Atlantic Highways Thread

[Smevo]

Originally Posted by Dmajackson

NSTIR has an information page up for the Port Hastings Roundabout project. This $5 million project will replace the rotary with a modern roundabout, street changes, and new storage lane for the Canso Canal Swing Bridge. The intersection is one of the most important in Nova Scotia since it is the only connection to Cape Breton Island from the mainland and it is where Highway 104 (TCH), Highway 105 (TCH), Trunk 19, and Trunk 4 meet. Construction will begin later this year.

NSTIR - Port Hastings Roundabout

The video explains the project well. Interesting side note apparently there are about 60 roundabouts in Nova Scotia. Many were built by the province as part of larger highway construction projects.

There are some tweaks I'd be tempted to suggest, but it's still better than what's there now.

I knew the space between the access from Trunk 4 and exit to Hwy 105 would be very tight, and will probably be the most common site of sideswipes on this roundabout. I'm not a huge fan of the slip lanes NSTIR adds to some of these roundabouts (they had one in the proposal for Grand Lake Rd/Hwy 125 in Sydney which was scrapped), but in this case I see their value. I do question why the Trunk 4/Hwy 105 slip lane has to be so close to the roundabout and so much of a hairpin. It seems keeping the existing access here would be a better design. I'd also be more inclined to move the Old Victoria Rd intersection to the access east of the church to reduce potential congestion near the roundabout.

With all that said, overall this is definitely an improvement and should work decently well under most circumstances.

[Dengler Avenue]

Is it easy to blast rocks in the Appalachians for road construction?
Some comparison:
A large part of Ontario and Quebec is covered by Canadian Shield, which is some of the oldest formations on Earth, so it's very hard to blast rocks there. In return, though, we get a (literally) rock solid foundation for road base. That's one extreme of the spectrum.
On the other end of the spectrum, we find the Rockies. Those are sedimentary rocks so stability is a huge issue. On the other hand, it also means that it's easy to blast rocks there (though of course one must be mindful not to blast more than planned, lol).
With those 2 comparisons in mind, where do the Appalachians stand in terms of this spectrum?
I've tried to look this up but the information is surprisingly hard to come by.

[MonctonRad]

I am no geologist but, the only place in the Maritimes dominated by hard granitic rock is along the Atlantic coastal areas of Nova Scotia. Anytime you dig a foundation in Halifax, you need dynamite (more or less).

Elsewhere, including the true Appalachians in northwestern NB, the Caledonia Highlands in the south of the province, the Cobequid Mountains in northern NS and the Cape Breton Highlands, the mountainous regions are ancient igneous cratons and/or sedimentary, and are more unstable.

The central portions on the maritimes are dominated by the Maritime Plain with thick clay like soils and podzols. Soils in the Annapolis Valley can be quite sandy in places.

[Dengler Avenue]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

I am no geologist but, the only place in the Maritimes dominated by hard granitic rock is along the Atlantic coastal areas of Nova Scotia. Anytime you dig a foundation in Halifax, you need dynamite (more or less).

So crews currently working on Burnside Connector probably need to blast granites then.

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

Elsewhere, including the true Appalachians in northwestern NB, the Caledonia Highlands in the south of the province, the Cobequid Mountains in northern NS and the Cape Breton Highlands, the mountainous regions are ancient igneous cratons and/or sedimentary, and are more unstable.

Okay. From the sound of it, Appalachians are closer to the Rockies on that spectrum that I mentioned then. This may also explain why bridging the 40 km gap in QC-A85 costs $947M (with the whole thing "from end to end" costing upwards of $2B in today's $ value), averaging ~$23.7M/km. Holy smokes, even building a divided freeway in the Shields may not be that expensive...
I guess that freeway bridge over Straight of Canso will only exist in my mind then.

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

The central portions on the maritimes are dominated by the Maritime Plain with thick clay like soils and podzols. Soils in the Annapolis Valley can be quite sandy in places.

...
All of a sudden, it sounds like roadbuilding is hard any- and every-where in Canada.

[Smevo]

Admittedly almost all of my experience is within southern Alberta, but it does include a range of soils, including sedimentary bedrock, glacial till, lacustrine clay (from low plasticity to high plasticity), silts and sands. There are definitely some soils that are better under roads than others, but pretty much all of them have challenges with them.

High silt and sand contents are typically unstable under dynamic loading. High plastic clays can swell or contract depending on their natural moisture state in the area compared to the moisture content in the constructed material. Glacial till can run a spectrum of properties, and bedrock requires blasting.

Some of these can be very good road sub-bases if they're treated properly during construction, others you basically have to deal with what's there, sometimes adding geotextile synthetic fabrics and grids to strengthen them, and/or subdrains to reduce the amount of groundwater entering moisture susceptible materials. Geotextiles are usually used in combination with added structural base materials (manufactured gravels). On rare occasion, a cement is added to the soil to react with the moisture to stabilize the soil, though I've personally never been on a job where this was used.

When you deal with a very challenging material successfully, it can be very rewarding, even though nobody in the public really knows what went into it. When it's a material where you have to take what you get, it's ends up with you feeling a bit defeated and wondering if there was more that could be done, even though you know the budget wouldn't allow any more.

About your twinned bridge across the Strait of Canso, it's probably not impossible with enough money, but I agree with you that it likely will never happen due to the financial constraints that NSTIR would have to deal with on something like that. It is something I think should be prioritized in some elevated twinned form, due to the economic benefits to the area (and Newfoundland) that a better road connection to the island (and in turn the ferry) would help realize. In my personal opinion, because of the ferry, it's more than just a regional or provincial issue.

[Dengler Avenue]

I thought about tolling the bridge, much like what was done with Cobequid Pass. The thing is, the bridge has to be very high to allow cargo ships to pass underneath. Then, on the side of Cape Breton, it’s silts. Now that I know that silts are unstable, I’m starting to doubt that even tolls would recuperate 80% of the cost…
LoL, it’s like us talking about tunnelling 4 lanes of B.C.-1 here and there.

[Smevo]

Someone more involved than I would have to figure that out, I only have a vague memory of where the bridge would land on the CB side, but that could be fixed potentially with mechanically stabilized embankments (MSE) or reinforced retaining walls, at least in theory. Depending on the location of loads and slope stability, that may not even be needed, but again that all depends on a much more technical review of the area.

Given that many of the silts I've dealt with are on the flat plains of the prairies, what I was talking about moreso was road lifespan and rutting potential, which still would increase the cost in the area, but less than if it needed slope reinforcement, which it very well might.

To be honest, when I upload more of the driving videos, you'll see what passes for an "acceptable" road condition on the island, so they'll milk everything they possibly can out of the road's lifespan, even going beyond what would otherwise be considered reasonable, if it's every built.

[Dengler Avenue]

By the way, are thanksgiving holidays still within lobster season? I wanna slip in a trip to Halifax (and to try out A85 when it’s fully opened).
@Smevo I’ll get back to you later on. Sorry our discussion is loaded one so I need to think lol.

[PEI highway guy]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

By the way, are thanksgiving holidays still within lobster season? I wanna slip in a trip to Halifax (and to try out A85 when it’s fully opened).
@Smevo I’ll get back to you later on. Sorry our discussion is loaded one so I need to think lol.

the lobster season in Eastern NN/ South coast of PEI in Northumberland Strait runs from Approx. Aug 10 to Oct 10. Dates vary a day or two year to year.

[NB_ExistsToo]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

By the way, are thanksgiving holidays still within lobster season? I wanna slip in a trip to Halifax (and to try out A85 when it’s fully opened).
@Smevo I’ll get back to you later on. Sorry our discussion is loaded one so I need to think lol.

Pretty much every lobstering district in Atlantic Canada typically follows the pattern - starts in the Spring, ends mid/late Summer.

Only exceptions I know of are ones along the Annapolis/South Shore regions of NS, which start early Fall, ends in Spring.

As for access to having lobsters, that'll never be a problem. A lot of boats will have lobster pounds for storing them and selling whenever they get a desirable price. But lobster prices are sky high right now, probably won't be dropping anytime this year.

[Dengler Avenue]

Work of twinning N.S.-104 is now visible on Google Map Satellite View.

[Dengler Avenue]

I’ve also just noticed that the roundabout at N.S.-4 & Beach Hill Road (Antigonish) is now showing.

[Taeolas]

Not really "Highway" related exactly, but saw an article on the CBC about the planned tear down of one of our covered bridges:

Landmark St. Martins covered bridge to be demolished and replaced

The bridge was built in 1935 and has been closed for several years now, and will finally be torn down this week.

That said, the replacement will be a modern 2-lane covered bridge built to resemble the current bridge.

Personally, I don't know the area so I can't comment much on it, and if trying to save the old bridge was worth it or not. But I did want to comment that I do appreciate the province is building a new covered bridge as the replacement. The rendering shown on the CBC article does make it look like a nice and appropriate replacement.

[magee_b]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

Not really "Highway" related exactly, but saw an article on the CBC about the planned tear down of one of our covered bridges:

Landmark St. Martins covered bridge to be demolished and replaced

The bridge was built in 1935 and has been closed for several years now, and will finally be torn down this week.

That said, the replacement will be a modern 2-lane covered bridge built to resemble the current bridge.

Personally, I don't know the area so I can't comment much on it, and if trying to save the old bridge was worth it or not. But I did want to comment that I do appreciate the province is building a new covered bridge as the replacement. The rendering shown on the CBC article does make it look like a nice and appropriate replacement.

It's great that they are going to do a modern-remake of it.

However, this quote I found puzzling given the fact that they are replacing a wooden covered bridge that was built in 1935 with.... a wooden covered bridge:

"Building such a large structure out of wood is new to New Brunswick and complex in nature," he said.

[Taeolas]

I just skimmed past that line. I figure they're basically saying building a 2 lane wooden covered bridge with all the safety and weight needs of a modern bridge is a new challenge; it would certainly be complex as well since the bridge is at least twice as wide as most covered bridges are.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by Taeolas

I just skimmed past that line. I figure they're basically saying building a 2 lane wooden covered bridge with all the safety and weight needs of a modern bridge is a new challenge; it would certainly be complex as well since the bridge is at least twice as wide as most covered bridges are.

And taller too, since I'm sure they are anticipating increased RV traffic now that the Fundy Trail/Fundy Park connector is complete.

[Taeolas]

Originally Posted by MonctonRad

And taller too, since I'm sure they are anticipating increased RV traffic now that the Fundy Trail/Fundy Park connector is complete.

Definitely taller. Looks like the original bridge was 4m and it looks like the new one will be 5.0m. A very quick googling says the average RV height tends to be 4.1m or so; so that should be big enough.

Found the Government Press Release with the rendering of the new bridge:

The entrances are more squared off as well, which should help prevent clipping with RVs and trailers as well.

I'd say the new bridge is going to be almost twice as tall as the original, just due to the extra height of the driving lanes, and having 2 driving lanes instead of one.

[darkharbour]

I'm thrilled they are building a new covered bridge in the province, because for years we have had old bridges get damaged and not be replaced by covered designs (like the recent loss of the Hammond River bridge). For a small increase in cost, we would gain a lot of cultural and tourism benefits from maintaining them as part of NB's image.

[MonctonRad]

Originally Posted by darkharbour

I'm thrilled they are building a new covered bridge in the province, because for years we have had old bridges get damaged and not be replaced by covered designs (like the recent loss of the Hammond River bridge). For a small increase in cost, we would gain a lot of cultural and tourism benefits from maintaining them as part of NB's image.

Agreed. There are only a couple of dozen of these iconic structures left.

[L'homard]

RVs and tour buses have been using this bridge since the parkway opened until the original bridge closed, so I'm not too sure why it has to be taller but as long as they are replacing it with a covered wooden bridge wide enough for two lanes of traffic then fine and dandy.
This is arguably one of the most important covered bridges. It is the only place where you can capture two covered bridges in one photo.