Calgary International Airport II

[J-D]

Originally Posted by YYCguys

Maybe this is old news, but I was passing through A concourse today and KLM was celebrating their first Dreamliner arrival/departure at YYC today. Too bad I couldn't get a snap of it as I was in a hurry. Would have loved to see it myself! But everyone was so excited!

I was on the incoming flight and we had no celebration

Flight was fine, though.

[cyeg66]

Originally Posted by J-D

I was on the incoming flight and we had no celebration

Flight was fine, though.

I was told at least ten times by mgmt, supervisor, co-workers, tower, and the previous sector to land KLM on 35L... They must think I'm really incompetent. . Anywho, how did you like your flight over the airport and then over downtown? Thought I'd give you a nonstandard view while flying in...
Let the games begin with the official opening of the IFP today. I'm working in an hour. It'll be neat to see planes taxiing from the expanded apron, affecting taxi times, etc.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by cyeg66

I was told at least ten times by mgmt, supervisor, co-workers, tower, and the previous sector to land KLM on 35L... They must think I'm really incompetent. . Anywho, how did you like your flight over the airport and then over downtown? Thought I'd give you a nonstandard view while flying in...
Let the games begin with the official opening of the IFP today. I'm working in an hour. It'll be neat to see planes taxiing from the expanded apron, affecting taxi times, etc.

Oh man you ticked off at least one spotter yesterday, he was all set up and ready for 35R. Better stay away from Calgary for a while...

Did they give you a reason as to why they wanted 35L?

[CalgaryCheese]

Known (but exciting) news that the new terminal is finally open!

[Bigtime]

Yup, lots of activity on the YYC twitter account showing pictures and celebrations as the first flights from different airlines head off.

[*Stardust*]

I don't usually visit this thread much, so excuse me if this has been discussed before. Does anybody know if Air Canada has implemented wifi yet on their international flights? I'm flying to Australia soon and I would love to have connectivity on such a long flight. Thanks!

[J-D]

Originally Posted by cyeg66

I was told at least ten times by mgmt, supervisor, co-workers, tower, and the previous sector to land KLM on 35L... They must think I'm really incompetent. . Anywho, how did you like your flight over the airport and then over downtown? Thought I'd give you a nonstandard view while flying in...
Let the games begin with the official opening of the IFP today. I'm working in an hour. It'll be neat to see planes taxiing from the expanded apron, affecting taxi times, etc.

I thought it was a pretty unusual flight pattern but thought it might be wind related to be honest with you!

[yyc_engineer]

Originally Posted by CalgaryCheese

Known (but exciting) news that the new terminal is finally open!

Yep, it's open! First time I've gotten to an airport at 4am when I am not actually flying anywhere lol! Well worth it though..wouldn't have missed the opening for the world!

It's surreal to see planes parked at and real passengers in the terminal.

[cyeg66]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Oh man you ticked off at least one spotter yesterday, he was all set up and ready for 35R. Better stay away from Calgary for a while...

Did they give you a reason as to why they wanted 35L?

Does this spotter's handle rhyme with Figtime?
My (educated) guess is YYC had some photogs strategically in place on 35L. The B789 sure is purty, especially compared to the stubby -8.

[Bigtime]

Nope, I've been lazy and haven't been out at all this year. It does look like YYC had local photog Neil Zeller in place for 35L, as they tweeted out his shot of the arrival right away yesterday.

He commented it was stressful to make sure he got the shot, I replied that real avgeek stress was getting the Antonov 225 and not blowing the shots.

[Tobuz]

Interesting watching opening morning unfold over the Twitterverse . . . there’s been lots and lots of social media traffic from passengers.

For the most part, it looks like opening day is going really, really well. A great day!

Interesting to see what the hiccups are on opening day . . . there seem to be four happening:


Call to Gate: It’s clearly confusing people. Numerous tweets complaining about the lack of seating at the gates.

And a few photos have even been tweeted showing people (and quite a few of them!) sitting on the floor around the gates as they wait for their flights – ouch. Seeing users of a space do that would indicate a design flaw.

https://twitter.com/thetylerrichard/status/793087274254757888




CATSA Plus: Some negative comments, i.e. “really bad idea” to have my bins – with my valuables – all go through the xray without the owner, and without all of an individual’s bins traveling together. (But also a positive comment giving kudos to the automated delivery system bringing empty bins to the front of the line.)

Water bottle refilling: Yes, a few comments about it. It’s 2016. Liquids haven’t been able to go through security since just post 9/11 … 15 years ago. Yet there’s nowhere evident to fill a reusable bottle.

US departures backlogs: It looks like there are some hiccups there – not sure if it’s an opening morning breakdown, or a bigger systems or design issue . . . but there are some complaints of long lines to get through to U.S. departures. (From the posts, it’s unclear if the issue is CATSA Security or U.S. Customs.) One photo of the line up to get to E departures, and it looks somewhat similar (sadly) to the nasty CATSA lines at concourse A.



https://twitter.com/dannierob/status/793139195162206208



The big ongoing question will be Call To Gate. In my mind, it was the biggest design gamble here – and I think it’s going to be a tough go for YYC. If people keep heading straight to gates, and keep sitting on floors there, it's going to be a poor experience for a lot of YYC's customers.

• Most of the world doesn’t use it, and few travelers have ever even experienced it. Therefore, it just won't be intuitive for travelers . . . meaning it will confuse people, and people will instinctively look for workarounds. (And please, YYC, don't try to fix it by putting up a bunch of explanatory signs.)
• A CTG system makes sense when designing for the pre-board waiting experience. Have folks congregate in a central plaza, and that plaza can offer more amenities and a great experience, but . . .
• CTG was designed before pay-for-checked-baggage, and before HD-seating on planes. Those lead to anxiety for most travelers (even in premium cabins) over bin space for carry-on items. So unlike when CTG was created, there’s now substantial anxiety about getting on the plane quickly. I don’t think your average North American traveler will feel comfortable not being at the gate ahead of time.

They’ll need to make CTG work, as it’s embedded in the building’s design. But I’m not sure how they’re going to take what seems to be a confusing system and make it easy/intuitive for every passenger!?

[CrossedTheTracks]

Originally Posted by Tobuz

They’ll need to make CTG work, as it’s embedded in the building’s design. But I’m not sure how they’re going to take what seems to be a confusing system and make it easy/intuitive for every passenger!?

I think there's two separate issues: confusion & anxiety.

Confusion is fixable -- both naturally over time, and, yes, with more signs. Put some screens up just pre-security so people can read them while they wait. Unless there's zero line-up (hahaha), you have people's attention. Use it.

Anxiety... I dunno, we'll see. I'm trying to keep an open mind on the system, but struggling! I probably won't have a chance to see it in person until April, can't wait!

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Acey

AC also not bothering with call to gate. FRA and LHR will be next to each other on 78 and 74. Probably always.

Call to gate has never been implemented for airline operations systems. Once YYC Airport transmits the gate assignments, the airlines are free to post the data on their internal and external systems.

United airlines got their gate assignments overnight and promptly displayed the gate assignments on their website, app, and updated the mobile board passes for their app users. I check my UA app last night and the morning flights did not have a gate assigned. Checking early this morning and I got the gate assignments for the whole day.

UA app has worked in this fashion for both LHR T2 and FRA, both airports use call to gate.

Westjet appears to be running gate assignments on a daily update basis and updating their external systems (app, website, etc.) on a real time basis.

[outoftheice]

Originally Posted by Tobuz

Interesting watching opening morning unfold over the Twitterverse . . . there’s been lots and lots of social media traffic from passengers.

Browsing through the airport's twitter feed this morning it looks like things can be summed up into two general themes:

1. People who are seeing images of the terminal have glowing things to say about it.
2. People who are actually using the terminal today have extremely negative things to say about the call to gate system, the CATSA plus system and a lack of water fountains.

So essentially the two biggest elements of change that YYC decided to introduce with the new terminal that most posters on here with frequent flyer experience predicted would be fails are proving to be fails. Looks like the airport may have gambled and lost in terms of passenger experience (*although I do acknowledge this is the first day of operations. Still, the complaints people are having are the same complaints I've heard about every airport using a call to gate system and about the CATSA plus trial they implemented in YYZ terminal 3... I don't see people's reactions improving over time as both systems ignore basic travel habits: people... especially those with kids, the elderly and the mobility challenged... want to be close to their gate and people don't like the idea of watching their wallet dissappear through the x-ray machine as they load their carry-on bag onto a tray that's now 3 or 4 totes behind their possessions)

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Tobuz

Interesting to see what the hiccups are on opening day . . . there seem to be four happening:

Call to Gate: It’s clearly confusing people. Numerous tweets complaining about the lack of seating at the gates.

And a few photos have even been tweeted showing people (and quite a few of them!) sitting on the floor around the gates as they wait for their flights – ouch. Seeing users of a space do that would indicate a design flaw.

CATSA Plus: Some negative comments, i.e. “really bad idea” to have my bins – with my valuables – all go through the xray without the owner, and without all of an individual’s bins traveling together. (But also a positive comment giving kudos to the automated delivery system bringing empty bins to the front of the line.)

Water bottle refilling: Yes, a few comments about it. It’s 2016. Liquids haven’t been able to go through security since just post 9/11 … 15 years ago. Yet there’s nowhere evident to fill a reusable bottle.

US departures backlogs: It looks like there are some hiccups there – not sure if it’s an opening morning breakdown, or a bigger systems or design issue . . . but there are some complaints of long lines to get through to U.S. departures. (From the posts, it’s unclear if the issue is CATSA Security or U.S. Customs.) One photo of the line up to get to E departures, and it looks somewhat similar (sadly) to the nasty CATSA lines at concourse A.

Call to Gate: More on CtG later, but the short term fix for CtG and lack of seating around the gates is to let people know that power and seating is located at the food court area. It would also help if the airlines would staff the customer assistance counters that are located in the main waiting area.

CATSA Plus: Customers with CATSA Plus complainants need to contact the head office through the online complaint form The issue of insufficient divestiture space was brought up at the trials. I learned later on that CATSA Plus is a CATSA initiative and not Airport Authority initiative. Similar issue occured at ATL and LHR when they used same bin flow setup. LHR had best fix and limits number of people at the divest station to 1-2 groups (a group can be one person, a family, or friends travelling together.).

Water bottle refilling: Airport has to pay for the 2B terminal somehow. Charge for everything will help keep the likes of yyc-engineer employed for many years. The domestic terminal badly needs renos, especially concourse B.

US departures backlogs: It was a common occurrence that transborder pre-board security screening would get backed up on Monday mornings. The line up has moved into a more open location.

Today's backlog was also exacerbated by CATSA closing down Nexus and crew lane for most of the morning, especially the early morning rush.

The problem is that CATSA staffed security lanes at 3 for transborder and 3 for international. Essentially CATSA workforce plan was to move staff from concourse B to D/E and kept concourse A at the old levels. This morning CATSA staff told me that concourse A was unusually quiet. I should have gotten my Captain Obvious costume and explained to CATSA that 3/4 international departures (CUN, PVR, MBJ) came from concourse A.

Overall I suspect that CATSA will get their workforce plan together and move staff from concourse A to concourse D/E.

[suburbia]

Originally Posted by Cage

Water bottle refilling: Airport has to pay for the 2B terminal somehow. Charge for everything will help keep the likes of yyc-engineer employed for many years. The domestic terminal badly needs renos, especially concourse B.

That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Water is a life requirement. To connect making people pay for it so that another concourse can be made pretty is pathetic if that is the official stance. I think not having city water available is inexcusable for an airport.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Cage

Call to Gate: More on CtG later, but the short term fix for CtG and lack of seating around the gates is to let people know that power and seating is located at the food court area. It would also help if the airlines would staff the customer assistance counters that are located in the main waiting area.

CATSA Plus: Customers with CATSA Plus complainants need to contact the head office through the online complaint form The issue of insufficient divestiture space was brought up at the trials. I learned later on that CATSA Plus is a CATSA initiative and not Airport Authority initiative. Similar issue occured at ATL and LHR when they used same bin flow setup. LHR had best fix and limits number of people at the divest station to 1-2 groups (a group can be one person, a family, or friends travelling together.).

Water bottle refilling: Airport has to pay for the 2B terminal somehow. Charge for everything will help keep the likes of yyc-engineer employed for many years. The domestic terminal badly needs renos, especially concourse B.

US departures backlogs: It was a common occurrence that transborder pre-board security screening would get backed up on Monday mornings. The line up has moved into a more open location.

Today's backlog was also exacerbated by CATSA closing down Nexus and crew lane for most of the morning, especially the early morning rush.

The problem is that CATSA staffed security lanes at 3 for transborder and 3 for international. Essentially CATSA workforce plan was to move staff from concourse B to D/E and kept concourse A at the old levels. This morning CATSA staff told me that concourse A was unusually quiet. I should have gotten my Captain Obvious costume and explained to CATSA that 3/4 international departures (CUN, PVR, MBJ) came from concourse A.

Overall I suspect that CATSA will get their workforce plan together and move staff from concourse A to concourse D/E.

On the water bottle issue, we will see yyc-engineer at table just past security selling bottles of water to raise money for the airport similar to kids teams outside of Walmart. Seriously the airport authority is not going to make a lot on bottled water.

As for CATSA, they are better the homeland security in the US but sometimes you have to wonder. I agree they will eventually figure it out.

For CtG I think we will have to wait a week or two and it will get slightly better. You just need a couple of people to figure it out and then the crowds will follow. That said, I don't expect CtG to work long-term. Most airlines have their mobile apps telling them where to go. If you are connecting in Calgary with AC or Jazz it is hit and miss but not uncommon for the announcement "For thouse connected on AC xx to London, your gate is xxx" announcements.

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Acey

I can't exactly tell how it's setup by just looking at the map. 70-73 are full swings, but YEG has a couple of half swings where they can arrive domestic but only depart transborder. I'm wondering if that's possible for anything from 74-97. The other thing I just thought of is that WS could still depart to Mexico from A gates if they needed to tail swap or something, without having to tow it over.

Lastly, WestJet is showing those domestic ops on the swings as gates "A72" and "A73" which is consistent with how it was done before, but man that's confusing.

Gates 82/83 can also be used as domestic arrival gates in a pinch. Domestic arrival pax would have to travel down a narrow corridor passing by the Nexus Enrollment center. Afterward the pax would have to continue past the full length of the checkin hall and past Marriott hotel to get to a domestic bag belt.

Using gate 82/83 as a domestic arrival would be great for those flights from YEG that have 60% plus connection pax to USA and Mexico.

Westjet cannot use the A gates for Mexico or any other International departures. Just as AC cannot use C concourse 50-64 gates for LHR, FRA, NRT departures. All international departures must go through the new terminal. The old terminal has been decommissioned from CBSA perspective. Even on departures, CBSA has the authority to require outbound passport and passenger checks (which they do on an infrequent basis).

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Tobuz

US departures backlogs: It looks like there are some hiccups there – not sure if it’s an opening morning breakdown, or a bigger systems or design issue . . . but there are some complaints of long lines to get through to U.S. departures. (From the posts, it’s unclear if the issue is CATSA Security or U.S. Customs.) One photo of the line up to get to E departures, and it looks somewhat similar (sadly) to the nasty CATSA lines at concourse A.



https://twitter.com/dannierob/status/793139195162206208

Update on the US Departure issue noted above. The lineup was being held after CATSA preboard security screening and before USCBP pre-clearance. There was a software glitch at USCBP that caused the line up. to form for pax who checked their bags. The software glitch appears to be with the program that clears checked bag out of preclearence area.

New process has passengers doing checkin and bag drop with their airline, then going through preboard security screening, then filling out an online form and submitting passports for inspection by a new Automated Passport Control machine. The APC machine spits out a piece of paper that the customs officer scans to produce an assessment of whether the pax will go to secondary. Also the customs officer must have the passenger identify their bag on screen and then clear the bag out of the USCBP holdroom for delivery back to the airline.

ETA: YYZ T1 Pre-clearance had a similar day one issue when their new APC machine became operational. In YYZ T1 case. the root cause was the customs officer not clicking the button to clear the bag out of the holdroom. The customs officers need significant retraining on their own process for evaluating passenger entry into the USA (e.g. what questions to ask and steps to follow).

[Cage]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Did they give you a reason as to why they wanted 35L?

Calgary Airport Authority was all over KLM bringing in the new 789 Dreamliner to YYC. The KLM contest for 2 tickets to AMS on the dreamliner, plus the road show for new dreamliner seats that was at Husky building and the airport, plus the social media attention, plus the new service cupcakes and departure giveaways yesterday all adds up to Calgary Airport Authority heavily promoting the AMS service.

You really have to ask yourself why YYCAA would be heavily promoting KLM, they all ready have great service out of YYC. Perhaps, just maybe YYCAA is trying to convince KLM that YYC is the only destination for Alberta.

Another point even more cryptic. Someone should ask Stephen Piorier for a list of top attractions in Reykjavik.