HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Transportation


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #1  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2017, 5:46 PM
rocketphish's Avatar
rocketphish rocketphish is offline
Planet Ottawa and beyond
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 12,335
Cumberland Transitway

City goes back to the drawing board on Blackburn road, transit link

Jon Willing, Ottawa Citizen
Published on: January 26, 2017 | Last Updated: January 26, 2017 12:10 PM EST




Piecing together a new Cumberland Transitway won’t be as easy as the city thought.

A report published this week ahead of Wednesday’s transportation committee meeting says the city needs to find cheaper way to build a road and Transitway between the Blackburn Hamlet Bypass and Brian Coburn Boulevard.

The city estimated that section of road would cost $17.5 million, but after studying the ground conditions, staff realized it would actually cost about $70 million. The plan has been to build this section of road between 2020 and 2025.

So, it’s back to the drawing board for city planners, since there’s no way the city can afford $70 million to build that road link under its “affordable” transportation plan.

The city has also been studying the stretch as a piece of the future Cumberland Transitway, which will run between Blair station and Frank Kenney Road, bringing a beefed-up transit service to Blackburn Hamlet and south Orléans. The Transitway won’t be built until sometime after 2031.

Since a change in the road corridor would affect an adjacent Transitway, the city also has to reconsider the plan for a transit road in this area.

But there’s potential impact to the existing Brian Coburn Boulevard project if the city changes the corridor west of Navan Road. The road is already under construction between Navan Road and Pagé Road and changes to the plan, in the city’s “worst case scenario,” would cost $2 million.

“While unlikely, there is the potential that this amount could be a throwaway cost. Staff will use every possible measure to ensure that this risk is minimized or eliminated,” city staff write in the report.

Brian Coburn Boulevard between Navan Road and Mer Bleu Road is scheduled to be substantially complete by the upcoming fall.

There could also be an extra $50,000 cost to redesigning a planned Chapel Hill park-and-ride lot off Brian Coburn Boulevard at Navan Road.

The city will need to get the National Capital Commission’s approval since the transportation projects are already plugged into the NCC’s greenbelt master plan.

Council’s transportation committee will be asked to approve a statement of work for an environmental assessment of alternative corridors in the Blackburn Hamlet area. The city says it has money in the budget to pay for the study.

jwilling@postmedia.com
twitter.com/JonathanWilling

http://ottawacitizen.com/news/local-...d-transit-link
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #2  
Old Posted Nov 8, 2019, 3:54 AM
waterloowarrior's Avatar
waterloowarrior waterloowarrior is offline
National Capital Region
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Eastern Ontario
Posts: 9,244
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #3  
Old Posted Nov 11, 2019, 6:24 PM
Tesladom Tesladom is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 467
Didn't the NCC block the City's proposed solution?
So are they starting over or to they have proposed solutions that NCC have already "approved"?
This process is too complicated with the NCC veto
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #4  
Old Posted Nov 11, 2019, 8:48 PM
PHrenetic PHrenetic is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 1,029
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tesladom View Post
Didn't the NCC block the City's proposed solution?
So are they starting over or to they have proposed solutions that NCC have already "approved"?
This process is too complicated with the NCC veto
Good Day.

In effect, yes.... they raised "serious objections".

Welcome to city planning NCR style - utterly unlike anywhere else at all.
City (Ottawa), City (Gatineau), Prov (Ontario), Prov (Quebec), NCC, PSPC, Heritage Canada, Transport Canada, Environment Canada, Treasury Brd, Gov't Canada (Cabinet).
Even throw in World Heritage for good measure.

Yipeeeeee.....
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #5  
Old Posted Nov 14, 2019, 10:04 PM
DEWLine DEWLine is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ottawa-Gatineau
Posts: 337
I can't say that I'm unhappy that the NCC is unwilling to sacrifice the Mer Bleue Bog to development pressures. Because I'm not unhappy.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #6  
Old Posted Nov 15, 2019, 1:11 AM
Admiral Nelson Admiral Nelson is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 492
Thank God for competing bureaucracy! To borrow a line from yes minister, this city's held together with red tape!
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #7  
Old Posted Nov 15, 2019, 3:04 AM
lrt's friend lrt's friend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 11,872
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEWLine View Post
I can't say that I'm unhappy that the NCC is unwilling to sacrifice the Mer Bleue Bog to development pressures. Because I'm not unhappy.
That is a quite a few negatives in a couple of sentences.

I am waiting for the bulldozers to explode one of those World War II bombs dropped into the bog for bombing practice. Besides, a deep bog is not exactly the most stable ground to put housing.

Last edited by lrt's friend; Nov 15, 2019 at 4:42 AM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #8  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2020, 8:02 PM
Blackburnian's Avatar
Blackburnian Blackburnian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Gloucester
Posts: 9
So are they still planning to have a flyover bridge for crossing the 417 to get from blair stn. to blair rd.? why aren't they building a station on the south side of the pedestrian bridge? would make more sense to me (and easier to convert to an lrt).

Last edited by Blackburnian; Jul 8, 2020 at 8:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #9  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2020, 8:30 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackburnian View Post
So are they still planning to have a flyover bridge for crossing the 417 to get from blair stn. to blair rd.? why aren't they building a station on the south side of the pedestrian bridge? would make more sense to me (and easier to convert to an lrt).
With Stage 2 East of Confederation now using the existing underpass, I'm not sure it's feasible anymore.

This graphic from 2010 seems to show a fly-over as an option, along with the hospital link:


https://app06.ottawa.ca/calendar/ott...tal%20link.htm

New concepts have dropped the fly-over, and the hospital link.


https://lauradudas.ca/brian-coburn-extension-update/
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #10  
Old Posted Jul 8, 2020, 8:37 PM
Blackburnian's Avatar
Blackburnian Blackburnian is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Gloucester
Posts: 9
I'm aware, I mean shouldn't the terminus of the brt (blair) start at the other end of the pedestrian bridge from blair station (pineview side). so as to avoid traffic on blair rd overpass?
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #11  
Old Posted Jul 9, 2020, 8:46 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackburnian View Post
I'm aware, I mean shouldn't the terminus of the brt (blair) start at the other end of the pedestrian bridge from blair station (pineview side). so as to avoid traffic on blair rd overpass?
I understand where you're coming from, but maintaining the current Blair station has a few advantages. The station was built to handle high volumes and the city will likely want to take advantage of the investment made. It also provides a quick bus-rail transfer within a fare-paid zone.

Should a new station be built south of the 174, the new bus loop could not be within the fare paid zone, would require a fairly long walk across the bridge (time savings from any congestion on Blair might be lost), and the bridge itself might not be able to handle the volume.

As for Blair road, all buses currently use it, coming from the south and east. Once Stage 2 opens, that volume will be greatly reduced.

I think that it was a big mistake to have the Confederation Line use the existing bus underpass because a fly-over would have been much more efficient.

To be honest, I'm of the opinion that the City will build the Cumberland Transitway as rail from the get-go, skipping the BRT phase, as part of Stage 4. I imagine they will have to reconfigure the Blair west bound on ramp to accommodate a fly-over west of Blair as opposed to the originally envisioned east of Blair.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #12  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2020, 1:46 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
Someone posted this document on the East Confederation Extension thread. Page 97 shows the Cumberland Transitway options to connect Blair to the new Transitway.

https://aecomviz.com/wp-content/uplo...982-1-of-2.pdf
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #13  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2020, 3:07 PM
Tesladom Tesladom is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 467
"To the south of the study area, the Cumberland Transitway facility will be constructed post 2031."
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #14  
Old Posted Dec 11, 2020, 6:05 PM
trainshumanist trainshumanist is offline
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2020
Posts: 22
How about instead of building on a bog, we develop the vast spaces of wilderness within the city? I'm thinking in particular all that forest around Hurdman station. In fact, I'd like us to have some skyscrapers next to the Rideau River a la Chicago. And while we're at it, let's remove some of the Greenbelt surrounding the O-Train stations.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #15  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 5:09 PM
Tesladom Tesladom is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2019
Posts: 467
I think Hurdman is a old municipal dump for years gone by, contaminated land.

But I agree with developing within the Greenbelt in non ecologically sensitive areas and along existing transit infrastructure
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #16  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 7:31 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 1,332
There IS a master plan for Hurdman and surrounds. Perhaps someone would be nice enough to cross-post?

Its expensive and difficult to decontaminate 1920's toxic landfills for true high-rises. However mid-rise raft slabs have a gentler touch and float over all that cesspool.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #17  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 8:08 PM
DEWLine DEWLine is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Ottawa-Gatineau
Posts: 337
Hurdman used to host a railway roundhouse complex. Hence the current east Ottawa VIA Rail service hub next to what's now Tremblay Station. Converting part of the place to O-Train service might count as a return to an old job for Hurdman.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #18  
Old Posted Dec 14, 2020, 8:32 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
Quote:
Originally Posted by DEWLine View Post
Hurdman used to host a railway roundhouse complex. Hence the current east Ottawa VIA Rail service hub next to what's now Tremblay Station. Converting part of the place to O-Train service might count as a return to an old job for Hurdman.
I though we had a east LRT cdp thread, but I'm unable to find it. Part of the plan can be found on the general cpd thread. Here's the City PDF on the east lrt CDPs.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #19  
Old Posted Dec 15, 2020, 1:46 PM
OTownandDown OTownandDown is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 1,332
Quote:
Originally Posted by J.OT13 View Post
I though we had a east LRT cdp thread, but I'm unable to find it. Part of the plan can be found on the general cpd thread. Here's the City PDF on the east lrt CDPs.
AH yes, Page 65 is wild!

I love this report for its sheer gall against the NIMBY Karens.

But I also can't wait for 100 years from now.

Edit: Somebody needs to threaten the NCC with Page 65 the next time they try to hire Melnyk for anything.

Edit 2: Note the underpass was built under the train tracks at the east side of the hurdman entrance, ready for the 'grand alee' proposed here.

Edit 3: LOL @ Blair: Sit down, you're drunk.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #20  
Old Posted Mar 3, 2022, 4:29 PM
J.OT13's Avatar
J.OT13 J.OT13 is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Ottawa
Posts: 24,024
City pursues east-end Transitway through the Greenbelt, despite NCC refusal

Route for future Brian Coburn Boulevard extension goes to committee next week

Kate Porter · CBC News · Posted: Feb 27, 2022 4:00 AM ET | Last Updated: February 27

A City of Ottawa committee will be asked this week to approve a route for a future road and rapid bus line to the east end, even though it goes through Greenbelt lands the National Capital Commission (NCC) refuses to hand over.

For decades, there have been discussions about building a transit corridor to serve the fast-growing population along Innes Road in Orléans.

The plan would also extend Brian Coburn Boulevard to run alongside. But the file has caused tension between the two institutions, and both sides appear entrenched.

In 2013, the city and the NCC signed an agreement for a new Transitway to run along the existing Blackburn Hamlet Bypass. A few years later, the city decided soil conditions would make that project too expensive.

"The city decided not to proceed with that agreed alignment and undertook an assessment of new road options through NCC lands that were not the subject of any prior agreement with us," said NCC spokesperson Valérie Dufour in an email.


The city's preferred route for a future east-end Transitway and new road would see Brian Coburn Boulevard extended to the west over NCC Greenbelt lands. (City of Ottawa)The city's preferred route for a future east-end Transitway and new road would see Brian Coburn Boulevard extended to the west over NCC Greenbelt lands. (City of Ottawa)

The NCC has written formal letters in the past couple of years telling the city it would not entertain a new road through Greenbelt farmland slightly further south. It doesn't want to break up the Greenbelt, especially near the environmentally sensitive Mer Bleue wetlands.

Despite that, city staff are recommending that transportation committee approve that route, known as Option 7, at its March 3 meeting.

Price tag of more than $300M

East-end city councillors insist that option makes the most sense long-term to ensure the growing population in south Orléans can get around, especially as more houses are built. They even publicly called out the NCC for not co-operating on the city's preferred option while making a recent council decision on an unrelated planning file.

City staff say after extensive study and consultation, Option 7 ranked highest. It would also cost hundreds of millions less, staff wrote: an estimated $128 million for the roadway, and $178 million for the Transitway.

Innes Coun. Laura Dudas said while environmental concerns are important to her, the route doesn't go near the Mer Bleue Bog and follows a hydro corridor.

She said it would also make it easier to some day link Orléans further south to Hunt Club Road. The Blackburn Hamlet Bypass is "beyond capacity," Dudas said, and adding a lane won't be enough for the 15,500 housing units to be built in south Orléans over the next decade.

"We definitely need a long-term solution," she said, expressing frustration that the NCC is "not willing to have a meaningful conversation with the city."

The NCC disagrees. Dufour says it wants to improve transportation linkages and is open to two other routes, including the city's second-ranked option.

The city had offered to swap 47 hectares of its land in order to get the required 42 hectares of Greenbelt property, but the NCC refused in December.

The Chapel Hill forest lands offered by the city surround homes and active roads that need to be maintained, the NCC said, which wouldn't compensate for the loss of high-quality farmland.

Short-term road improvements

While several community associations in the area support Option 7 route, others do not.

Pat Teolis, president of the Chateauneuf Community Association — one of the older subdivisions along Innes Road — said he and his neighbourhood support the NCC's mandate to protect greenspace.


The second-ranked option for extending Brian Coburn Boulevard more closely resembles the decade-old plan and aligns the new corridor along the existing Blackburn Hamlet Bypass. (City of Ottawa)

Previous evaluations leaned toward the now second-place Option 1, Teolis said, which the NCC could support and would have less environmental impact.

"And now all of a sudden it's switched, and I find that very concerning," he said.

Even if the transportation committee approves the design for the east-end corridor, a federal environmental assessment would be required.

The NCC would ultimately need to approve the federal land transfer, which at this point appears unlikely.

Dudas knows that any road might not be built for many years. She points to $22 million the city hopes to spend in the meantime to improve travel times by widening two kilometres of Innes Road west of Blackburn Hamlet for transit lanes, and improving one intersection for buses.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottaw...sign-1.6364816
Reply With Quote
     
     
This discussion thread continues

Use the page links to the lower-right to go to the next page for additional posts
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Regional Sections > Canada > Ontario > Ottawa-Gatineau > Transportation
Forum Jump



Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:17 PM.

     
SkyscraperPage.com - Archive - Privacy Statement - Top

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.