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  #17041  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 12:40 PM
Fading Isle Fading Isle is offline
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My review of the grand full (partial) re-re-re-re-opening of the Confederation Line coming from Blair. It was very crowded, especially when it got to Hurdman, and very very slow. There seemed to be less grinding on the turns, which were all painted orange (presumably to see wear patterns more clearly?). Lots of people still choosing to take the faster R1 Express from Blair.

Last edited by Fading Isle; Aug 14, 2023 at 2:09 PM.
     
     
  #17042  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 1:09 PM
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Service on full Confederation Line resumed Monday morning

Staff Reporter, Ottawa Citizen
Published Aug 13, 2023 • Last updated 2 hours ago • 2 minute read


It was confirmed Sunday evening that LRT service would resume on the full Confederation Line on Monday at 5 a.m.

Trains began to run again from Tunney’s Pasture Station to Blair Station for the first time in 28 days.

The Confederation Line was shut down July 17 after an inspection revealed a wheel axle assembly on one train had too much play in it and was leaking grease. All 45 of the city’s fleet of Alstom Citadis trains had to be inspected. In a memo to council Sunday, transit general manager Renée Amilcar said wheel hub assembly replacements by Rideau Transit Group had been completed on 28 trains.

Meanwhile, restraining rails installed at 16 sections of curving track had to be laboriously moved by millimetres during the shutdown to ensure they didn’t come in contact with train wheels. The restraining rails are used as a safety measure should a train derail on a curve, but they have also been blamed for causing premature wear and tear on the trains’ wheel assemblies.

Amilcar, who had expressed optimism Friday about the Monday return to service on the full line, said Sunday that RTG had completed repositioning of the restraining rails at the 16 locations, and that testing had been “successfully conducted over the weekend to confirm the work and the system’s readiness to safely welcome customers.”

In a news release, the City of Ottawa outlined what customers could expect when service resumed Monday.

“Line 1 service will operate with 11 single-car trains providing service every five minutes during peak periods in the morning, and 13 cars providing service every four minutes during the afternoon peak,” the city said. “During off-peak hours, nine single-car trains will provide service every six minutes. R1, R1 Express, and Para R1 service will continue to operate in parallel with O-Train Line 1 service.”

The city stated that further updates on R1 replacement bus service would come at a later time.

“Single-car trains will only use half the platform,” the city stated. “Customers should board in the designated section of the platform. Floor decals have been installed at stations to guide customers to the boarding zones.”

It said OC Transpo staff would remain at stations to provide directions and support to customers.

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...l-indeed-resume-monday-morning-city-says
     
     
  #17043  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 1:26 PM
skyscraperaccount skyscraperaccount is offline
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"successfully conducted over the weekend to confirm the work and the system’s readiness to safely welcome customers.”


So...why half trains if the system is now 'safe'.
     
     
  #17044  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 1:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skyscraperaccount View Post
"successfully conducted over the weekend to confirm the work and the system’s readiness to safely welcome customers.”


So...why half trains if the system is now 'safe'.
My guess is they have only replaced the wheel bearings on half of the trains.
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  #17045  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 2:30 PM
Richard Eade Richard Eade is offline
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There are likely a few reasons:
  • The current number of passengers does not warrant double trains. (So why add wear and tear on vehicles when it is not necessary?)
  • Not all vehicles have had their wheel-assemblies replaced. (Although, there are enough for 14 double-car trains, so far.)
  • And, probably the main one; If leading and trailing wheel-assemblies need to be replaced every 60,000 km, running double-car trains would double the number of replacements needed – doubling the cost and maintenance required. (Remember, it is the leading and trailing wheel-assemblies of each VEHICLE used in the train, not just two wheel-assemblies of the entire train.)
     
     
  #17046  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 3:33 PM
Richard Eade Richard Eade is offline
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I commented that I did not think that the work on the restraining rails had been completed, as OC Transpo stated. My opinion is that ALL of the work will not be completed until ALL of the restraining rails are in their proper places - including the ones that have temporarily been removed around the curve east of Rideau Station. OCCheetos replied:
Quote:
Originally Posted by OCCheetos View Post
Question: does this really matter or indicate anything? In context, OC Transpo was referring to work that needed to be completed ahead of resuming service. Clearly, the restraining rail at Rideau has not been an obstacle to resuming service because trains are already operating across that track.

I really think you're just arguing semantics on this point.

. . .

In any case, your comments would be so much more helpful if you ever provided actual sources for the information that you're posting.
Your response suggests that I am arguing the word “complete”. That is only partially true. I do not consider the work to be “complete” if we are waiting for a safety feature to be reinstalled. However, the more important point is that there is still a safety feature to be installed, therefore the work is not yet “complete”.

Oh, and I have referenced it before, but some might have missed it:
[From the August 7, 2023 CTVnews article: https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/partial-lrt-se...m-tunney-s-pasture-to-uottawa-1.6509627]
Quote:
There will also be a temporary speed reduction in the tunnel near Rideau Station. RTM general manager Enrique Martinez Asensio said it was due to needing new brackets for the restraining rail in that part of the track. For the time being, those restraining rails have been removed and the speed reduction has been put in place.

Asensio says since the location of the track in question is close to the station, he does not anticipate any service interruptions because trains approaching the station would already be braking. The restraining rail in that area will be replaced when new brackets to hold it arrive in the next week to 10 days, he explained.
Hmmm. Does removing the safety equipment really matter? Clearly, as OCCheetos points out, it has not stopped OC Transpo from running the train around that curve.

Well, maybe this analogy can help explain my position: You have a car with a TAKATA-made airbag in it, and you get a letter saying that the vehicle has been recalled because of that airbag. However, the letter continues, the company does not have any replacement airbags at the moment, so you should visit the dealer (as soon as possible) to have the current airbag disabled until it can be replaced in a couple of weeks.

Crazy analogy, you say? Let’s look and see:
  • There is a low probability that you will get into a car accident that requires the airbag to deploy before it is replaced;
    There is a low probability (we think) that the train will derail on that curve before the restraining rail is replaced.
  • If something catastrophic does occur, there is a low chance that you, or anyone else, will be killed because of the airbag;
    A slow-speed derailment would likely not result in fatalities.
  • The safety feature of your car will return after a short period;
    The restraining rail will be replaced once the new brackets arrive.
My opinion is that SAFETY MATTERS. You might have a different opinion. I would not be driving the car anywhere except to the appointment to have the airbag replaced.

In the above, I mentioned that the possibility of a derailment around that curve was low. But that is just a guess. Since the restraining rail has previously been installed, any time the high wheels started to climb, the restraining rail would have prevented further sideways movement. Thus, we really don’t know if a derailment is a low possibility or not on that particular curve. There hasn't been a derailment there, but there has always been a restraining rail to prevent one.

But the train is now restricted to just 15 KPH around that curve. Slow speed is no guarantee that there will not be a derailment. There have been a number of derailments within the MSF yard. As I understand it, there are no restraining rails within the MSF, and the speeds are very slow.

[From the August 7, 2023 CBC article: https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/confederation-line-partial-service-tuesday-1.6929820]

Quote:
The trains will be subject to a temporary speed restriction of just 15 km/h near Rideau station, though Rideau Transit Group general manager Enrique Martinez Asensio said that will have no impact on operations as trains would already be braking at that location anyway.
     
     
  #17047  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 5:35 PM
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Are the temporary speed reductions really temporary or only until we forget about them and get used to the slow service?
     
     
  #17048  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 5:40 PM
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Originally Posted by acottawa View Post
Yes, that is correct. The bill was already 2.1 billion when McGuinty offered 600M. This is in contrast to the province paying 100 percent of projects in Toronto and 300M of the 800M cost of the Waterloo LRT.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/ontario-offers-600m-for-ottawa-light-rail-1.798676
And at least for Toronto, any cost overruns, of course, are also covered by Queens Park. When Stage 2 came in at $1B over (1/3 costlier than estimated), no one offered to help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Eade View Post
There are likely a few reasons:
  • The current number of passengers does not warrant double trains. (So why add wear and tear on vehicles when it is not necessary?)
  • Not all vehicles have had their wheel-assemblies replaced. (Although, there are enough for 14 double-car trains, so far.)
  • And, probably the main one; If leading and trailing wheel-assemblies need to be replaced every 60,000 km, running double-car trains would double the number of replacements needed – doubling the cost and maintenance required. (Remember, it is the leading and trailing wheel-assemblies of each VEHICLE used in the train, not just two wheel-assemblies of the entire train.)
We'll know more about possible parallel R1 later today, but yeah, I suspect OC and the City sees "success" in transit as crush loads, like we had pre-pandemic. That said, single cars also means fewer km per car over time, which saves on replacing parts that fail pre-maturely.

Plan was initially to run singles evenings and weekends, but that never happened due to coupler issues.
     
     
  #17049  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 5:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
Plan was initially to run singles evenings and weekends, but that never happened due to coupler issues.
Solving those coupler issues would go a long way towards reducing in service time and increasing out of service time for maintenance.
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  #17050  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 6:28 PM
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Originally Posted by roger1818 View Post
Solving those coupler issues would go a long way towards reducing in service time and increasing out of service time for maintenance.
Not understanding why it's so complicated. Running singles, at least on weekends and holidays, would go a long way. As long as they double them up again for big weekend events (Bluesfest, Canada Day, Sens if they move).
     
     
  #17051  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 7:55 PM
skyscraperaccount skyscraperaccount is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard Eade View Post
There are likely a few reasons:
  • The current number of passengers does not warrant double trains. (So why add wear and tear on vehicles when it is not necessary?)
  • Not all vehicles have had their wheel-assemblies replaced. (Although, there are enough for 14 double-car trains, so far.)
  • And, probably the main one; If leading and trailing wheel-assemblies need to be replaced every 60,000 km, running double-car trains would double the number of replacements needed – doubling the cost and maintenance required. (Remember, it is the leading and trailing wheel-assemblies of each VEHICLE used in the train, not just two wheel-assemblies of the entire train.)
Because this service is suffering from a huge lack of confidence in their ability to provide what was paid for. The optics of running half trains vs returning to proper availability of public transit continues to put OC is a poor light and continues to lose them customers due to lack of reliability.

Regarding your last point...is the city on the hook for maintenance cost or is RTG? My understanding was its RTG ?
     
     
  #17052  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 7:56 PM
sseguin sseguin is offline
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Even running mid day from like 9:30am-2:30pm would help reduce wear and tear. They should be doing all they can to limit and reduce usage regardless of having a wheel bearing problem.
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  #17053  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 9:53 PM
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OC Transpo launches 'Shuttle Express' buses as LRT returns to service
"This service will be in addition to Line 1 service and will offer our customers an additional travel option during the busiest commuting times."

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Aug 14, 2023 • Last updated 1 hour ago • 4 minute read


Ottawa’s LRT system returned to full line service Monday between Tunney’s Pasture and Blair stations, the first time in four weeks that the city’s costly Confederation Line has done what it’s supposed to do — or at least most of what it’s supposed to do.

Transit General Manager Renée Amilcar said single-car service will continue, with a train available every four to five minutes during peak periods and every six minutes in off-peak hours and on weekends. And while R1 replacement bus service ends Tuesday, a new bus service called Shuttle Express will operate during peak periods.

Shuttle Express launches Tuesday with morning runs downtown from Tunney’s Pasture and Blair stations, and afternoon express runs from downtown to Tunney’s and Blair. The buses will run every 10 minutes.

“This service will be in addition to Line 1 service and will offer our customers an additional travel option during the busiest commuting times,” Amilcar said in a briefing to city council Monday afternoon.

“This will be a service to customers during the busiest times of the day because they asked for it,” Amilcar said.

The morning express will run from 6:30 a.m. to 9 a.m. with westbound buses from Blair delivering passengers to the Mackenzie King Bridge and Albert Street. Eastbound buses will take passengers from Tunney’s to the Mackenzie King Bridge via Slater Street. Afternoon service will run from the same routes in reverse between 3 p.m. and 6 p.m.

With current traffic volumes, the east express bus between Blair and downtown would actually be about five minutes faster than the train, OC Transpo’s director of operations, Troy Charter, told reporters Monday. Less time is saved in the west because the express only bypasses two stations between Tunney’s and downtown.

“For customers in the west, they’re probably better off staying on the train,” Charter said. “But we want to give customers options.”

When the fall schedule begins on Aug. 27, OC Transpo will use 13 single-car trains to operate four-minute service at peak power and five-minute service during off-peak hours and on weekends. The Shuttle Express will continue in the fall, Amilcar said.

“I’m hoping that passenger travel will be high in the fall and if that happens we will consider bringing back double train service during peak periods,” she said.

By running single trains, OC Transpo hopes to reduce wear and tear on the Alstom Citadis light-rail vehicles, which have to be regularly inspected and have two of their five axle assemblies replaced after 60,000 kilometres of travel. Under normal use, that’s about every six months, Amilcar said.

“We could easily today use double cars, but we want to be able to maintain this level of service with this new (inspection) routine in place,” Amilcar said.

“It’s a good opportunity because the ridership is not there right now and the system is designed to operate with either single or double cars.”

Meanwhile, commuters got to ride the train for the first time in nearly a month Monday.

Ashlin Bailey is a daily LRT commuter who said using the R1 bus when the train was down added about an hour to her daily commute to and from her afternoon job in the east end. On Monday, Bailey was happy to be riding the train again with a seat to herself and room to breathe.

“The shuttle buses were filled to the brim and you’d have to wait for three of them to go past before you could finally get on,” Bailey said.

The LRT “is down a lot, then it seems like it’ll run for a week before it’s down again,” she said.

About 40 people hopped on and off an eastbound train over the noon hour on Monday. The return run to the west, between Blair and uOttawa stations, was a little more crowded, but the single-car train was far from full on its journey — which slows at each bend in the track because of mandatory speed restrictions. On the tight curve east of Rideau Station, the train travelled a little faster than a quick jogging pace.

“This has been so frustrating,” said Mila Guluyeva, who was heading home from downtown Monday afternoon, a trip she makes every other day.

“The buses are so crowded,” she said. “It’s been very disappointing.”

Programmer Jackson Schoenermarck said he’s lucky that he can usually work from home, with just occasional visits to his Blair Road workplace. Using the R1 replacement buses added an hour to the trip, each way.

“When (the LRT) works it’s good, but when they need to use the buses it’s absolute mayhem,” he said.

“It’s not even the crowding. The buses have to go right through downtown and all the traffic. And then you’re adding more buses and that makes the traffic even worse.”

https://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-new...-express-buses-as-lrt-returns-to-service
     
     
  #17054  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 10:12 PM
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Ha! Continuing to use single car trains with the fall schedule is telling, with the universities about to open and running the trains at jogging pace on all curves. What a crap system we have built.
     
     
  #17055  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 10:31 PM
skyscraperaccount skyscraperaccount is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocketphish View Post
OC Transpo launches 'Shuttle Express' buses as LRT returns to service
"This service will be in addition to Line 1 service and will offer our customers an additional travel option during the busiest commuting times."

Blair Crawford, Ottawa Citizen
Published Aug 14, 2023 • Last updated 1 hour ago • 4 minute read


Ottawa’s LRT system returned to full line service Monday between Tunney’s Pasture and Blair stations, the first time in four weeks that the city’s costly Confederation Line has done what it’s supposed to do — or at least most of what it’s supposed to do.

Transit General Manager Renée Amilcar said single-car service will continue, with a train available every four to five minutes during peak periods and every six minutes in off-peak hours and on weekends. And while R1 replacement bus service ends Tuesday, a new bus service called Shuttle Express will operate during peak periods.
I was watching the Cyrville camera around 9:30 to 10 today...it was 8 minute service...

edit: also...wtf is every 4 to 5 minutes...its one train line and they can't be precise to the second? Thats a 25% variance in your train service.

Last edited by skyscraperaccount; Aug 14, 2023 at 11:09 PM.
     
     
  #17056  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 10:53 PM
Andrew_G Andrew_G is offline
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Originally Posted by sseguin View Post
Even running mid day from like 9:30am-2:30pm would help reduce wear and tear. They should be doing all they can to limit and reduce usage regardless of having a wheel bearing problem.
I have to strongly disagree. They should be doing all they can to ensure speedy, frequent, consistent service - NOT what is most convenient for RTG/RTMs maintenance schedule. It is mind boggling to me that worrying about mileage is even a point of consideration right now. We paid $2.1 billion for the system to be put to use, not for trains to sit in the yard. This city continues to view a train struggling from point A to point B as "mission success". Then we wonder why ridership is what it is.
     
     
  #17057  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 11:09 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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Originally Posted by skyscraperaccount View Post
I was watching the Cyrville camera around 9:30 to 10 today...it was 8 minute service...
just checked

westbound 6:47 pm, 6:53, 7:00, 7:07
eastbound 6:50 pm, 6:58, 7:07
     
     
  #17058  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 11:14 PM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
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Originally Posted by Andrew_G View Post
I have to strongly disagree. They should be doing all they can to ensure speedy, frequent, consistent service - NOT what is most convenient for RTG/RTMs maintenance schedule. It is mind boggling to me that worrying about mileage is even a point of consideration right now. We paid $2.1 billion for the system to be put to use, not for trains to sit in the yard. This city continues to view a train struggling from point A to point B as "mission success". Then we wonder why ridership is what it is.
[sarcasm] We could run trains only in peak periods to save wear and tear on the rail infrastructure and save costs of running trains. At the present time, buses could easily do the job in off peak hours. [end sarcasm] Then I look down the river to Montreal.
     
     
  #17059  
Old Posted Aug 14, 2023, 11:14 PM
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Originally Posted by lrt's friend View Post
just checked

westbound 6:47 pm, 6:53, 7:00, 7:07
eastbound 6:50 pm, 6:58, 7:07
There'd be riots if there were any customers. I don't understand why a separated LRT system has variance in arrival times...like thats basic functionality. But good on them hitting the 6 minute mark one time in your sample, and presumably not killing anyone today
     
     
  #17060  
Old Posted Aug 15, 2023, 1:03 AM
Truenorth00 Truenorth00 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Andrew_G View Post
I have to strongly disagree. They should be doing all they can to ensure speedy, frequent, consistent service - NOT what is most convenient for RTG/RTMs maintenance schedule. It is mind boggling to me that worrying about mileage is even a point of consideration right now. We paid $2.1 billion for the system to be put to use, not for trains to sit in the yard. This city continues to view a train struggling from point A to point B as "mission success". Then we wonder why ridership is what it is.
Yep. Not only is it single LRV. It's running 5-7 mins off-peak. That's a massive cut in capacity anyway. This is RTG's problem. They can eat the cost of the wheels and axles. It's getting ridiculous that after getting a P3, they get coddled. The entire point of a P3 is that they get the profits and the risk. What are they getting paid for?
     
     
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