Trans Canada Highway Twinning: Segments U/C

[craner]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

I check that thread out from time to time and of course I am impressed.
Here’s the thing though: I find it super frustrating when, after bypassing all the built-up area, one encounters a stoplight right outside the town. Winnipeg’s like that, Portage La Prairie too and lots of places in the states as well. On the other hand, Yellowhead Highway was done right in that it’s interchange-protected east and west of Anthony Henday Drive.

Yes and now they are working on getting rid of all the traffic signals on the Yellowhead through Edmonton - good job ‘Chuck! Wish we could do that with the TCH #1 through Cowtown.

[Dengler Avenue]

For Yellowhead Highway though, I hope AB and SK can figure out what to do to bypass Lloydminster. Edson and Hinton are peanuts in comparison.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

For Yellowhead Highway though, I hope AB and SK can figure out what to do to bypass Lloydminster. Edson and Hinton are peanuts in comparison.

It's flat there so just go around it.

[flipper316]

Originally Posted by craner

Holy crap! It’s like the NDP is pleased with their utter stupidity. It makes me so angry I don’t even know what to say. Less twining (now a minuscule 3+kms) with no interchanges all for more money and 3 years late. What a bunch of idiots!

Wow.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by craner

Haha - well I wouldn’t go so far as destroying the intersection but that one at 100th St. NE and the one at 68th St. on the west side of the 201 do drive up my blood pressure for sure.

For 100th Street, it's not very surprising. Why build interchanges right away when the demand is so much lower once you get outside Stoney Trail? Obviously it would be nice to have an access controlled freeway there but that's gotta be a bit lower on the priority list than other places. 68th Street needed it a long time ago though.

https://www.calgary.ca/Transportatio...owmap-City.pdf

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

It's flat there so just go around it.

I once made all the lights in Edson and Hinton, it may have saved a total of 5 minutes. Going around would add a considerable time in Hinton unless they built grade separation along the current route. There was a preliminary plan for an Edson ByPass but there is no great desire to build it yet.

Lloyd is the greater challenge. Would love to have a ByPass but the economics far exceed the drive to get it done. That and it would cut into some significant revenue. That would kill a lot of business along that route that need the stopping traffic. Its also a good time to stop on the route between Saskatoon and Edmonton.

I remember the days driving to Saskatoon and Regina on a 2 lane highway and having to go through Vegreville and every small town along the way. When it was twinned that trip was a couple of hours quicker.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Airboy

I once made all the lights in Edson and Hinton, it may have saved a total of 5 minutes. Going around would add a considerable time in Hinton unless they built grade separation along the current route. There was a preliminary plan for an Edson ByPass but there is no great desire to build it yet.

Lloyd is the greater challenge. Would love to have a ByPass but the economics far exceed the drive to get it done. That and it would cut into some significant revenue. That would kill a lot of business along that route that need the stopping traffic. Its also a good time to stop on the route between Saskatoon and Edmonton.

I remember the days driving to Saskatoon and Regina on a 2 lane highway and having to go through Vegreville and every small town along the way. When it was twinned that trip was a couple of hours quicker.

Good signage on the highways can direct people to things. However, that is a poor excuse for not twinning a highway. I feel no new bypasses should go in unless they are divided highways.

[Corndogger]

Nova Scotia awards $718-million contract for Trans-Canada Highway twinning project

The Canadian Press May 11, 2020

HALIFAX — A contract has been awarded for the twinning of a notorious stretch of the Trans-Canada Highway in northeastern Nova Scotia.

The province says Dexter Nova Alliance outbid two other companies shortlisted for the $717.9-million project.

The consortium is to design, build, finance, operate and maintain the new twinned section of Highway 104 over a 20-year public-private partnership.

Ottawa is contributing $90 million to the project under the National Trade Corridors Fund.

Construction is to start in June and be completed no later than the end of 2023 on the 38-kilometre section of Highway 104 between Sutherland’s River and Antigonish.

The project includes 28 kilometres of new two-lane twinned highway and 10 kilometres of new four-lane twinned highway.

It will also include two new interchanges and about 24 new bridges.

Dexter Nova Alliance, led by local contractors Dexter Construction and Nova Construction with BBGI as an equity partner, will also upgrade the existing section of highway. That will include repaving the entire section of the old road and replacing seven existing bridges.

...

Between 2009 and 2018 there had been more than 400 accidents and 16 deaths along that stretch of road.

Joe MacDonald, the fire chief in Barney’s River, N.S., has long campaigned for the highway to be twinned.

“It is a dream come true to see this project now becoming a reality,” MacDonald said May 7.

“This will mean a lot to have a safer road from Sutherland’s River to Antigonish. I believe many lives will be saved.”

Source: https://canada.constructconnect.com/...inning-project

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

Good signage on the highways can direct people to things. However, that is a poor excuse for not twinning a highway. I feel no new bypasses should go in unless they are divided highways.

Since the Provincial Gov is having to pay for this I don't see it happening in my life time.

Lloyd does need the Bypass though. I've been going through Lloyd every 2 weeks and crap is that slow.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by Airboy

Since the Provincial Gov is having to pay for this I don't see it happening in my life time.

Lloyd does need the Bypass though. I've been going through Lloyd every 2 weeks and crap is that slow.

They bypassed many towns along highway 11 in Ontario. Those towns haven't died.

[Dengler Avenue]

For Hinton, the current alignment seems to have enough ROW so it can be upgraded like how it’ll be done through Edmonton. For Edson, a bypass is definitely needed. Lloydminster? C’mon it’s a city on its own right. Cities usually don’t die. (Then again Kenora lost a lot of tourist traffic because of the bypass.)

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by swimmer_spe

They bypassed many towns along highway 11 in Ontario. Those towns haven't died.

The ones in Alberta would not die either since they are local hubs. and are all quite large. But the smaller towns that are bypassed do die.

I look at Vegreville, when the highway bypassed the town a number of businesses along the old route did eventually closed.

There will be a number of businesses that die because they rely on the traffic passing.

Lloyd is a rest stop for most so I would expect to see new businesses spring up at the interchanges.

Edson has quite a few businesses along the route that rely on highway traffic.

Hinton is to small and the corridor that can be used for a bypass is pretty much the same route used now.

Now if these towns could make the main route a freeway with interchanges that would be better.

I try not to stop in Edson but will stop before in Niton. Then Stop in Hinton to top the fuel tanks before entering the mountains. If I am heading to the coast a stop in Hinton gets me all the way to Kamloops easily. But I usually make a pit stop in Valemont or Blue river.

[Airboy]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

For Hinton, the current alignment seems to have enough ROW so it can be upgraded like how it’ll be done through Edmonton. For Edson, a bypass is definitely needed. Lloyminster? C’mon it’s a city on its own right. Cities usually don’t die. (Then again Kenora lost a lot of tourist traffic because of the bypass.)

Kenora at least had a tourist trade. Lloyd is a commercial centre. The businesses effected would be travel related.

[Dengler Avenue]

Yea, so for me, (lol speaking as an armchair “engineer”), building a bypass where the current alignment could have been used is wasteful. If I were in charge, I’d have ordered all the buildings around the intersection of AB-16A and Calahoo Road in Spruce Grove torn down and put a single-point interchange there. In fact, in that case, Yellowhead Highway wouldn’t even have been realigned in the first place. Having 2 freeways 3 km apart is simply ridiculous.

Similarly, Regina Bypass was extravagant when all that needed to be done was to completely grade-separate Victoria Avenue (TCH) all the way to Balgonie, building flyovers from TCH W to Ring Road S(W) and from Ring Road S(W) to TCH E, and widening the Ring Road to 6 lanes. A speed limit of 100 kph (allowing 120 kph) should have been attainable. Alas the ship has sailed.
I can only hope that Saskatoon doesn’t repeat the same mistake and instead upgrade the existing Circle Drive West.

Now, for Medicine Hat, I understand the need for a bypass because we also need to take Crowsnest Highway into account.

=====

At least Kenora sits “in the middle of” Lake of the Woods so tourism doesn’t get hit hard outside of Covid-19. Lol, when I drove east, I saw lots of Manitoban license plates.

For Lloydminster, yea business relocation should be the answer (though the government should chip in a bit too).

[Dengler Avenue]

I just checked my email and realized that the people from B.C. MTI actually tried to schedule a meeting with me. I am going to reply. Who else got an invitation? How do I prepare for this lolol? Also the scheduled meeting time is 5:30 - 6 pm. Do I assume PST?

[dmuzika]

Originally Posted by craner

[/B]
Yes and now they are working on getting rid of all the traffic signals on the Yellowhead through Edmonton - good job ‘Chuck! Wish we could do that with the TCH #1 through Cowtown.

16 Ave is a lost cause, but Glenmore Trail/Hwy 560 at least has the ROW to be a freeway from the Stoney Tr W to Langdon - maybe realign the TCH?

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

For Yellowhead Highway though, I hope AB and SK can figure out what to do to bypass Lloydminster. Edson and Hinton are peanuts in comparison.

Alberta has the ROW in place for those bypasses, all internally designated as Hwy 16X. The Lloydminster bypass would pass south of town, http://www.transportation.alberta.ca...LloydPlans.pdf. Saskatchewan doesn't have anything on their website on if/how the bypass would rejoin TCH 16, but one would hope it's been studied. Timelines for construction? That's a whole different discussion.

[dmuzika]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Yea, so for me, (lol speaking as an armchair “engineer”), building a bypass where the current alignment could have been used is wasteful. If I were in charge, I’d have ordered all the buildings around the intersection of AB-16A and Calahoo Road in Spruce Grove torn down and put a single-point interchange there. In fact, in that case, Yellowhead Highway wouldn’t even have been realigned in the first place. Having 2 freeways 3 km apart is simply ridiculous.

I think the issue was more about what happened once the highway arrived in Edmonton. The original 1963 METS (Metro Edmonton Transportation Study) proposed a series of freeways that would have gone into and encircled downtown Edmonton, and paved portions of the river valley and some of its ravines. One leg followed the MacKinnon Ravine from downtown to 100 Ave/Stony Plain Rd while another leg continued east along present-day Baseline Road, one can guess it o0likely would have been Hwy 16 if it was ever built. The freeways were killed in the late 1960s/early 1970s and Yellowhead Trail was constructed late 1970s/early 1980s, so my guess is a bypass was deemed more practical. If you drive through Stony Plain & Spruce Grove now, there's about 10 traffic signals on Hwy 16A so it's hardly a freeway.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by dmuzika

16 Ave is a lost cause, but Glenmore Trail/Hwy 560 at least has the ROW to be a freeway from the Stoney Tr W to Langdon - maybe realign the TCH?

Apparently the province plans on using Highway 901 as the new alignment for the TransCanada. I think the goal is to turn that highway into a freeway. If you look at a map 901 connects in with the 201 so I imagine the province will co-sign the 201 until it hooks up with the existing TransCanada by Canada Olympic Park. The province will likely have to expand the southern portion of the 201 so it has eight lanes from the SE corner up to Canada Olympic Park. People will be confused as hell as stretches of that road will probably have four different names.

There's no timeline that I know of but I don't think it would be that difficult of a project to build. A major interchange around Strathmore would need to be built and one at Highway 24. Other interchanges might be needed but I can't see the number being that high. My guess is that they could do the project for about $1.5 billion in today's dollars.

[dmuzika]

Originally Posted by Corndogger

Apparently the province plans on using Highway 901 as the new alignment for the TransCanada. I think the goal is to turn that highway into a freeway. If you look at a map 901 connects in with the 201 so I imagine the province will co-sign the 201 until it hooks up with the existing TransCanada by Canada Olympic Park. The province will likely have to expand the southern portion of the 201 so it has eight lanes from the SE corner up to Canada Olympic Park. People will be confused as hell as stretches of that road will probably have four different names.

There's no timeline that I know of but I don't think it would be that difficult of a project to build. A major interchange around Strathmore would need to be build and one at Highway 24. Other interchanges might be needed but I can't see the number being that high. My guess is that they could do the project for about $1.5 billion in today's dollars.

It would be interesting to see if the 901/22X alignment is ever built. It was originally shelved as taking 22X and the West Ring Road was thought too much of a Calgary bypass for the TCH mainline (the argument at the time being that Calgary is as much a destination as it is in need of a bypass). Expanding Hwy 901 through the Sik Sika Nation would be a hard sell, especially since there are alternatives including the existing alignment that currently bypasses the nation.

There is a bypass proposed around Strathmore, linking it to Hwy 560/Glenmore Trail could be an alternative and also better serve Calgary-bound traffic. The tricky part could be Class 6 dangerous goods, which are prohibited on the Glenmore Causeway, though Stoney Trail could take care of that.

[Corndogger]

Originally Posted by dmuzika

It would be interesting to see if the 901/22X alignment is ever built. It was originally shelved as taking 22X and the West Ring Road was thought too much of a Calgary bypass for the TCH mainline (the argument at the time being that Calgary is as much a destination as it is in need of a bypass). Expanding Hwy 901 through the Sik Sika Nation would be a hard sell, especially since there are alternatives including the existing alignment that currently bypasses the nation.

There is a bypass proposed around Strathmore, linking it to Hwy 560/Glenmore Trail could be an alternative and also better serve Calgary-bound traffic. The tricky part could be Class 6 dangerous goods, which are prohibited on the Glenmore Causeway, though Stoney Trail could take care of that.

Another problem with using Glenmore would be the cost to upgrade certain sections to true freeway standards so the speed limit could be 100 or 110. That along with the dangerous goods issue is probably why the current plan is to use 901. As far as I'm concerned they would still need to upgrade the existing road so there's a more direct route into the "middle" of Calgary. My preference would be to divert the #1 into Glenmore. As you said dangerous goods could use 201 to avoid the causeway. The southerly route could be signed as 101 and used for people who want to bypass the city when going west or east. For shippers it would be a lot faster than having to come where the existing #1 intersects the 201 and then having to go half way around the city.

If any of the above gets done in my lifetime I'll be way too old to care. Would be nice if they started now just to create jobs and improve the transportation network in the region.