High-speed train service to be studied

Originally Posted by SteelTown

I love this arrangement. Perfect! The Sarnia spur may not be necessary though.

Originally Posted by SteelTown

Either it goes towards Aldershot or K/W. If it goes to Aldershot than perhaps make it go towards Hamilton.

Why not Aldershot AND K/W? Both lines have plenty to service compared to most of the line which runs through farmland and distantly connected centres (eastern Ontario and extreme SWO). It's just a matter of which one gets it first.

[WaterlooInvestor]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

Well if the line is not built to link the urban centers of Quebec and Ontario's major cities then I don't care if this ever gets built. These are the places that business commuters need to get directly too. If it does not accommodate this need then why bother? The line needs to connect downtown Quebec City, Montreal, Ottawa, Toronto, Hamilton, London, and Windsor. These are the major centers that need to be linked. I don't care what infrastructure needs to be constructed to make the project successful. Bore tunnels under the lake, bore tunnels through the escarpment, elevate major sections of it, and consolidate private land. Don't half ass a 20 plus billion dollar project to simply follow rail lines that were laid out almost two hundred years ago. Design the system properly from the beginning and forget about the shitty old systems that simply cannot work. I am sick of this crap attitude of half assing mega projects. Build it right because the system will likely be around for the next two hundred or so years.

I agree the system should be built properly.

The only part I disagree on is the city's list. You mention major business centres, but left out KW. That doesn't make any sense.

[HAMRetrofit]

Perhaps Kitchener would be the next priority after Oshawa and Mississauga.

[SteelTown]

^ Easy! Be gentle.

You can state your opinion but don't start bickering.

[hamiltonguy]

How much better is a station in downtown Hamilton than Aldershot?

Theres very little benefit for the amount of money that you'd have to spend to accomplish this.

[WaterlooInvestor]

Originally Posted by HAMRetrofit

Perhaps Kitchener would be the next priority after Oshawa and Mississauga.

Yeah I guess we're so low at the bottom of the list that we had to get crappy McMaster to be involved in Kitchener's crappy Downtown Health Sciences Campus. My area's broke, so we're having to build the campus entirely in stucco without any windows.

Herrrrre we go...

[raisethehammer]

oh brother......

[kitchener-lrt]

Originally Posted by Cambridgite

Herrrrre we go...

Originally Posted by raisethehammer

oh brother......

LOL. Has anyone ever realized that maybe, just maybe, KW and Hamilton can BOTH be served by HSR?
Both KW and Hamilton have big populations, and both need to be connected. That doesn't mean that we should be compared to Oshawa .

Originally Posted by kitchener-lrt

LOL. Has anyone ever realized that maybe, just maybe, KW and Hamilton can BOTH be served by HSR?
Both KW and Hamilton have big populations, and both need to be connected. That doesn't mean that we should be compared to Oshawa .

That's what I've been saying all along! However, if you check google maps, you won't see any train tracks connecting Hamilton directly to Waterloo Region. But I'm sure GO transit could run busses between the two. We could have 3 lines in Southern Ontario. One serves the London-Kitchener-Toronto corridor. Another serves the Toronto-Hamilton-Brantford-London corridor. And yet another serves the Toronto-Hamilton-Niagara corridor. I think it's doable.

[hamiltonguy]

I figure eventually that cambridgite is right and in the end all the Quebec-Windsor corridor will have High Speed trains.

[The Geographer]

Originally Posted by kitchener-lrt

Government's do tend to just talk .
I think that this will be the last study before construction. Ontario and Quebec seem serious about this, and have realized that we can't simply continue down the road with our current infrustructure. There'll probably be a federal government change, that'll see funding for HSR. That's what I think.

Ontario and Quebec also have very skilled manufacturing labour forces which are shedding jobs very quickly these days. Building HSR would be a great way for the provinces to maintain this labour force by creating tons of long-term jobs. Allowing the skilled labour to bleed away, then trying to re-train it a decade down the road could cost as much as HSR (or more). The difference is with HSR, you get something extremely useful out of the deal while keeping the skilled labour.

[The Geographer]

Originally Posted by The Geographer

Stupid question:if it goes along the 401, does that mean they are bypassing Union Station?

Or does it move to the 401 farther west? I better go hit google maps...

EDIT: Another question... how much more would it cost to run a parallel line to Hamilton along Lakeshore West, which would then re-merge with the Kitchener line in London? That leaves open the possibility of the Hamilton line going to NYC while also serving a city of 700,000.

Originally Posted by Cambridgite

That's what I've been saying all along! However, if you check google maps, you won't see any train tracks connecting Hamilton directly to Waterloo Region. But I'm sure GO transit could run busses between the two. We could have 3 lines in Southern Ontario. One serves the London-Kitchener-Toronto corridor. Another serves the Toronto-Hamilton-Brantford-London corridor. And yet another serves the Toronto-Hamilton-Niagara corridor. I think it's doable.

That is what I was trying to say.

Anyway, looking at that VIA map, the historical legacy of the St. Lawrence Seaway has made Eastern Canada develop into the ideal for HSR. Everything is in a nice freaking line, like beads on a necklace. Now one could argue that the cities themselves are too low density, that air travel is cheap, HSR is too expensive, etc., but if none of that info was available, it would look like the ideal candidate.

[HAMRetrofit]

Originally Posted by WaterlooInvestor

Kitchener's crappy

Originally Posted by WaterlooInvestor

My area's broke

Really? Interesting that you feel this way about the city you defend so vigorously.

[markbarbera]

Cute, HAMretrofit!

What I really like about the Hamilton threads is the pasionate discussion about the city that goes on within every thread. Everyone obviuosly cares deeply about the Hammer, but this the talk is not sugar-coated or censored. We celebrate the city, warts and all and exercise open debate on various issues affecting the city.

So many of the folks posting in the other threads about Ontario's smaller cities act simply as blind cheerleaders and lash out at the slightest critique that may be deemed negative in even the slightest fashion. Thank God that is not the case with the Hamilton threads. The discussions are always frank, without reserve, and down-to-earth, like the people who call the Hammer home. We are unreserved in our discussion about Hamilton, yet the threads never belittle the smaller cities neighbouring ours. Good on you, guys!

Now, having said that, and seeing as this is a discussion in the Hamilton SSP, can we focus further talk on the proposed high speed rail and its potential impact on Hamilton? Currently the scope of the discussion begs this to be moved to the Ontario-wide forum.

Originally Posted by markbarbera

Cute, HAMretrofit!

What I really like about the Hamilton threads is the pasionate discussion about the city that goes on within every thread. Everyone obviuosly cares deeply about the Hammer, but this the talk is not sugar-coated or censored. We celebrate the city, warts and all and exercise open debate on various issues affecting the city.

So many of the folks posting in the other threads about Ontario's smaller cities act simply as blind cheerleaders and lash out at the slightest critique that may be deemed negative in even the slightest fashion. Thank God that is not the case with the Hamilton threads. The discussions are always frank, without reserve, and down-to-earth, like the people who call the Hammer home. We are unreserved in our discussion about Hamilton, yet the threads never belittle the smaller cities neighbouring ours. Good on you, guys!

Now, having said that, and seeing as this is a discussion in the Hamilton SSP, can we focus further talk on the proposed high speed rail and its potential impact on Hamilton? Currently the scope of the discussion begs this to be moved to the Ontario-wide forum.

Could this be a hint towards certain other forumers?

[SteelTown]

A major reason why Metrolinx wants another GO Station in Hamilton (by the waterfront) is to conintue the GO Train towards the Niagara region and East Hamilton. So perhaps they'll electrify this line and make Hamilton a hub between the GTA and the Niagara region for this new electrified Lakeshore line.

Though it won't be as fast as the high speed train as the GO Train will make a lot more stops. If the high speed train went to Aldershot people could take the GO Train and stop at Aldershot and whip on by to Toronto in like 20 minutes.

[chris k]

I agree that Niagara needs GO service. I'm sure places like Grimsby and St. Catharines would love GO to whip into Toronto or even Hamilton for that matter to go to some events such as sports/shows/business etc.

It's a great reason to add Hamilton to the list of stops on here for all day service. If they do build a stop here, would it be on the lot across Liuna station on James?


P.S. Dont let this thread degenerate to useless battles about Kitchener vs. Hamilton. Make a thread for that somewhere else if you really want to

[hamiltonguy]

Originally Posted by chris k

I agree that Niagara needs GO service. I'm sure places like Grimsby and St. Catharines would love GO to whip into Toronto or even Hamilton for that matter to go to some events such as sports/shows/business etc.

It's a great reason to add Hamilton to the list of stops on here for all day service. If they do build a stop here, would it be on the lot across Liuna station on James?


P.S. Dont let this thread degenerate to useless battles about Kitchener vs. Hamilton. Make a thread for that somewhere else if you really want to

I've been thinking about how a set up for a James North Station would work.

Since the Area where the platforms used to be is huge because it was built for many more platforms than needed, I think the station should be there, with a Platform level portion ( For VIA) and a LIUNA Station/ Street Level area and bridge across the rest of the tracks to the street on the north side.

The Waterfront Streetcar Line could have access from the Bridge on James Street. #4 Harbourfront Buses could jog over from John and Loop in front of LIUNA Station with access through the Old Station. Access from Taxis could come through on the street North of the tracks with access through the Bridge over the tracks.

Parking could be accessible from Bay Street and be a parking garage on the same part as the Station but on the west side James Street.

[LikeHamilton]

My prediction is cynical but I believe historically true. The first phase will be a non-stop line from Toronto to Montreal. Nothing in between. It will be paid for by the Fed’s, Ontario and Quebec governments. Phase 2, 3, 4 etc will never be built do to traditional huge cost over runs and delays in phase 1.

If it comes to Hamilton, Kitchener or where ever, it will just skirt the city with a quick stop station with connections to the downtown and other cities. There will be as few stops as possible.