, this shouldn't be any different than European systems, where multiple train operators often use the same government-owned tracks. For example, Eurostar began as just a single route between London and Paris, but eventually began running trains through Belgium north to Amsterdam as well - made possible by the physical connection in Lille. TGV trains often run on ICE track, and vice-versa. When the Brenner Base Tunnel is someday finished, I would also expect that ICE, TrenItalia, and likely Italo trains will all be able use that route from Germany to Italy.

Why would we think that California won't simply lease track and schedule time to Brightline so that they can offer one-seat rides?

[numble]

The plan is for one-seat rides from Union Station to Las Vegas if/when they ever build the section from Union Station to Palmdale.

[TowerDude]

Once the LA Union Station to Rancho Cucamonga CAHSR line has been built it will make more sense for all LA and San Diego region travelers to Vegas go through Rancho and all Northern California visitors to Vegas go through Palmdale.

CAHSR could also create a high speed loop service that goes from Palmdale To Apple Valley to Rancho to Union Station to Burbank and back to Palmdale.

[LAsam]

If you were to wave a magic wand and have all this work completed, we would now live in a world where San Fran, Sacramento, LA, San Diego, and Las Vegas are all connected by HSR. Looking at the map, I struggle to see another city that makes sense to connect to this system via further expansion. Does anyone see the system moving further beyond the existing cities?

[edale]

Originally Posted by LAsam

If you were to wave a magic wand and have all this work completed, we would now live in a world where San Fran, Sacramento, LA, San Diego, and Las Vegas are all connected by HSR. Looking at the map, I struggle to see another city that makes sense to connect to this system via further expansion. Does anyone see the system moving further beyond the existing cities?

It'd be cool to see HSR connect to Palm Springs/Coachella Valley. From there, I guess it could theoretically get extended to Phoenix, but that might be pushing it a bit given the distance and literal nothingness in between the low desert CA cities and Phoenix.

[LAsam]

^ Would be nice to be able to access the Coachella Valley via rail. Probably could be handled via electrification and expansion of Metrolink.

[TWAK]

I think continuing HSR up the Valley Subdivision would be good and service the population centers. It could end in Redding and link up with HSR in Oregon if they ever have plans on doing it for the PNW. Electrifying the other lines that aren't upgraded to HSR would be a good trade-off.
There's the ROW along 5 too, but again the same issue is there's just not as many population centers.

[LAsam]

Originally Posted by TWAK

I think continuing HSR up the Valley Subdivision would be good and service the population centers. It could end in Redding and link up with HSR in Oregon if they ever have plans on doing it for the PNW. Electrifying the other lines that aren't upgraded to HSR would be a good trade-off.
There's the ROW along 5 too, but again the same issue is there's just not as many population centers.

That makes sense. If the PNW were to create a HSR connecting Vancouver to Portland we could eventually link that up with CAHSR.

[mr1138]

Originally Posted by numble

The plan is for one-seat rides from Union Station to Las Vegas if/when they ever build the section from Union Station to Palmdale.

Very cool! Thanks for the information. The last time I checked, the Phase 2 alternatives between LA and San Diego are still very preliminary, but most went near Rancho Cucamonga, so I would imagine they will want to link the two systems there as well when the time comes.

Originally Posted by LAsam

If you were to wave a magic wand and have all this work completed, we would now live in a world where San Fran, Sacramento, LA, San Diego, and Las Vegas are all connected by HSR. Looking at the map, I struggle to see another city that makes sense to connect to this system via further expansion. Does anyone see the system moving further beyond the existing cities?

I recall that way back when Brightline was being planned as DesertXpress, the company was looking at the possibility of Vegas as a HSR hub. The basic concept was that, since ROW acquisition may be easier in the desert, or where the federal gov. owns the land, Vegas is well positioned to offer possible extentions to Phoenix and even SLC. I don't know if this is still Brightline's plan though.

It makes me curious what an LA to Phoenix travel time linking through Vegas would be. A southern route out of San Diego would be more direct, but I bet would have some serious engineering challenges. It's possible Brightline could complete a Vegas to Phoenix link much sooner.

[sammyg]

Originally Posted by LAsam

If you were to wave a magic wand and have all this work completed, we would now live in a world where San Fran, Sacramento, LA, San Diego, and Las Vegas are all connected by HSR. Looking at the map, I struggle to see another city that makes sense to connect to this system via further expansion. Does anyone see the system moving further beyond the existing cities?

HSR to Tahoe/Reno would be fantastic, or as fast as you could get in the mountains. It would require a lot of tunneling.