Transit Fantasies

[GMD]

Originally Posted by Changing City

It has transit - there are trolley buses. In Vancouver, the Skytrain line runs parallel three blocks away, so it's very unlikely to get any other form of transit for decades. There have been thousands of new apartments - rental and condo - built over new retail spaces along Kingsway over the past 15 years since the approval of the Knight and Kingsway Plan in 2004 and the Norquay Plan in 2010. There are at least 10 more projects - mostly rental - approved in the past three years.

The problem isn't housing or transit (although having modestly taller buildings along Kingsway itself would help frame the street, given the width of the road), the main problem is it is a wide road with way too much space given to auto traffic. Probably the most stroad-like of any street in the city of Vancouver. I vote for re-configuring it like Lancaster Blvd in Lancaster CA. Honestly, as a diagonal cutting through the grid and causing congestion, it is probably better to discourage through traffic on it.

[waves]

Reading the posts in the Surrey Skytrain forum have my fantasizing over the switches being re-done at Lougheed so that Millennium Line trains coming from Coquitlam going WB won't have conflict points with EB trains. Are there any examples of track crossovers anywhere in the Skytrain network ("X" crossings - not a switch)? If not, why are they avoided?


Source: https://i.imgur.com/ZwQ0lRS.png


Source: https://i.imgur.com/2c6kh3y.png

[MalcolmTucker]

Cost, when with automation the need for extra capacity wasn’t foreseen in the planning horizon.

[Vantage]

Originally Posted by waves

Are their (sic) any examples of track crossovers anywhere in the Skytrain network ("X" crossings - not a switch)? If not, why are they avoided?

There isn't any on the Expo or Millenium lines. There's three on the Canada Line: south of Waterfront, north of Broadway-City Hall, and north of Oakridge.

I think I heard somewhere that there's one being built on the Broadway extension east of City Hall, I might be misremembering that one though.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Based off the premise that new commuter rail is too expensive - and small ferries too slow - for interprovince transit, I hereby submit the BC ART (Airship Rapid Transit) network for the forum's consideration and/or mockery.

Probably the latter, this has little to no chance of working.

[mcj]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Based off the premise that new commuter rail is too expensive - and small ferries too slow - for interprovince transit, I hereby submit the BC ART (Airship Rapid Transit) network for the forum's consideration and/or mockery.

Probably the latter, this has little to no chance of working.

Based on the figures they give on their website, this runs at an average of ~54 km/h. So all the inconvenience of flying, with about half the speed of a car travelling long distances... (that comparison between Belfast and Liverpool on their website is equivalent to flying from Vancouver to Kelowna, so 270 km in 5 hours and 20 mins! only about the same amount of time an express bus would take!)

Tbh this is basically a Harbour Air map that includes the Lower Mainland burbs and Kamloops/Kelowna. Maybe a public-private-partnership could be arranged

[Vantage]

How feasible is flying airship over terrain like the Coast Mountains? Lots of updrafts and downdrafts, could be quite dangerous, but i'm not an airship pilot.

[Migrant_Coconut]

The arcs are purely aesthetic - the ships would stick to the valleys which should be less windy. It helps that airships have been cleared for helicopter minimum altitudes.

Originally Posted by mcj

Based on the figures they give on their website, this runs at an average of ~54 km/h...

Pfft, that's what I get for taking "top speed of 130 kph" at face value. Time to water it down to a P3 whale watching tour.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

Based off the premise that new commuter rail is too expensive - and small ferries too slow - for interprovince transit, I hereby submit the BC ART...network for the forum's consideration and/or mockery....

I'll give you both: that is a rather impractical idea that I'd absolutely love to ride.

[chowhou]

I feel like we haven't had one of these for a little while.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1I9tcGDKrcnpBhycQnYNXga8_-dvvqoU

Based on information from Translink, the Transport 2050 plans, and public stances of different municipalities, here's my realistic expectation for what the rapid transit network will look like in 2050. I've also put the rough expected year of completion assuming 5-6 year completion times for Skytrain extensions. The routing is my understanding of close to the exact alignment of the lines based on publicly available information or my own educated guess.

The UBC extension, SLS, and Burnaby Mountain gondola, their alignments, and station names seem to all be absolute givens.

The "Purple Line" (here named the Inlet Line) also has strong support from municipalities and Translink but the route has not been determined so I've placed my best guess for the alignment. I've titled it the Inlet Line to provide a neutral but accurate name. "North Shore Line" feels too weighted towards, well, the North Shore since half of the line will be in Burnaby.
I expect it to be built in 2 phases, the first Burrard Inlet crossing phase terminating at Phibbs and Metrotown, and a second later phase terminating at Park Royal.
Station names (Northbound):
Metrotown
Grange
Deer Lake
BCIT-Gourd
Gilmore-Dawson (Gilmore Station to be renamed Gilmore-Dawson)
Burnaby Heights-Hastings
Second Narrows (Potential WCE station)
Phibbs-Mountain Highway
Brooksbank-Park & Tilford
Moodyville
Lower Lonsdale
Bewicke Avenue
Pemberton Avenue
Capilano-Lions Gate
Park Royal-Taylor Way

I'm also guessing at a Port Coquitlam expansion in the next quarter decade (EDIT: century) with two stations:
Westwood-Meadowbrook
Port Coquitlam

Current rapid busses + expected BRT lines are provided for context (R1 is expected to be replaced with the first BRT line and the R2 is expected to become redundant due to the Inlet Line.)

Feel free to leave any thoughts!

[Migrant_Coconut]

There's apparently other Transport 2050 BRTs (page 32):

Phase 1

• Lynn Valley-Downtown (First Narrows)
• Richmond-Metrotown
• Marine Drive Station-22nd

Phase 2

• Park Royal-Commercial Drive
• Scott Road-Carvolth
• Brentwood-New West
• Fleetwood-Newton (152nd)
• Langley-White Rock

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by chowhou

I feel like we haven't had one of these for a little while.

https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1I9tcGDKrcnpBhycQnYNXga8_-dvvqoU
...

I'm also guessing at a Port Coquitlam expansion in the next quarter decade with two stations:
Westwood-Meadowbrook
Port Coquitlam
...
Feel free to leave any thoughts!

I'm curious where the line would go.

After the Westwood station, I could see one closer to downtown Port Coquitlam, then I could see it crossing to the north side of Lougheed Highway west of the rail yard and then to the Dominion Triangle area before crossing the river to Pitt Meadows.
It depends on whether you think the priority is the industrial areas to the south of the rail yard or the north side of Lougheed.

[chowhou]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

There's apparently other Transport 2050 BRTs (page 32):

Phase 1

• Lynn Valley-Downtown (First Narrows)
• Richmond-Metrotown
• Marine Drive Station-22nd

Phase 2

• Park Royal-Commercial Drive
• Scott Road-Carvolth
• Brentwood-New West
• Fleetwood-Newton (152nd)
• Langley-White Rock

Technically those are planned to be RapidBusses not BRT. I only included the current RapidBusses for context but you're right.

[Migrant_Coconut]

I'm guessing Pitt Meadows is literally a bridge too far - put the terminus and a bus loop at Fremont Village, run the R3 from there, call it a day.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by chowhou

....
Phibbs-Mountain Highway
Brooksbank-Park & Tilford
Moodyville
Lower Lonsdale
Bewicke Avenue
Pemberton Avenue
Capilano-Lions Gate
Park Royal-Taylor Way
....

For the North Shore, I'd think it is more likely that those potential stations would simply be named:

• Phibbs Exchange
• Brooksbank
• Moodyville
• Lonsdale (probably Lonsdale Quay realistically)
• Bewicke
• Pemberton
• Capilano
• Park Royal

[Migrant_Coconut]

They could push it off 3rd and closer to Esplanade, to minimize the walking time from the SeaBus.

[Sheba]

Originally Posted by chowhou

The "Purple Line" (here named the Inlet Line) also has strong support from municipalities and Translink but the route has not been determined so I've placed my best guess for the alignment. I've titled it the Inlet Line to provide a neutral but accurate name. "North Shore Line" feels too weighted towards, well, the North Shore since half of the line will be in Burnaby.
I expect it to be built in 2 phases, the first Burrard Inlet crossing phase terminating at Phibbs and Metrotown, and a second later phase terminating at Park Royal.
Station names (Northbound):
Metrotown
Grange
Deer Lake
BCIT-Gourd
Gilmore-Dawson (Gilmore Station to be renamed Gilmore-Dawson)
Burnaby Heights-Hastings
Second Narrows (Potential WCE station)
Phibbs-Mountain Highway

All the images I've seen (inc from Burnaby) show it connecting Metrotown and Brentwood - not Gilmore. My guess for station locations would be:
- Metrotown
- Bond
- Sanderson Way
- Canada Way
- Brentwood

...and then somewhere around Hastings & Willingdon, then Hastings & Boundary / Kootenay and then maybe a station in Burnaby Heights before crossing the water to a Phibbs station. I don't know the North Shore well enough to suggest stations there, other than Lonsdale and Park Royal (no need to go further into West Van).

[officedweller]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

I'm guessing Pitt Meadows is literally a bridge too far - put the terminus and a bus loop at Fremont Village, run the R3 from there, call it a day.

Yeah - not sure what this means (i.e. bus lane, LRT or SkyTrain):

The province says the new Pitt River Bridge has been designed to accommodate future rapid transit.

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/drivers-get-sneak-preview-of-pitt-river-bridge-1.440548

EDIT: Found this:

The bridge accommodates seven lanes of traffic, pedestrians, and cyclists and includes
provision for converting two lanes to light rapid transit or adding an eighth dedicated rapid transit lane to
the bridge and through the site.

https://www.canadianconsultingengineer.com/awards/pdfs/B-5_PittRiverBridge&MaryHill.pdf

Probably moving the pedestran/bike path to the outside of the towers to add the 8th lane.
I think that the highlighted shapes are the pier abuttments (not the towers).

https://www.canadianconsultingengineer.com/awards/pdfs/B-5_PittRiverBridge&MaryHill.pdf

[madog222]

Originally Posted by chowhou

The "Purple Line" (here named the Inlet Line) also has strong support from municipalities and Translink but the route has not been determined so I've placed my best guess for the alignment. I've titled it the Inlet Line to provide a neutral but accurate name. "North Shore Line" feels too weighted towards, well, the North Shore since half of the line will be in Burnaby.
I expect it to be built in 2 phases, the first Burrard Inlet crossing phase terminating at Phibbs and Metrotown, and a second later phase terminating at Park Royal.
…

That’s too many stations, one study that has been done has 10 stations.

My guess for those 10 would be: Metrotown, BCIT, Brentwood, Hastings, Phibbs/Main St, Bainbridge, Lonsdale, Capilano Mall, Norgate, and Park Royal.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by madog222

That’s too many stations, one study that has been done has 10 stations.

My guess for those 10 would be: Metrotown, BCIT, Brentwood, Hastings, Phibbs/Main St, Bainbridge, Lonsdale, Capilano Mall, Norgate, and Park Royal.

Agreed that probably the original schema (with all respect) had too many stations, which could be pared down to the number you suggest. That said, it is critical to have ample bus "feeder" routes to the stations.