Highways in Canada

[MonctonRad]

I concur with the above.

Also, if you look "ethnic", you might actually have a harder time with US border entry personnel than you would traversing the small towns of NW Ontario.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I concur with the above.

Also, if you look "ethnic", you might actually have a harder time with US border entry personnel than you would traversing the small towns of NW Ontario.

That's an excellent point too. It's a common gripe/observation from friends of mine who "look ethnic". And it can happen when crossing into Canada just as it can when crossing into the US, BTW.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by Latté Olé

I doing a cross Canada drive in october and i an try to figure out what is the best route.
People I talk to say drive avoid northern Ontario, they do not have a very good record of indigenous rights and I look minority, so I go through Michigan and Wisconsin. I probably take border crossing at Sault Saint Marie and enter Canada again at Saskatchewan. I noticed that even though Saskatchewan does not have extra laned highways from there border but they have just as many border crossings into the United States as Ontario. Ontario has ten times as much people. Also there are only one border crossing between Thunder Bay and Sarnia Ontario. That a really long distance without land border crossings
I hope border crossing Sault Saint Marie not to busy, Saskatchewan I no worry.

In other words, trust us. Stay on ON-17 all the way.
I’m ethnic minority too and I did my drive from Winnipeg to Ottawa via (MB-1 and) ON-17 in April 2017 just fine.

And yes, before then, when I tried to cross from North Dakota to Manitoba via Emerson at 1:48 AM(!), the border looked at me like, “WTH”.

[VANRIDERFAN]

I have driven that route many times. Both north of Superior and through UP Michigan/Wisc/Minnesota/North Dakota.

Both routes have their pluses and minuses. If you don't have to be in a rush the route along the north shore of Superior is absolutely stunning and you should be in the middle of fall colours which will make it even better. Traffic will not be too bad and a lot of the highway in Ontario has been recently resurfaced.

If you decide to duck through the states then your best bet is to cross at Sault St Marie and then take the Highway 2 west. You will have some 4 lane highway around Duluth Minnesota but you won't reach a continuous 4 lane until Bemidji Minn.

There are numerous border crossings once you get west of Duluth but the most convenient one for you will be Pembina/Emerson crossing south of Winnipeg. You'll turn north on the I-29 at Grand Forks ND and then PTH 75 once you cross into Manitoba. If you want to stay on 4 lanes for the rest of your trip (I'm assuming you are going to the West Coast?) you'll head up to Winnipeg and then take the TCH west from there.

If you decide to stay in the US your next 4 lane highway heading north will be at Coutts crossing on the Montana/Alberta border. If you decide to stay on Highway 2 make sure you stop at Teddy Roosevelt National Park, its amazing.

Good luck, enjoy the trip. You'll be just fine.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by Latté Olé

I doing a cross Canada drive in october and i an try to figure out what is the best route.
People I talk to say drive avoid northern Ontario, they do not have a very good record of indigenous rights and I look minority, so I go through Michigan and Wisconsin. I probably take border crossing at Sault Saint Marie and enter Canada again at Saskatchewan. I noticed that even though Saskatchewan does not have extra laned highways from there border but they have just as many border crossings into the United States as Ontario. Ontario has ten times as much people. Also there are only one border crossing between Thunder Bay and Sarnia Ontario. That a really long distance without land border crossings
I hope border crossing Sault Saint Marie not to busy, Saskatchewan I no worry.

I live in Northern Ontario and can definitely say that you should drive through here. There has been a lot of recent immigration here so many people working in gas stations, restaurants and stores are minorities and most are from India although there are quite a few from other Asian countries and some from African ones. Northern Michigan and Wisconsin don't have very many non-white people although most people there are quite nice.

Out of curiosity, what background are you from?

Ontario doesn't have many border crossing because all of the crossings involve bridges across rivers. There is a very short distance of land border with Minnesota but it's in a remote area.

The scenery along the North shore of Lake Superior is by far much nicer than going through the U.S. to get to Manitoba. And West of Lake Superior has lots of nice lakes along Hwy 17.

[ScreamingViking]

Originally Posted by Latté Olé

I doing a cross Canada drive in october and i an try to figure out what is the best route.
People I talk to say drive avoid northern Ontario, they do not have a very good record of indigenous rights and I look minority, so I go through Michigan and Wisconsin. I probably take border crossing at Sault Saint Marie and enter Canada again at Saskatchewan. I noticed that even though Saskatchewan does not have extra laned highways from there border but they have just as many border crossings into the United States as Ontario. Ontario has ten times as much people. Also there are only one border crossing between Thunder Bay and Sarnia Ontario. That a really long distance without land border crossings
I hope border crossing Sault Saint Marie not to busy, Saskatchewan I no worry.

I think you'll miss much rugged beauty if you don't drive around Lake Superior in Ontario on Hwy 17. And I'm basing this solely on photos I've seen! I've yet to do that drive... been as far as Sault Ste. Marie but that's it (I do want to take that route, and maybe a circuit around Lake Superior coming back via the U.S.)

And I also wouldn't worry much about extra lanes... some of my favourite drives are on back roads and 2-lane highways. To me, this is not a drive I'd do in a hurry but maybe you need to account for time.

Ontario's geography prevents it from having more border crossings to the U.S. ... those big lakes happen to be located where most of the population resides, as well as many of the major highways. Lake Superior, and Lake Huron/Georgian Bay are the reason there is only one border crossing between Thunder Bay and Sarnia.

[ScreamingViking]

I've driven to the Maritimes (south of the St. Lawrence in Quebec, and down the eastern coast of NB, across PEI, and through parts of NS before returning via Maine, New Hampshire, Vermont and Upstate NY) but a drive west has remained a dream-trip for me. I aim to make it happen!

[jamincan]

Originally Posted by Latté Olé

I noticed that even though Saskatchewan does not have extra laned highways from there border but they have just as many border crossings into the United States as Ontario. Ontario has ten times as much people. Also there are only one border crossing between Thunder Bay and Sarnia Ontario. That a really long distance without land border crossings

I'm a bit perplexed about this - where exactly are they going to squeeze another land border crossing between Thunder Bay (Pigeon River) and Sarnia?

[Innsertnamehere]

Yea - Ontario's border is not a land border like Saskatchewan - it's kind of hard to build a border crossing here. I mean the new one in Windsor getting built right now costs literally $4 billion.. It's almost like the border being a large river, great lake, or critical shipping channel makes it tough to have little single-lane border crossings where a handful of cars cross a day.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by jamincan

I'm a bit perplexed about this - where exactly are they going to squeeze another land border crossing between Thunder Bay (Pigeon River) and Sarnia?

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Yea - Ontario's border is not a land border like Saskatchewan - it's kind of hard to build a border crossing here. I mean the new one in Windsor getting built right now costs literally $4 billion.. It's almost like the border being a large river, great lake, or critical shipping channel makes it tough to have little single-lane border crossings where a handful of cars cross a day.

Maybe a note for @Latté Olé is that Canada is very unambitious when it comes to grand infrastructures, unlike countries in other parts of the world.

Ps: That said, some states did propose a crossing over Lake Erie(!) towards London back in the 70s.

Ps2: A direct link from end of Don Valley Parkway in Downtown Toronto to Queen Elizabeth Way at Ontario Highway 405 will be nice, but Gardiner Expressway and Queen Elizabeth Way around Lake Ontario have to be hopelessly congested in order for the Ministry of Transportation of Ontario to even start considering something this ambitious…

[Taeolas]

Apparently in a different timeline, they decided to build a highway bridge across Lake Ontario to Toronto in our era (2020's). (from where I'm not sure but it was implied to be the US). But Time Travelling Romulan Saboteurs blew it up as it was being opened. (Ref: Star Trek: Strange New Worlds).

As far as the real world goes, when I was looking at our highway network during the COVID times, I was surprised that New Brunswick has more land crossing with Maine than it has with Quebec, PEI (bridge) and Nova Scotia combined. And I'm pretty sure we almost have more land crossings than all the prairies it seems. It's probably a side effect of how closely tied the Maritimes and New England were in the pre-car days, before Confederation happened and Ontario decided to suck everything in and killed the coastal trade networks with New England. I remember looking at the Border crossing list for some reason during covid, and seeing a long list of NB border crossings closed or whatnot.... and then the list of crossings along the 49th being sparse in comparison, which boggled my mind as much as realizing NB only has 3 crossings into Quebec, (The TCH, one at Campbellton and one on the Madawaska Panhandle) and maybe 3 into Nova Scotia (the TCH and 2 small access roads that are barely paved from what I can tell)

[Dengler Avenue]

Are there technically 1 or 2 crossings by Edmundston Airport between Quebec and New Brunswick? In other words, do we count that service road (Old Route 2 - l’Ancienne Route 185) or nah?

[VANRIDERFAN]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

And I'm pretty sure we almost have more land crossings than all the prairies it seems.

Nope. NB has 16 crossings into Maine.

Prairies - total of 34

MB - 16
SK - 12
ab - 6

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Are there technically 1 or 2 crossings by Edmundston Airport between Quebec and New Brunswick? In other words, do we count that service road (Old Route 2 - l’Ancienne Route 185) or nah?

I think it should.

I ate at the Irving Big Stop right on the border there earlier this month!

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Are there technically 1 or 2 crossings by Edmundston Airport between Quebec and New Brunswick? In other words, do we count that service road (Old Route 2 - l’Ancienne Route 185) or nah?

I think as far as the Government was concerned for COVID purposes, it didn't count. They only gave crossing counts for 3 locations into Quebec IIRC. Though looking at Google Maps it technically would be a 4th crossing that's parallel to the TCH.

For Nova Scotia, there's the TCH, a small road relatively close to the TCH, and the Tidnish road near the Northumberland Strait end of the Isthmus.

And checking the wiki page on border crossings, there are more than I had seen before, which makes sense; but New Brunswick still has a lot of crossings compared to the prairies and even BC.

[Acajack]

Quebec has a ton of small border crossings with the US mostly on or near the 45th parallel east-southeast of Montreal.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

For Nova Scotia, there's the TCH, a small road relatively close to the TCH, and the Tidnish road near the Northumberland Strait end of the Isthmus.

That border crossing between NB/NS at Mount Whatley (the one close to the TCH at Aulac) almost shouldn't count.

I drove this road once (just exploring), and, it was heavily rutted and potholed. The bridge across the Missaguash River there is a one lane wooden structure, ready to collapse. When I got home from my drive, I discovered one of my front tires was low with a nail sticking out of it. I blamed it on the bridge.

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

Apparently in a different timeline, they decided to build a highway bridge across Lake Ontario to Toronto in our era (2020's). (from where I'm not sure but it was implied to be the US). But Time Travelling Romulan Saboteurs blew it up as it was being opened. (Ref: Star Trek: Strange New Worlds).

As far as the real world goes, when I was looking at our highway network during the COVID times, I was surprised that New Brunswick has more land crossing with Maine than it has with Quebec, PEI (bridge) and Nova Scotia combined. And I'm pretty sure we almost have more land crossings than all the prairies it seems. It's probably a side effect of how closely tied the Maritimes and New England were in the pre-car days, before Confederation happened and Ontario decided to suck everything in and killed the coastal trade networks with New England. I remember looking at the Border crossing list for some reason during covid, and seeing a long list of NB border crossings closed or whatnot.... and then the list of crossings along the 49th being sparse in comparison, which boggled my mind as much as realizing NB only has 3 crossings into Quebec, (The TCH, one at Campbellton and one on the Madawaska Panhandle) and maybe 3 into Nova Scotia (the TCH and 2 small access roads that are barely paved from what I can tell)

I have read that there was a US proposal in the 70s to extend I-71 north from Cleveland across Lake Erie and connecting to the 401 between Chatham and London. The plan included a causeway for crossing Lake Erie.

I forget which newspaper archive I found this in but it was a real proposal. It obviously never got anywhere.

[Tvisforme]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

....It's almost like the border being a large river, great lake, or critical shipping channel makes it tough to have little single-lane border crossings where a handful of cars cross a day.

Originally Posted by Taeolas

....New Brunswick still has a lot of crossings compared to the prairies and even BC.

Geography (obviously) makes a huge difference; here in BC, there are many more road connections with the US then there are with Alberta.

[Ozabald]

Originally Posted by Tvisforme

Geography (obviously) makes a huge difference; here in BC, there are many more road connections with the US then there are with Alberta.

BC has three crossings with Alaska; there's five border crossings in the Lower Mainland alone; six if one includes Ross Lake/Hozomeen.