Building Boom Set to Vault Toronto Past Chicago in Skyscraper Rankings

[craigs]

Here's Wikipedia's list of urban areas by population. New York's is more populous than Mexico City's.

[Northern Light]

Originally Posted by craigs

Here's Wikipedia's list of urban areas by population. New York's is more populous than Mexico City's.

If you follow the link you cited, you will see there are 2 methods of ranking, the default does suggest NYC is larger than Mexico, but if you click on the ranking system to the right, it shows Mexico City is larger than NYC.

Which is to say, they are relatively close, and it will depend on where you draw lines.

[Razor]

As a metric, I would throw in headquarters. I don't know about Mexico City tbh , but NYC is one of the epicenters of the planet in this regard. For both the world, as well as the States.

[dc_denizen]

let's give chicago skyline some better representation than that one pic

Chicago Skyline at Sunset by timku, on Flickr

[Gresto]

^That's one of the best Chicago shots I have seen.

[dc_denizen]

^ if you look at flickr, there are usully around 99 pics of same tired lake-front and sears tower northward views, and 1-2 pics with new and interesting angles which really illuminate the city and not just the tallest buildings

eg

A panoramic view to the west and north, from the 80th floor of Vista by YoChicago, on Flickr

If there's one thing that Toronto absolutely does better, it's collect high rise photography of itself from new and intersting angles (and make these pictures freely available)

btw original of above pic is 15000x7500 pixels

[memph]

Originally Posted by Nouvellecosse

My post was about the claim of "towers-in-the-park" and a decentralised skyline and had nothing to do with the article including proposals or not considering variations in height so none of this is relevant in a potential rebuttal. And I was so confident I was correct in the ratio of 150m+ buildings downtown vs elsewhere I went to the diagrams section and looked it up. If you search completed+ u/c Toronto highrises minimum 150m there are 102 results. I found 8 that are outside central Toronto. That's just under 8%. I'm sure if you counted Mississauga it would be higher but that isn't in Toronto, and based on the numbers cited it doesn't seem to be included in the article analysis.

I don't know what prompts you to make claims about Toronto with such confidence and certainty ("certainly more than 10%") when you clearly don't have the knowledge base to justify it.

Including proposed buildings, I found 30 out of 195 over 150m outside of downtown Toronto. Mainly in Humber Bay Shores, Scarborough Centre, Yonge & Eglinton and Yonge & St. Clair. Still, those were mostly in the 150-200m range, the tallest towers have always been getting built and proposed in downtown Toronto.

Anyways, although I agree that proposed buildings aren't guaranteed to get build, and defined and tracked differently depending on jurisdiction, in Toronto's case, the large number of proposals shows that investors believe Toronto's boom skyscraper boom will continue. And based on the number under construction, and typical timelines, Toronto will overtake Chicago in 150m+ building counts some time around the end of the decade.

Because Toronto allows highrises outside the core where supply/demand doesn't require buildings to be as tall, it first overtook Chicago in highrise (30m+) counts, which seems to have happened in the late 60s. Then in the 1970s it overtook Chicago in 50m+ buildings. It should overtake Chicago for 75m+ buildings some time this year.

It took a long time for Toronto to go from having more 50m+ buildings to having more 75m+ buildings, because those are heights that until recently have only been associated with CBD buildings and Toronto's CBD was much smaller so it had a lot of catching up to do, but now that it's caught up, it should only take Toronto one or two more years to catch up on the 100m+ building counts. And then a couple more years to catch up on 125m+ buildings and a couple more to catch up on 150m+ buildings. By that point, the only difference really will be that Chicago's 5-10 tallest buildings are taller than Toronto's.

However, I think by the end of the decade, Toronto's office market will have reached the point where it's ready to build Aon/John Hancock sized office towers. There are increasingly few sites in the prime areas of the CBD near Union Station, and we're already starting to see significant increases in the height of office tower proposals as a result. It's only a matter of time before buildings like 33 Yonge or the NW corner of First Canadian Place or BCE Place 3, or redevelopments of the PoMo buildings on University happen, or the MTCC gets moved to Exhibition Place, or West Harbor Castle's convention centre gets redeveloped, and Toronto gets some 350-400m tall office towers.

[JAYNYC]

Originally Posted by wg_flamip

By some metrics, New York is already North America's second city.

Right.

Be honest. Not even you believe what you typed there.

[craigs]

Originally Posted by Northern Light

If you follow the link you cited, you will see there are 2 methods of ranking, the default does suggest NYC is larger than Mexico, but if you click on the ranking system to the right, it shows Mexico City is larger than NYC.

Which is to say, they are relatively close, and it will depend on where you draw lines.

So a split decision on population, with no clear winner? That's some pretty weak tea if you are arguing New York is "North America's second city."

What else do you have?

[chris08876]

That's a unique shot (post #124). You can almost gather the idea of 3 separate nodes or three skylines all kinda merging into one. Granted its the perspective, but its there if one envisions it.

[cjreisen]

Originally Posted by wg_flamip

By some metrics, New York is already North America's second city. Even if you don't buy that, I'd find it hard to argue Mexico City doesn't blow LA, Chicago, Toronto at al. out of the water by a long shot.

Ladies and gentleman, stupid comment of the decade. Gonna be hard to beat this one, even with 9 years and 11 months to go. Get to work. New York will not in any of our lifetimes ever ever EVER be north america, or the americas at large second city you bafoon.

[Northern Light]

Originally Posted by craigs

So a split decision on population, with no clear winner? That's some pretty weak tea if you are arguing New York is "North America's second city."

What else do you have?

I have nothing else, as I wasn't making any argument about New York's status.

I was merely clarifying the population stat.

[Steely Dan]

Originally Posted by dc_denizen

If there's one thing that Toronto absolutely does better, it's collect high rise photography of itself from new and intersting angles (and make these pictures freely available)

i can't speak to the representation of toronto's skyline on Flickr, but it's not that hard to find new and interesting angles of the chicago skyline there.



Skyline from the south by Jonathan Lurie, on Flick



Chicago Harbor Lighthouse by Daniel/Dan Eidsmoe, on Flick



Belmont Harbor, Chicago, Illinois by Daniel/Dan Eidsmoe, on Flickr



(2.1.19)-Chiberia_Aerials-WEB-24 by Nick Ulivieri, on Flickr



ASDA NLC Chicago by MinJae Kim, on Flickr



Chicago Flatiron by Matt Hucke, on Flickr



191028_Campus_Aerials-7454 by Loyola University Chicago Quinlan School of Business, on Flickr



Foggy night at 360 Chicago by Kenny C Photography, on Flickr

[Centropolis]

is that milwaukee av running down and to the left, there? i think of the wicker park flatiron building as being huge and kind of far from downtown but im guessing thats it basically in the center?

[Centropolis]

edit: i guess they call another building on that intersection the flatiron but this is what im talking about


bloximages.chicago2.vip.townnews.com

all of the places i used to hang out around there and further up the blue line are probably gone.

[Centropolis]

a view FROM that building once again highlighting the warped sense of space that the chicago skyline gives everything


https://cdn.vox-cdn.com

same general intersection:

wikipedia.com

[Steely Dan]

^ it's colloquially called the coyote building, but it's now been turned into a hotel called The Robey.

for scale, it's just over 3 miles NW of the sears tower.

[mrnyc]

^ now THAT is one groovy view -- good find i dig it!

[Centropolis]

i completely missed this shot you posted above! 100% my favorite view and angle of chicago, which for some people might seem like the back yard shot but to me is the "real" view of the skyline.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/matthucke/45788183122/

[niwell]

Oh cool, good to know that building has been fully renoed / reoccupied! 2019 was the first year I haven't gone to Chicago in quite a while, so I have watched it come along over the years. Stayed just up the street from there many times, though ended up going to other areas after it became just a bit too gentrified.