Formation of a REAL pro-development group in Halifax

worldlyhaligonian · #1 Posted **Apr 9, 2009, 7:05 PM**

Hello all, I know we have discussed the idea of a pro-development group in the past, however NOW is the time for action. Although Fusion is expressing themselves, we need a more targeted group and solution.

Dmajackson · #2 Posted **Apr 9, 2009, 9:07 PM**

I PM'ed you worldly_haligonian

I think its time for one too. Fusion is too pro-development for my likings and the HT is too anti-development. We need a middle voice that says what its people say or vote for not just one the blindly says yah or nah everytime.

Jonovision · #3 Posted **Apr 10, 2009, 12:53 PM**

I don't think we need any other groups. I'm a core member of Fusions Urban Design Action Team and you all know I don't blindly support every development. Our team is all about educating ourselves and the public on what is going on with the city. We meet with developers and stake holders. I can understand that some people might see Fusion as an exact opposite of the HT but the HT as we all know is crazy and blind to whats really going on.

worldlyhaligonian · #4 Posted **Apr 10, 2009, 9:12 PM**

Yeah, but we aren't going to be "Fusion" and I want to do more than you are doing. I'm talking community projects, school visits to see what the youth want for their city, etc. I don't want to be limiting in membership, as you set age requirements.

I don't want to polarize Halifax, and my vision is to create a diverse Executive Committee for this organization built up of young/old, layman/professional, environmentalists/realists.

The problem is nobody in halifax can see the bigger picture and it would be good to see a group with balance. I see this as an extention of SSP Halifax.

Dmajackson · #5 Posted **Apr 10, 2009, 10:16 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by worldlyhaligonian

Yeah, but we aren't going to be "Fusion" and I want to do more than you are doing. I'm talking community projects, school visits to see what the youth want for their city, etc. I don't want to be limiting in membership, as you set age requirements.

I don't want to polarize Halifax, and my vision is to create a diverse Executive Committee for this organization built up of young/old, layman/professional, environmentalists/realists.

The problem is nobody in halifax can see the bigger picture and it would be good to see a group with balance. I see this as an extention of SSP Halifax.

I 100% agree with you Worldly_Haligonian

I failed to mention this before but another reason I don't like Fusion too much is I am too young to join according to their age requirements (I'm 16). And well to expand on "WH"'s point about age I know quite a few people my age who know what is happening in the city and some are quite interested in it.

I won't name names but from other threads I've realized that there is another Halifax forumer who is my age and I have a hunch that some people are also older on this site as well. It doesn't matter to me how old someone is as long as they are educated about what they are talking about. And unfortunately Fusion doesn't think that way so I think its time Halifax has a proper group that anybody can have their input at.

Dmajackson · #6 Posted **Apr 20, 2009, 9:45 PM**

Here's just a small update on the group;

"Worldly_Haligonian" and I met over the weekend to discuss some matters relating to the group and to get the ball rolling on the idea. We still don't have an official plan or a name for the group but both of us are working on that. At least one other member of this forum is interested in helping out and according to WH there are a few more interested from outside the forum.

The group is still very much open and anybody who is interested should contact either me or "Worldly_Haligonian".

"Worldly_Haligonian" has more experience with groups and associations so I'll let him add any details I might of left out.

Barrington south · #7 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 1:08 AM**

as worldly knows from my PM's, I'm a very strong supporter of this group, I just thought I would state that on this tread, to show my dedication to wordly's idea and to hopefully encourage others to speak up and help worldy's vision become a reality...this tread is filled with people (including me) who love to share with others the way they think this city should progress...well now is our opportunity...our opportunity to take this passion we all posses and do something with it...at times we have been called development or skyscraper geeks...F*** that...if we follow through with worldy's vision, we won't be "geeks" anymore, we'll be the movers and shakers that get things done. We will be the ones who help transform this nice little city into something great ...now is the time to strike...

well that's my piece...hope I did not offend you Wordly by speaking up for your idea...just wanted to show my support...thanks everyone

gm_scott · #8 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 1:28 AM**

hey guys, I'll show my support too.
Bedford: Not sure if the guy your talking about is me, but I'm seventeen, I follow these forums everyday, read the papers, and search the net for development news in Halifax. I know more then lots of older people. Anyways, I'm not sure how I could help out, but I'm here if you need it. I would love to see something like this get underway, and I'll do my share to see it happen.
-scott from fall river

Dmajackson · #9 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 1:36 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by gm_scott

hey guys, I'll show my support too.
Bedford: Not sure if the guy your talking about is me, but I'm seventeen, I follow these forums everyday, read the papers, and search the net for development news in Halifax. I know more then lots of older people. Anyways, I'm not sure how I could help out, but I'm here if you need it. I would love to see something like this get underway, and I'll do my share to see it happen.
-scott from fall river

Actually it was Barrington_South I knew was interested.

Thats interesting. I'm also seventeen from Bedford, and do a lot of research.

I'd have to talk to "Worldly_Haligonian" to see what what exactly everybody could do to help but we were just talking and we are now hoping to get a person from each district to keep tabs on their councillors and hopefully the more spreadout we are the more influencial we can be on council.

I'm sure we could find a task for you

worldlyhaligonian · #10 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 1:42 AM**

This project is the the works. Please PM me for the details.

We will be having our logo design outsourced to a start up company whose young entrepreneur owner is joining.

The organization is going to have a fairly flat structure and be more of a forum that produces analysis and reports on any particular development. I want the organization to be everything that Fusion and the HT are not: well-rounded. The pillars of the organization's mandate will be:

1. Pro high-quality development
2. Pro heritage conservation and restoration
3. Pro environmental design (in terms of both human and natural)

It will be about consensus building. We don't believe that empty lots are generating their economic potential. The group will be a voice in council meetings to bring balance and actual insight into the debate.

A development like International Place would rank high on our scale and we want to possibly help facilitate business via promotion of Halifax.

Nilan8888 · #11 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 3:40 AM**

Hey guys,

I'm a year-or more long lurker on these boards, and they've jsut recently allowed gmail emails to register, so here I am.

Glad to know there's a Halifax pero-development group starting to take shape. Too bad it's a bit too late for me since I just left Halifax for TO 8 months ago. But what can you do?

I don't know that Halifax is really any more "backward" in its thinking than anywhere else, but it's at a key point in its development and if ever it needed citizens that didn't assume development was an evil thing to be opposed, now's the time.

If you ever need any general TO stuff the man on the street here can get, just let me know. Just to let any HT people know or they'll call you out as traitors to the Maritimes or something.

worldlyhaligonian · #12 Posted **Apr 21, 2009, 11:46 PM**

Good points for sure, this group will be all about building consensus. The plan is to produce reports on developments that use actual qualitative and quantitative analysis and not merely judge a development from arbitrary and subjective perspectives. (Unlike council and the HT)

Nilan8888 · #13 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 12:01 AM**

Having lived and been in TO for a while maybe think of it like this:

Fusion: Wants to turn Halifax into Toronto.

HT: Wants to turn Halifax into a parking lot

Council: Wants to let HT get thier parking lot

This group: Wants to develop a GOOD city. You know, like New York is a GOOD city.

TO isn't so bad until you realize the transit system is screwed up. 3 subway lines + 1 RT line, two of which with only 4/5 stops? Takes forever to get anywhere around here. I miss Halifax with its 45 minute max walk to be anywhere I needed to be.

Haliguy · #14 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 12:49 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nilan8888

Having lived and been in TO for a while maybe think of it like this:

Fusion: Wants to turn Halifax into Toronto.

HT: Wants to turn Halifax into a parking lot

Council: Wants to let HT get thier parking lot

This group: Wants to develop a GOOD city. You know, like New York is a GOOD city.

TO isn't so bad until you realize the transit system is screwed up. 3 subway lines + 1 RT line, two of which with only 4/5 stops? Takes forever to get anywhere around here. I miss Halifax with its 45 minute max walk to be anywhere I needed to be.

"Fusion: Wants to turn Halifax into Toronto." what a dumb statement to make. Just because Fusion wants to move Halifax forward doesn't mean it wants to become a Toronto and what in the world does that mean anyway because it wants Halifax to grow and develop it is going to be like Toronto..give me a break.

someone123 · #15 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 1:14 AM**

With Halifax the problem is not so much that it's particularly backward, it's that the city could be much better than it is.

People say that about everywhere of course but not all other cities are attractive and overflowing with talent. Most are not in fact.

Barrington south · #16 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 1:49 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nilan8888

Having lived and been in TO for a while maybe think of it like this:

Fusion: Wants to turn Halifax into Toronto.

HT: Wants to turn Halifax into a parking lot

Council: Wants to let HT get thier parking lot

This group: Wants to develop a GOOD city. You know, like New York is a GOOD city.

TO isn't so bad until you realize the transit system is screwed up. 3 subway lines + 1 RT line, two of which with only 4/5 stops? Takes forever to get anywhere around here. I miss Halifax with its 45 minute max walk to be anywhere I needed to be.

compared to many other cities around the world, that are the same size as Toronto, TO is years ahead in many regards, with the exception of public transportation...big deal... downtown is where the action is at, and the transportation is adequate there, if you live in boonies than buy a damn car...sounds like you have been served a healthy dose of ANTI-upper CANADA growing up

Nilan8888 · #17 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 1:54 AM**

You know Haliguy, for someone posting on a thread for a new development group that is looking for new members, the only statement more potentially stupid than my attempt at humor is your own.

"Welcome to our new development group! You're an idiot!"

Whatever, chill out dude.

And now Barrington South... cripes.

Y'know, forget it. If that's what a new development group has to look forward to, count me out. And trust me -- public transportation is a BIG deal. how many times have I read about people on here saying "oh well we shouldn't be trying to get people to own cars and it's all about desnity" now it's the other way around?

It has nothing to do with anti-upper Canada sentiment: LOVE Niagara falls... I think this response has more to do with a bit of backlash against it.

hfx_chris · #18 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 2:00 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Haliguy

"Fusion: Wants to turn Halifax into Toronto." what a dumb statement to make.

Yeah, and the Heritage Trust doesn't actually want to turn Halifax into a parking lot, and council doesn't actually bend to every whim of the Trust, what's your point? You apparently missed the humor. You should look up the word hyperbole sometime...

Barrington south · #19 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 2:47 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nilan8888

You know Haliguy, for someone posting on a thread for a new development group that is looking for new members, the only statement more potentially stupid than my attempt at humor is your own.

"Welcome to our new development group! You're an idiot!"

Whatever, chill out dude.

And now Barrington South... cripes.

Y'know, forget it. If that's what a new development group has to look forward to, count me out. And trust me -- public transportation is a BIG deal. how many times have I read about people on here saying "oh well we shouldn't be trying to get people to own cars and it's all about desnity" now it's the other way around?

It has nothing to do with anti-upper Canada sentiment: LOVE Niagara falls... I think this response has more to do with a bit of backlash against it.

relax, no need to throw your toys out of your crib. if you can't respond to criticism of your cheap shot without a threat, well than, I guess that is your prerogative...but let me ask you... why did you move to Toronto in the first place, a job opportunity perhaps? so is this a case of biting the hand that feeds you?...you stated that TO isn't "so bad"... does that surprise you?...not as bad as you where led to believe perhaps?...

however, i ask you to not turn your back on the potential to transform Halifax...please do not let my hypersensitive defensive nature.....of my hometown...turn you off from this opportunity. I was speaking for myself and my thoughts are not a reflection of this group or any others who might be potentially involved...I sincerely hope you do participate

Nilan8888 · #20 Posted **Apr 22, 2009, 3:17 AM**

relax, no need to throw your toys out of your crib.

Oh, very well... stupid toys...

If you can't respond to criticism of your cheap shot without a threat, well than, I guess that is your prerogative...but let me ask you... why did you move to Toronto in the first place, a job opportunity perhaps? so is this a case of biting the hand that feeds you?

No, my girlfriend is from TO. I met her visting my best friend some years ago who moved out here for a job oppertunity. So maybe it's the hand that feeds him.

I had a development job in Halifax. I told them I was leaving for TO to be with her. They said "wait, wait, how would you like to keep working for us in Toronto?" I said "Fab, let's do it". I'm still paid from Halifax. Which means it's a Halifax salary in TO which isn't great -- but at least it was a pretty good one. I do work on the side from TO that compensates, so maybe I'm biting that?

...you stated that TO isn't "so bad"... does that surprise you?...not as bad as you where led to believe perhaps?...

No, if anything it was a letdown after the 1.5-2 years worth of visting where I got sold on the place. Then I remembered it's a whole lot more fun to visit anywhere than live there. I never got why people don't like TO for it's people: they've been nice enough to me. The only TO snobs I ever met had moved to Halifax and seemed to be bitter about it for some reason. Maybe TO has gotten ahead by exporting them to other cities.

It's a place like anywhere else and the people here aren't any dumber or more enlightened than anywhere else. There's just more of them; which is fine. What isn't so fine is the semi-managed sprawl that Halifax should definately avoid. I mean just look at the transit map... sure, it does fine for downtown: most people don't live downtown. Me, I live uptown on Shepphard at the moment (I'm moving soon): that's not the suburbs unless your suburbs start at North York and not Markham/Richmond Hill. And it's irrelevant on that point anyway because I live right across the street from Bayview Station.

But I've experienced a few different commutes. I dunno, maybe it's pretty ordinary, but you have to pay an extra fare leaving the GTA?

however, i ask you to not turn your back on the potential to transform Halifax...please do not let my hypersensitive defensive nature.....of my hometown...turn you off from this opportunity. I was speaking for myself and my thoughts are not a reflection of this group or any others who might be potentially involved...I sincerely hope you do participate

Maybe it's because I'm from Halifax but I look at the things people post here about the buildings, and I get excited. Where I live, there's this BIG condo going up of the ARC... really nice lots of glass... looks great:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=743272

And yet looking at it it's beautiful... but comparatively I could care less. Here it's just another building in a city that has nothing to prove (except its transit system) and is in all probability shrinking or close to with the economy in the dumps. Yet I'm far more interested in the Trillium, which many would say is smaller, less impressive and less desirable.

But the Arc won't do much one way or another for Toronto. The Trillium will do a lot for Halifax.