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  #881  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 12:11 AM
Porfiry Porfiry is offline
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Originally Posted by WBC View Post
What do you guys think of electric bikes. I've seen a few "zipping" downtown. Are they allowed to use dedicated bake lanes? I am talking about the battery powered bikes, not scooters.
I've seen motorized scooters (Vespas) on the seawall around Yaletown on at least three occasions. Am I correct in assuming that's completely illegal?
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  #882  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 12:22 AM
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there was a helmet law but it got changed because the sihks said they couldn't wear them with their turbans and blah blah blah so it was dropped

most people on bikes that i see are wearing helmets - the tourists on rented bikes less so
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  #883  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 1:58 AM
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Even though I choose to wear one myself on most occasions, I'm not a big fan of helmet laws. They just create another barrier to entry for would-be cyclists. People should be free to judge whether a particular trip requires a helmet or not (e.g. biking day trip vs running an errand down the street).
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  #884  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 5:05 AM
IanS IanS is offline
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Originally Posted by racc View Post
Then pedestrians and drivers should be required to wear helmets as well. They suffer more head injuries than cyclists do. Maybe we should all just wear bubble wrap from head to toe.
So, if there are two potentially dangerous activities and we do not take steps to alleviate one of them, then we shouldn't take steps to alleviate the other?

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Lets focus on preventing crashes, not making crashes a bit safer.
Let's do both.
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  #885  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 5:20 AM
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You guys sound like my mom.
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  #886  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 5:45 AM
deasine deasine is offline
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Originally Posted by Porfiry View Post
I've seen motorized scooters (Vespas) on the seawall around Yaletown on at least three occasions. Am I correct in assuming that's completely illegal?
Definitely illegal.

As for the helmet rule, it is shown that the number of accidents in North America is significantly more (relative to) that the number of accidents in Europe. Why? Well driving habits aren't really the answer: there are bad drivers everywhere, though there are quite a few here. But the answer is because there are more cycling facilities in Europe.
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  #887  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 8:15 AM
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Wearing helmets isn't so much about health care costs as it's about liability in the event of an accident.

It's not about decreasing cost on the taxpayer, as in the end it's probably not that much. It's about protecting individuals.

What happens if a driver clips a bicyclist wearing a helmet vs not wearing a helmet? Both are the driver's fault for causing the accident, but in one the liability he has for covering the losses of victim is less.

We can talk about the cost of healthcare, but even in an extreme scenario, we are talking about $1 million in health care expenditures. But that pales in comparison on the loss of productivity to individuals involved in the accident and even to society. The loss in quality of life can never be covered by publicly funded healthcare. The taxpayer will do what it can to make you not sick, but the taxpayer can't make you whole again.

You might decide to put your life up to fate by not wearing a helmet, but when you are involved in an accident that's totally not your fault, do you really think you can successfully sue to cover your expenses and maintain your standard of living? Can you really place all blame on someone else for your injuries when you made the personal decision to not wear adequate protection?

My auto insurance might have $3 million personal injury liability, but do you think ICBC is going to jump at the chance to pay that out to someone not wearing a helmet? It's similar to jaywalking; how much compensation is a jay walker entitled to? If you wear stiletto heels on an clearly icy sidewalk, is the property owner liable for your stupidity? If you don't wear a baseball helmet and you get beaned in the head, is the pitcher liable?

That's what the bicycle helmet law tries to accomplish, it puts all bicyclists on even legal ground when they are injured. If all bicyclists are equally as safe as possible, then all are entitled to the same level of compensation for their injuries. But if some are safer than others, then some will be more deserving of being compensated than others.

I don't mind paying healthcare expenses for people who've made bad choices, but that's as far as my compassion goes. If you decided to not limit your potential of injury and get in an accident, then you have decided to live with a life full of brain trauma with no help or compensation (if you're lucky enough to survive).
In some off hand way what you are saying is related to the cost of giving medical attention to someone.

Example you have two different people who are cycling. One is wearing a helmet the other is not. Both get hit by a car in different incidents. The driver of the car is at fault in both cases. The guy with the helmet has few broken bones, while the guy without the helmet not only has the broken bones but major head trauma.

ICBC through the driver's insurance covers the cost of both cyclists injuries. Of course the person without the helmet who had the head trauma is going to require more extensive medical help. Thus a higher medical bill.

So the insurance companies notice this and ask the government to put in a manadatory helmet law. So that the guy with the major head trauma doesn't show up as often. Thus the insurance company doesn't have such a big medical bill to pay.

Of course if you want to put it under the idea of liability you can. Same crap different pile.
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  #888  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 8:40 AM
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I would like the helmet law to be waived so we can all aim to be like this:

http://www.copenhagencyclechic.com/


by cian ginty


by mikael

This is cool in a old-school way, and you breaka a couple of laws at once:


by hamley foxx
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  #889  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 9:16 AM
cabotp cabotp is offline
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Originally Posted by mezzanine View Post
I would like the helmet law to be waived so we can all aim to be like this:

http://www.copenhagencyclechic.com/


by mikael
I'd crash my bike if I saw something like that

I'm not sure what the land contours are like in Copenhagen. But those bikes look like they are 1-3 speeds. Although I could be wrong. I can say it would be quite difficult to ride that around the city of Vancouver. Unless of course you happened to be in a overly flat area. So if they do bring the bixi program here. Will there be bikes more suited to our somewhat hilly city.

I have a 12 speed and while I can make it I do find it tough at times.
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  #890  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 9:52 AM
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Aerial shots and contour maps make it look as flat as a pancake.
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  #891  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 2:04 PM
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Originally Posted by whatnext View Post
I love to see cyclists tie themselves up in knots rationalizing why they shouldn't have to operate with safety equipment. Forget helmets, what about mandatory lights? Licensing to ensure proper training?
I'm not a cyclist, but what about knee pads, elbow pads, shin guards? Mandatory lights are a good idea, especially in BC. Those friction based ones that run off the front tire seem to work.
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I know that by the same token they will support my campaign to roll back safety standards on automobiles to Model T levels. This will of course drastically lower the cost of automobile ownership, ensuring a new car is within reach of all.
What about mandatory yearly safety checks on cars that cover the whole gamut of things that aren't maintained on cars? I'm sure lots of people would be excited to hear that they must have their car inspected yearly... I bet 25-40% of the cars out there wouldn't pass a basic UK MOT.
Quote:
Also noted is their convenient ignoring of the fact that a collision between two cyclists each going 30 km/h runs the risk of severe injury to both if they're not wearing helmets.
That's probably because realistically speaking, it's not all that common.
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  #892  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 2:07 PM
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Originally Posted by cabotp View Post
I'd crash my bike if I saw something like that

I'm not sure what the land contours are like in Copenhagen. But those bikes look like they are 1-3 speeds. Although I could be wrong. I can say it would be quite difficult to ride that around the city of Vancouver. Unless of course you happened to be in a overly flat area. So if they do bring the bixi program here. Will there be bikes more suited to our somewhat hilly city.

I have a 12 speed and while I can make it I do find it tough at times.
Its possible to ride single speed bikes pretty well everywhere except for the steepest hills in the region. I live at the top of burnaby mountain and i have a lot of bikes. Anyways one time just for kicks I rode my single speed down the hill, up to the top of capitol hill, then turned around and rode back up butnaby mountain. My biggest complaint was that i couldnt get going fast enough on the downhills. Oh, and no, I didn't wear a helmet
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  #893  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 4:17 PM
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FYI, here's a shot of the newly installed traffic diverter at 45th and Clarendon / Elliot. It's purpose is to prevent through traffic on 45th so that it's restricted to local use, thus making it more viable as a bike route.

I've mixed opinions about this as when driving I used to make left turns onto 45th to access my house. Now I have to reroute via Nanaimo. It's nice when I'm cycling, though...

"Right Turn Only" signs went in on 45th a few weeks before this diverter was installed. The "Right Turn Only" signs have also been installed at 45th & Rupert, but as of last weekend the diverter wasn't there yet.

My photo, taken a few days ago:

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  #894  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 4:43 PM
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Originally Posted by deasine View Post
Definitely illegal.

As for the helmet rule, it is shown that the number of accidents in North America is significantly more (relative to) that the number of accidents in Europe. Why? Well driving habits aren't really the answer: there are bad drivers everywhere, though there are quite a few here. But the answer is because there are more cycling facilities in Europe.
yeah, and a much greater general awareness of cycling and cyclists. it still blows me away when i'm riding with one of my cousins from south vancouver and they start cussing about cyclists in the street. an attitude quite prevalent among forumers here, it strikes me as cultural, arising from the auto-centric communities we've built, and as a fairly important factor in auto-cycle injuries. vancouver and suburban drivers often just expect the cyclist to yield, and push on as if the cyclist will.

imo, the single most obvious and direct way of overcoming that is just to go ahead and dramatically increase cycling lanes and rights of way. eventually, people will get used to them, and in 10 years, it'll just be taken as granted (even among suburbans) that downtown and the neighborhoods are cycle/pedestrian-oriented.
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  #895  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 7:28 PM
cabotp cabotp is offline
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Originally Posted by twoNeurons View Post
I'm not a cyclist, but what about knee pads, elbow pads, shin guards? Mandatory lights are a good idea, especially in BC. Those friction based ones that run off the front tire seem to work.
The battery operated lights are better now. It takes way to much energy to get those friction style lights going.
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  #896  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 7:29 PM
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Originally Posted by worldwide View Post
Its possible to ride single speed bikes pretty well everywhere except for the steepest hills in the region. I live at the top of burnaby mountain and i have a lot of bikes. Anyways one time just for kicks I rode my single speed down the hill, up to the top of capitol hill, then turned around and rode back up butnaby mountain. My biggest complaint was that i couldnt get going fast enough on the downhills. Oh, and no, I didn't wear a helmet
Damn you must of eaten your spinach that day
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  #897  
Old Posted Jun 23, 2010, 7:32 PM
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Originally Posted by aberdeen5698 View Post
FYI, here's a shot of the newly installed traffic diverter at 45th and Clarendon / Elliot. It's purpose is to prevent through traffic on 45th so that it's restricted to local use, thus making it more viable as a bike route.

I've mixed opinions about this as when driving I used to make left turns onto 45th to access my house. Now I have to reroute via Nanaimo. It's nice when I'm cycling, though...

"Right Turn Only" signs went in on 45th a few weeks before this diverter was installed. The "Right Turn Only" signs have also been installed at 45th & Rupert, but as of last weekend the diverter wasn't there yet.

My photo, taken a few days ago:


Wow that was not there 2 weeks ago. I just cycled down 45th and nothing like that was there.
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  #898  
Old Posted Jun 24, 2010, 12:58 AM
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Originally Posted by cabotp View Post
Damn you must of eaten your spinach that day
Nah, but I was off the smokes at the time, that probably helped.
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  #899  
Old Posted Jun 25, 2010, 8:56 PM
Porfiry Porfiry is offline
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2 wheels = sex appeal
"A dude who cycles to where he needs to go is a hotter prospect than that guy in the Ferrari"
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/...rticle1617714/
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  #900  
Old Posted Jun 26, 2010, 6:28 AM
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Originally Posted by aberdeen5698 View Post
FYI, here's a shot of the newly installed traffic diverter at 45th and Clarendon / Elliot. It's purpose is to prevent through traffic on 45th so that it's restricted to local use, thus making it more viable as a bike route.

I've mixed opinions about this as when driving I used to make left turns onto 45th to access my house. Now I have to reroute via Nanaimo. It's nice when I'm cycling, though...

"Right Turn Only" signs went in on 45th a few weeks before this diverter was installed. The "Right Turn Only" signs have also been installed at 45th & Rupert, but as of last weekend the diverter wasn't there yet.
Nice to see the gormless crew at City Hall get raked over the coals by residents for the idiotic design of this tonight on Global. By replacing the stop signs they've actually made it a more dangerous crossing for pedestrians and bikes, not to mention more of a freeway. I noticed a similarly idiotic "island" in Kerrisdale on 41st, which forces vehicle traffic into a slalom like dodge around the barricades. Well done, Mayor Moonbeam!
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