Winnipeg Jets

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Jets lose again 5 to 3 to Vegas and attendance only 11521. Even jets 1.0 were around 12.5 or 13.5 most nights. Looks like will be a very long year.

Something has broken. Or perhaps, this is the true size of the market which can support NHL hockey; which will not be good for the long term future of the team.

The poor attendance is being noticed by the national media such as TSN; the Jets players notice it; as do the visiting players.

In the end, perhaps Winnipeg is just too small of a market and income levels are too low to support Tier-1 level pro sports. Likely Quebec City would have the same issues; though their market catchment area is larger than Winnipeg and they can play the card of being the Quebecois(e) team. Realistically, the only market to support another team in Canada is the GTA.

[thurmas]

We seem to be doing the worst but other markets are struggling too. Washington ended their sell out streak. Calgary Buffalo and San Jose having rough attendance. The games are just too expensive and you can enjoy it as well if not better from home these days.

[bomberjet]

What they do in other arenas. Vegas for example puts on a huge show. Winnipeg turns the lights low and puts a video on the jumbotron. Then Winnipeg gets a guy on the microphone to yell at you.

[EdwardTH]

Originally Posted by drew

I spent somewhere in the neighbourhood of $20k on season tickets (12 seasons in a group of 4 people sharing 2 seats). I think that gives me (and others like me) the right to gripe, even if it's for seemingly trivial reasons.

Maybe I came off the wrong way but I'm not trying to dump on season ticket holders for complaining, just genuinely trying to learn what kinds of things they could do to improve the fan experience.

[drew]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

Maybe I came off the wrong way but I'm not trying to dump on season ticket holders for complaining, just genuinely trying to learn what kinds of things they could do to improve the fan experience.

You should work for TNSE, because right now, they should be scrambling to figure this same information out.

There isn't one magic bullet. It's just been a slow burn of eroding season ticket support, especially since covid.

[optimusREIM]

Originally Posted by drew

You should work for TNSE, because right now, they should be scrambling to figure this same information out.

There isn't one magic bullet. It's just been a slow burn of eroding season ticket support, especially since covid.

Covid was a major turning point, but attendance was tailing off slightly just prior to covid.

I think there are a multitude of factors at play. Obviously disposable income being one, but someone mentioned the weak business community support. I don't know if that's because tax rules have changed making these sorts of things not a tax write-off, or if the market is truly that weak. I don't know. It seems across the board people generally don't go out as much.

[wags_in_the_peg]

great discussion happening on Twitter from "Joe Daley's Sports", over 125 comments. many say yes "yelling from in-house announcer" but also, beer & food $. However there quite a few complaints over safety outside arena. Zombies string out on drugs scare people, violent or not, it's fact.

hire more security or police for walking patrols for more than directing traffic and advertise it, wonder if that would help?

[thurmas]

When jets returned in 2011 I naively thought all these pubs and restaurants and maybe night clubs would open up nearby but never happened its such a dead zone outside of the building. Add on the terrible in game experience and ridiculous food and bev prices why would people wanna go.

[EdwardTH]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Even jets 1.0 were around 12.5 or 13.5 most nights.

Yeah that was when you could get good seats for $35. I punched it into the inflation calculator and that should be $63 today - what's the average now, $130? And they're not even that high compared to the rest of the league. I know everyone wants to dump on the city all the time but maybe we should be proud of the 11k crowds. Winnipeggers are drawing a line with a league that has sucked out every penny it can and priced regular folks out across the board.

Originally Posted by optimusREIM

I don't know. It seems across the board people generally don't go out as much.

This really is a thing. I go to a park or for a walk and the only people out and about are speaking Ukrainian, it's been like that all year. We have a couple of them at work who have talked about the cultural difference, mainly, Europeans go out and DO stuff in the evenings. I hope those people get to go home some day, but if/when they do our city is really gonna be a ghost town. Winnipeggers just seem to want to sit on their couches all day every day.

[thebasketballgeek]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

This really is a thing. I go to a park or for a walk and the only people out and about are speaking Ukrainian, it's been like that all year. We have a couple of them at work who have talked about the cultural difference, mainly, Europeans go out and DO stuff in the evenings. I hope those people get to go home some day, but if/when they do our city is really gonna be a ghost town. Winnipeggers just seem to want to sit on their couches all day every day.

Not just Europeans. Asians also go out after dinner almost religiously for their evening walks when I lived in Waverley West. I would know because my mom did it every day. Hell because my part of Bridgwater was heavily Chinese I would see a large workout full of elders every morning at the park. Are you telling me other neighborhoods in Winnipeg are just empty, desolate parks in the evening and morning times?

North American culture is so depressing. Just come back from work, eat dinner, watch TV, maybe walk your dog or clean a bit, and then sleep while praying for the weekend to arrive ASAP. What a boring life…

[Jammon]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

Yeah that was when you could get good seats for $35. I punched it into the inflation calculator and that should be $63 today - what's the average now, $130? And they're not even that high compared to the rest of the league. I know everyone wants to dump on the city all the time but maybe we should be proud of the 11k crowds. Winnipeggers are drawing a line with a league that has sucked out every penny it can and priced regular folks out across the board.



This really is a thing. I go to a park or for a walk and the only people out and about are speaking Ukrainian, it's been like that all year. We have a couple of them at work who have talked about the cultural difference, mainly, Europeans go out and DO stuff in the evenings. I hope those people get to go home some day, but if/when they do our city is really gonna be a ghost town. Winnipeggers just seem to want to sit on their couches all day every day.

I wholeheartedly agree. I know people who get free tickets to Jets games and give them away or don't use them because they prefer to watch at home.

The Jets have lost season ticket holders and the corporate community. And it's solely because of the way they have been treated. This is all on TNSE. They are the only ones who can accept the blame for how sour things have turned.

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by EdwardTH

Yeah that was when you could get good seats for $35. I punched it into the inflation calculator and that should be $63 today - what's the average now, $130? And they're not even that high compared to the rest of the league. I know everyone wants to dump on the city all the time but maybe we should be proud of the 11k crowds. Winnipeggers are drawing a line with a league that has sucked out every penny it can and priced regular folks out across the board.

Great comments overall and I think this one really hits the mark. I really think the Jets are a great asset to the city, but there comes a point where the price of keeping a civic amenity can become prohibitive. Sadly, if the Jets do price themselves out of this market, the media, especially in larger centres, will most likely focus on the "failure" the Winnipeg market. The narrative of the "little guy" (or in this case, the small market) able to compete with the big cities is largely embraced only by other small markets.

[Wpg_Guy]

True North has a lot of other revenue streams that makes jets 1.0 incomparable. Owning the building being the largest difference, I wouldn’t worry too much about low attendance, for now.

[pegcityboy]

I think this Jet attendance situation has to be put in some perspective, Jets sold out for 11 years and sold out all playoff games, and after three games at home this year the sky is falling and we are moving the team, Ottawa somewhat because of Eugene Melnyk was getting crowds under 10,000 right before Covid and sold out their opener this year , and the second game they had 5000 empty seats. It happens. I share 4 P3s tickets since the Jets have come back and I do think True North were arrogant and had the feeling you should be happy you have season tickets to see NHL hockey and kinda took their season-ticket holders for granted which they have to try to repair, for their loyalty season ticket holders should get more benefits than we do, ( Adam Lowry recipe and BBQ apron doesn’t cut it ) add in Covid and people finding other things to do, inflation and ticket prices and concessions going up and up and people not satisfied with team performance and you have the perfect storm that has to be reversed and all the parties involved , True North , Season Ticket Holders , Business community has to work together on fixing . It is definitely fixable as sellouts every game for years is because we are a passionate hockey city and all those people who didn’t renew haven’t moved away , True North just has to find a way to get those people back and get the excitement back of having a NHL team in this market . They have an advisory committee now made up of season ticket holders which is a good start to bridge the gap between ownership and season ticket holders .

[pspeid]

Originally Posted by pegcityboy

They have an advisory committee now made up of season ticket holders which is a good start to bridge the gap between ownership and season ticket holders .

From the sounds of it this is a good step.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by Ozabald

Something has broken. Or perhaps, this is the true size of the market which can support NHL hockey; which will not be good for the long term future of the team.

In 2011, things were different. The ticket prices and concessions were far cheaper. The dollar was on par. Attendance problems only started after COVID, and TNSE has been brutal in terms of game day experience and customer service. This creates a perfect storm for loss of interest in going to Jets games.

Winnipeg in itself, has grown from 745,000 in 2011 to 900,000 today, which is a higher growth than most metro areas in North America.

Likely Quebec City would have the same issues; though their market catchment area is larger than Winnipeg and they can play the card of being the Quebecois(e) team. Realistically, the only market to support another team in Canada is the GTA.

This is simply not true. Winnipeg has outpaced Quebec City in population growth for the past 15 years, and now has nearly 40,000 more people than Quebec. Additionally, there were numerous studies conducted in the 80s/90s in the aftermath of Saskatoon buying the St.Louis Blues in 1983 (the NHL vetoed the sale, and took control of the team temporarily).

It was found that very few (1% of ticket holders) were from outside the Winnipeg CMA area. There was a notion that people all over Saskatchewan would attend the Saskatoon Blues games, however market research had proven this false for games on weekdays (the majority of games).

It was the same for Quebec. if we were looking at 100km radius, I have no doubt that Quebec would have more people than Winnipeg, but the problem is that only 150-200 people would make the journey outside the CMA. As for being a "Quebecois" team, this would work against the Nordiques. One of the reasons the NHL was leery of the group trying to bring back the Nordiques, was that he was an admitted separatist. It should be noted that one of the reason people dreaded playing in Quebec in the 80s and 90s, was of the language barrier. Since that time, there was far fewer French Canadians in the NHL.

Also of note, around 2011, a research group had determined that Canada could support up to 11 teams (Quebec City, Hamilton, GTA 2, and a second team in the Montreal area). This is no longer the case. It's probable that Toronto could probably support two NHL teams, but good luck convincing the Leafs to share their territory with a new team, unless they are given well north of one Billion dollars in territory fees.

[BlackDog204]

Originally Posted by thurmas

When jets returned in 2011 I naively thought all these pubs and restaurants and maybe night clubs would open up nearby but never happened its such a dead zone outside of the building. Add on the terrible in game experience and ridiculous food and bev prices why would people wanna go.

This was never going to happen, since the area around the arena is a dead zone, with very few residential units. It's very similar to Edmonton, which has not seen an explosion of night clubs or restaurants since the new arena opened in 2016.

[Oilkountry]

Winnipeg.....we need to talk.

11K fans for a game is unacceptable, No matter how "meh" this team is. I understand chipman's unwavering loyalty to players and staff is an issue. I understand tickets are too expensive. But go back to 1996. "save our jets" should ring in your ears like the "true north chant" did in 2011. This stand off with the fans isnt cute. Oilers fans stuck with the team through the worst 2 decades hockey had ever seen. rexall stayed full. Youre not even close to that now. You have a playoff calibre team.

You wont get a 3rd kick at the can. You're not Atlanta. Go find a group of 5-10 Couples and buy season tickets, if 1000 groups did that all would be righted. Make a date night with your partner out of it. Ask your boss why they aren't advertising with the Jets. Don't sit back and watch this team move for the last time. Don't try and put out the fire after its blazing. The Jets are the lifeblood of the city without them winnipeg is just a bigger Regina.

Take action before its needed

[thurmas]

Originally Posted by Oilkountry

Winnipeg.....we need to talk.

11K fans for a game is unacceptable, No matter how "meh" this team is. I understand chipman's unwavering loyalty to players and staff is an issue. I understand tickets are too expensive. But go back to 1996. "save our jets" should ring in your ears like the "true north chant" did in 2011. This stand off with the fans isnt cute. Oilers fans stuck with the team through the worst 2 decades hockey had ever seen. rexall stayed full. Youre not even close to that now. You have a playoff calibre team.

You wont get a 3rd kick at the can. You're not Atlanta. Go find a group of 5-10 Couples and buy season tickets, if 1000 groups did that all would be righted. Make a date night with your partner out of it. Ask your boss why they aren't advertising with the Jets. Don't sit back and watch this team move for the last time. Don't try and put out the fire after its blazing. The Jets are the lifeblood of the city without them winnipeg is just a bigger Regina.

Take action before its needed

Sorry but feeding ones family is way more important than feeding millionaire hockey players who don't want to be here. If the team leaves then so be it. the economics of the game make it a sport now only for corporate big shots no one else. Maybe you should get your priorities reassessed to waste thousands of your hard earned dollars every year on millionaires who don't care about you ou your ciy that's pretty sad. Long live the CFL league of the common man!

[Oilkountry]

Originally Posted by thurmas

Sorry but feeding ones family is way more important than feeding millionaire hockey players who don't want to be here. If the team leaves then so be it. the economics of the game make it a sport now only for corporate big shots no one else. Maybe you should get your priorities reassessed to waste thousands of your hard earned dollars every year on millionaires who don't care about you ou your ciy that's pretty sad. Long live the CFL league of the common man!

that's how you feel. Youre entitled to that, I think it Would hurt a lot of people if the team moved. What i'm saying is if 10 couple's shared season tickets it would be 1800 a year for 2 seats. Thats alot more manageable