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Old Posted Jul 11, 2020, 1:05 AM
ArchGuy1 ArchGuy1 is offline
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Hagia Sophia to be Converted Back to a Mosque

Turkish President Erdogan has issued a decree that the Hagia Sophia in Istanbul will be converted back to a mosque after a court ruling declared the building's conversion to a museum in the 1930's illegal. This comes despite international warnings not to convert the Hagia Sophia back to a mosque and the building is popular for both Christians and Muslims. When the monumental building was first built, it was used as a Byzantine church until the Ottoman invasion in 1453. Then the structure became a mosque and a symbol of Ottoman religious power until 1935 when it became a museum under Kemal Ataturk who was the founder of the modern Turkish Republic. UNESCO has threatened to withdraw the building's status as a World Heritage Site and the decision to convert the building back to a mosque is likely to cause tensions with the Eastern Orthodox Church. The Council of State also cancelled the 1934 decision that turned the Hagia Sophia into a museum. It is interesting to see how everything plays out.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aljaze ... 19431.html
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Old Posted Jul 14, 2020, 3:56 PM
McBane McBane is offline
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If it were a European museum being converted into a church, I wonder if there'd be more hoopla.
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Old Posted Jul 15, 2020, 11:04 PM
Crawford Crawford is online now
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That's really sad. Also stupid that they're removing the biggest tourist attraction in the country.

Too bad the world is currently full of idiot tinpot dictators. Isn't populism grand?
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Old Posted Jul 17, 2020, 4:33 AM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Ridiculous, so glad we visited before they fuck it up again. Haghia Sophia is one of the most important buildings in the entire world, and it was not built to be a mosque.
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  #5  
Old Posted Aug 4, 2020, 2:35 PM
flash110 flash110 is offline
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It was built by slaves for the christian church, in the mean time, the same christian church ravaged the city and after a few centuries the muslims follow suit.

Nothing against true principles of religions but the people who have some power will use anything for greed and clinch to that power but in these days, religion is not enough even in the muslim world, sooner or later people will boot Erdogan if he´s not able to give prosperity and stability
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Old Posted Aug 4, 2020, 3:51 PM
Vlajos Vlajos is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flash110 View Post
It was built by slaves for the christian church, in the mean time, the same christian church ravaged the city and after a few centuries the muslims follow suit.

Nothing against true principles of religions but the people who have some power will use anything for greed and clinch to that power but in these days, religion is not enough even in the muslim world, sooner or later people will boot Erdogan if he´s not able to give prosperity and stability
Wtf? Everyone had slaves in 600 AD. Pagans, Christians, Hindus, etc. How did the Christian Church ravage Constantinople?
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Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 8:53 AM
flash110 flash110 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlajos View Post
Wtf? Everyone had slaves in 600 AD. Pagans, Christians, Hindus, etc. How did the Christian Church ravage Constantinople?
Not denying it was a common practice back then but that´s the way it was and the way most of those glorious buildings were built, it was not just art and ingenuity.

"The Sack of Constantinople occurred in April 1204 and marked the culmination of the Fourth Crusade. Crusader armies captured, looted, and destroyed parts of Constantinople, the capital of the Byzantine Empire"

The french man who was sent by the pope among others to lead the crusades and who also led the sacks and atrocities to the city and its christian inhabitans was crowned in the same Hagia Sophia as emperor of Constantinople, so for me if they want to adore Allah or God in that place is not as relevant as the background of people using religion and believers to their own benefit and greed

Last edited by flash110; Aug 5, 2020 at 9:20 AM.
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Old Posted Aug 5, 2020, 11:51 PM
mrnyc mrnyc is online now
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way to dismantle ataturk's hard modernization work erdo guy.

last time time we went to turkey we were the first usa plane allowed back in after the okey dokey'd airport bombing and then the last plane out before the fake coup attempt.

so yeah, erdogan is not on my good side anyway.

and then there is this from 2019:

Washington - President Donald Trump emerged from hours of talks with Recep Tayyip Erdoğan on Wednesday to declare himself a "big fan" of Turkey's strongman leader.

dipshits.
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  #9  
Old Posted Aug 18, 2020, 5:00 AM
YegFan YegFan is offline
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What about all the mosques in Spain that were converted to cathedrals....that's how things go...
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  #10  
Old Posted Aug 20, 2020, 7:42 AM
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Oberhafenjunge Oberhafenjunge is offline
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I think the point is getting missed here!
This is not a discussion about converting a religious building into another religious building with all the moral and ideologic concerns about it. It's not about a Church that gets a Mosque. That days are over and the building we have today is the heritage of being a church hat has been transformed into a mosque already.
The discussion we are having now is a discussion about a secularized building getting transformed into a mosque again!
That a museum open to everybody which tried to preserve the cultural heritage of byzantine AND the ottoman transformation now is getting a religious use again and faces some constrains!

What about all the byzantinic-christian mosaics that have been unveiled and restored over the last decades? are they to be hidden because they are inappropriate in a mosque but must be preserved due to questions of heritage-preservation? What about the precious stone floor with the marble omphalion, now covered up again by carpets due to the mosque usage.
What about visitors and what are they allowed to visit and perceive of the building which consists of multi-cultured marks of history?

That is the kind of questions we have to ask.
To blame crusaders or ottoman conquerors or to discuss the moral implications of transforming an religious building of one kind to another kind is an obsolete duscussion because this is not the case!
We as a secular or multi-religious public just lost open access to an important piece of human heritage. And this heritage was shaped by a church being already transformed to a mosque and later opened to the public as a museum due to its universal importance!
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Old Posted Aug 23, 2020, 5:27 PM
whatnext whatnext is online now
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Erdogan is acting belligerently towards Greece and threatens peace in the region. Europe should push the Turks back into Asia Minor and reclaim Constantinople.
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