Should there be any doubt that LA belongs among the big 6 urban US cities?

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by JManc

I love New York but it is noisy. SF is fairly quiet in comparison which to me is a good thing even if it doesn't sacrifice density and street activity. You're never far from a commercial area but more often than not, you don't have to live above it like a lot of New York.

NYC's noisiness is mostly confined to the major arterials, though. If you're not on a major arterial it will typically be relatively quiet. Most of Manhattan's numbered streets will be fairly quiet between avenues, unless you're in Midtown or on a crosstown route. There are a few commercial areas on non-arterial streets, but that's the exception rather than the rule. I think the vast majority of this is in Manhattan below Houston Street.

SF does have major arterials that are mostly residential (for example), which is not very common in NYC. That does give SF a more "spaced out" feeling than NYC, IMO.

[Crawford]

The key to quiet in noisy parts of NYC is getting a unit in the back of a building. I've lived on major avenues, but as long as your windows face back, it's quiet. I lived right on Broadway near Houston St. in the Village/Soho for two years, which is an extremely noisy corridor 24/7, yet it was still pretty quiet except for muffled sounds of sirens. NYC doesn't have alleys, so if you face the back, you just face the backs of other buildings.

If your unit faces front, you have to get window glazing/inserts and other noise-mitigation tools. Of course if you own the unit, you need to get triple-glazed soundproof window panels, which will work great even if Metallica is giving a concert on the street.

If you aren't on a major avenue, especially outside of Manhattan, it's generally quiet. Our current street is probably quieter in the summer than my parent's street in American suburbia. No constant leaf blowers or lawn mowers.

[iheartthed]

Originally Posted by Crawford

The key to quiet in noisy parts of NYC is getting a unit in the back of a building. I've lived on major avenues, but as long as your windows face back, it's quiet. I lived right on Broadway near Houston St. in the Village/Soho for two years, which is an extremely noisy corridor 24/7, yet it was still pretty quiet except for muffled sounds of sirens. NYC doesn't have alleys, so if you face the back, you just face the backs of other buildings.

If your unit faces front, you have to get window glazing/inserts and other noise-mitigation tools. Of course if you own the unit, you need to get triple-glazed soundproof window panels, which will work great even if Metallica is giving a concert on the street.

Yes, that too if you happen to live on a major commercial street.

Originally Posted by Crawford

If you aren't on a major avenue, especially outside of Manhattan, it's generally quiet. Our current street is probably quieter in the summer than my parent's street in American suburbia. No constant leaf blowers or lawn mowers.

Yep. No lawns to maintain, so none of that machinery noise.

I mostly don't really hear any outside noise until I get to the major arterial. I do live near a bar with a backyard nearby, and it generates a lot of conversational noise on warm weekend nights, but even that mostly sounds like a low hum instead of something jarringly loud. And they're required to close the yard at 11pm. I think the biggest source of noise is actually planes landing at LGA, but that's not unique to NYC.

[Steely Dan]

The reasons why I love living on a "quiet" residential side-street in neighborhood Chicago have very little to do with noise.

Mainly because our block isn't really quiet at all, what with the brown line L roaring down the alley in back of our building every several minutes, and also because our 3-flat is DIRECTLY under the approach path to one of ORD's primary runways. So if I was looking for actual quiet, this would not have been a good home to buy.

But the "side-street" aspect of our block is why I love it so much for family rearing - lots of other kids for my kids to run around with, block parties, social hangouts (both planned and impromptu), etc. it's a very social and somewhat intimate little community that we wouldn't really have if we lived on a main arterial city street like Western or Lawrence. It's super "neighborhoody" and I really like that.

[Segun]

Originally Posted by Crawford

If you aren't on a major avenue, especially outside of Manhattan, it's generally quiet. Our current street is probably quieter in the summer than my parent's street in American suburbia. No constant leaf blowers or lawn mowers.

I felt like Brooklyn felt like home (Chicago) in large sections. Even the narrow streets don't really stand out in my mind. IMO, the North End of Boston is the only place in the US and Canada that feels dense <=> dense like an actual European City. Nobody's going to out-Europa that neighborhood, period. Still, what's sets NYC apart the most are the neighborhoods where multiple subway lines converge: These are areas where you'll find 600 stores in a 4 block radius, with the pedestrian crowdage of a downtown in major "tier 2" cities.

[Quixote]

Originally Posted by JManc

I love New York but it is noisy. SF is fairly quiet in comparison which to me is a good thing even if it doesn't sacrifice density and street activity. You're never far from a commercial area but more often than not, you don't have to live above it like a lot of New York.

Well, it’s all relative. By my definition, there’s generally a fine line between being “quiet” and “sparse.” I think by “quiet” you really mean “low-key.”

UWS Manhattan is probably the best residential urbanism in the U.S. in the sense that it feels quaint and low-key, has every typological scale, and is full of pedestrians because of the density, multitude of subway lines, and developed commercial strips every one or two blocks.

[3rd&Brown]

My apartment in Brooklyn was super quiet. 5th floor (in a 6 floor prewar building), south facing, on the back of the building with tree top views of the Brooklyn Art Museum. It was quite serene tbh. The only thing I'd hear occassionally were ambulance sirens or kids playing in the spring months when I would leave the windows open.

Now in Philly I live right on the river. I'm not far from 95 but I don't hear it. My new noises are tug boat whistles, wind (I never really realized how much windier rivers were even compared to 2-3 blocks inland), and the rumble of cargo vessels...which feel like freight trains when they go by. I love the latter because I can usually feel the cargo vessels before I see them...so if I want a really cool sight I'll just pop out to my roof deck to catch a glipse of a massive ship a few minutes after I start to hear the rumble.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by eschaton

2. The wood rowhouse zones, like Charlestown, the inner part of South Boston, and the inner part of East Boston.

3. The triple-decker zone, which encompasses most of the late 19th/early 20th century city.

And by "wood" you mean aluminum/vinyl siding.

[jmecklenborg]

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

"quiet"

The noise level in Manhattan can be unbelievable. I recall staying in a un-air conditioned youth hostel in Midtown, meaning we had to keep the windows open, and being awoken every morning around 3am by garbage trucks. Then again at 7am by jackhammers.

I am a windows-open-all-summer person but intentionally had to stay away from the "squealing train wheels" in Cincinnati. One of the country's biggest railroad yards is right in the middle of the city. The wheel sound is caused by the retarders on the hump yard. You can't hear the wheels at ground level but if you're up on the hills, the sound of the wheels goes on for hours every night. Somehow the sound even goes over the top of the hills and can be heard even when you don't have a direct line-of-sight.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Cincin...2!4d-84.5120196!16zL20vMDFzbm0?entry=ttu

[JManc]

Originally Posted by Quixote

Well, it’s all relative. By my definition, there’s generally a fine line between being “quiet” and “sparse.” I think by “quiet” you really mean “low-key.”

UWS Manhattan is probably the best residential urbanism in the U.S. in the sense that it feels quaint and low-key, has every typological scale, and is full of pedestrians because of the density, multitude of subway lines, and developed commercial strips every one or two blocks.

Quiet as in a lack of sustained noises; heavy traffic, music, people shouting, sirens, jack hammers, buses, garbage trucks, etc. While not the middle of nowhere quiet, the UWS to me is fairly quiet for a dense active urban area is much of the SF neighborhoods I was referring to.

I know the term has changed meaning but “low-key" (to me) to means more of a vibe than actual noise levels which certainly could apply the UWS and SF as well.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by Segun

IMO, the North End of Boston is the only place in the US and Canada that feels dense <=> dense like an actual European City.

Yeah, the scale of north end Boston is pretty damn rarified in the US. I've never been anywhere else quite like it in our country.

[shappy]

Originally Posted by Segun

IMO, the North End of Boston is the only place in the US and Canada that feels dense <=> dense like an actual European City. Nobody's going to out-Europa that neighborhood, period.

North End is tighter in form and more fine grained but I think old Montreal has a much more European aesthetic overall. Old Montreal is more refined looking with the stone architecture and detailed facades, grand public squares/spaces (Place d'Armes, Place Jaques Cartier, area in front of the old market). Foot traffic in the summer months is also intense. The Paul Revere mall is surrounded by the backs of nearby buildings and is not as impressive. Terminating vistas in old Montreal are generally much nicer as well which is a very European aesthetic.

Boston tips the scales considerably when it comes to residential though. Nothing like Beacon Hill in Montreal for example. And the central residential areas of Boston are incredibly layered, dense and attractive. Montreal has some very impressive streets (sometimes just sections of streets) but nothing at that scale.

[Nouvellecosse]

Central parts of Quebec City (Old walled-city and lower town) seemed pretty European to me as well. More than Old Montreal in fact. I've never been to Boston, but based on streetview it doesn't seem any more European than old QC. They both have the narrow, winding streets but N.end Boston has a lot more brick which I associate more with NA while QC has mostly stone. Particularly lighter grey and beige stone which don't tend to be as common over here. In the parts of NA I've been to we have more dark stone like sandstone.

It probably depends on the era and region of Europe you're comparing too. After all, it's an entire continent with some significant differences between regions.

[shappy]

Yeah, you're probably right - QC probably even more so than Montreal. But both moreso than Boston.

[Crawford]

North End is very tight and fine grained, but not sure it's an outlier. Beacon Hill, and neighborhoods in NYC and Philly, have similar scale.

Beacon Hill-
https://www.google.com/maps/@42.358847,-...A2JwPCV2fpw!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

Central Village, NYC-
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7299132,...3aLvxTQgeEg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

West Village, NYC-
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.7319261,...Ow595KvC7Lg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192?entry=ttu

I actually think Beacon Hill has the best scale in Boston, but it's just the southern part around Louisburg Square. It's a few blocks, but damn good blocks.

[Segun]

In NYC you'll find buildings from different eras, including high-rises, scattered within colonial, European-esque neighborhoods. Said areas are usually hemmed in or dissected by big, wide American-sized, traffic-funneling streets. Old Montreal has the design, but it's most prominent on one street, and it isn't quite mid-rise. The French Quarter is larger than people give it credit for, but it's gridded, and the buildings aren't mid-rises either. The North End is the perfect combination of size, scale and consistency. The North End feels like it could be dropped somewhere in Rome, and the only difference would be that the buildings are colonial style architecture.

[Docere]

The "old world" of Boston's North End:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KlNAYCcxgUw

[gochujang]

Originally Posted by mrnyc

i vastly prefer living above it and any noise vs having to get your coat and all that to go down the block to the high street.

What's a coat?

[sopas ej]

Originally Posted by gochujang

What's a coat?

Coat = 코트

[gochujang]

Originally Posted by sopas ej

Coat = 코트

Thank you, but I am not Korean I just like the stuff.